Help better Imaging needed-receiver

[bipper]

Ok so I have silver speaker wire, psb stratus gold speakers, sony es cd player but the sound is flat, is my yamaha receiver ( 722 model about $400new). Please recommend a receiver in the $500 range Onkyo, Denon, etc....

[Lensman]

Ok so I have silver speaker wire, psb stratus gold speakers, sony es cd player but the sound is flat, is my yamaha receiver ( 722 model about $400new). Please recommend a receiver in the $500 range Onkyo, Denon, etc....

Are you certain your speaker placement or room acoustics isn't responsible for the problem?

[JSE]

Ok so I have silver speaker wire, psb stratus gold speakers, sony es cd player but the sound is flat, is my yamaha receiver ( 722 model about $400new). Please recommend a receiver in the $500 range Onkyo, Denon, etc....

Are you saying you need a different receiver to improve imaging? Imaging comes from speakers, not a receiver. Speaker placement can have negative and positive effects on imaging so maybe this is the route to experiment with before spending money on a new receiver. Unless you just looking for an excuse to get a new receiver?

JSE

[Woochifer]

The imaging is primarily dictated by the room acoustics and the speakers. The receiver, source components, and cabling have far less effect. If you feel that you need to "fix" something, start with those two factors and work from there.

And when you mention flat sound, what are you comparing it to? And have you tried any other components in your room? If you have a large room or one that's overly dampened, then swapping out the receiver won't matter one bit.

[bipper]

thanks for all the advice
does anyone have comments about yamaha recievers regarding their sound? I have heard several onkyo amps and they sound more tinny, less bass but sound more real.

My original questions stems from the fact that I have heard from several supposed audiophiles that yamaha receivers ($300-$500) have a flatter sound.

thanks for your patience

[Jim Clark]

I have an older Yamaha (RX-V660) and I would have to agree that on the issue of 2 channel stereo the sound is flat. I can't attribute that to a lack of imaging as two channel stereo is the first aspect I deal with before setting it up for HT. I would actually describe it as dull, lifeless, the opposite of dynamic. I wouldn't say that my opinion of Onkyo is much different. For the record, I have not heard all of the models available and I haven't heard any of the newer crop of Yamaha. While both brands have their strengths, to me music doesn't seem to be one of them.

On the other hand, I've had pleasant experiences with both Denon (I've owned two-3300 and still use my 3802) and have owned and was impressed with Marantz (7100). I would heartily recomend that you take a serious listen to both brands in your own home. It's not that hard to find a store with a decent return policy if you can't find a store willing to lend you a demo unit before hand. Just be sure to level match and if possible invite your wife, gf or buddy over to help you by changing hookups so that you don't know which one you are listening to. I'd also suggest you include the Yamaha in the trial. Hey, you just never know.

Have fun,
jc

[Woochifer]

thanks for all the advice
does anyone have comments about yamaha recievers regarding their sound? I have heard several onkyo amps and they sound more tinny, less bass but sound more real.

My original questions stems from the fact that I have heard from several supposed audiophiles that yamaha receivers ($300-$500) have a flatter sound.

thanks for your patience

Goes to show you how perception becomes reality in the audio world. Yamaha's reputation is that their receivers sound "bright".

Personally, I've never noted that, then again I've never noted huge differences in performance between most comparably priced receivers either. The differences are more typically audible in the setup parameters and when the DSP modes are switched on.

When you note that Onkyo amps sound more "real" is that listening done with everything run in the default modes, or with some setting changed? The bass levels should not differ between receivers by default, so you need to double check and make sure that things like the bass management settings, the LFE level, the subwoofer output, etc. are set up identically before making that kind of judgment call.

[topspeed]

My original questions stems from the fact that I have heard from several supposed audiophiles
Never believe what anyone else says regarding how something "sounds". The reason? We all hear differently. We all have different room acoustics. We all have different taste and priorities in music. Your brain is telling you that your rig sounds flat merely from the suggestion of others. As Wooch noted, most people actually find Yammie to be "bright."

It doesn't appear that imaging is your problem. Moreso, it sounds like your rig isn't very engaging (for lack of a better word). In other words, you aren't drawn into the music like you should be. If this is the case, it could be any number of things from speaker placement, room interaction, speakers, front end, high tides in Tahiti, whatever. As others have recommended, I'd look into your speaker placement first and perhaps into some room treatments. This is the cheapest and most effective road to better sound. After that, it could very well be your Yammie. Have you tried other amps and noticed any difference? I had the same problem with "lifeless" music from my Denon 3803 and remedied it by adding an external amp. Now, I'm a happy camper :). Borrow some amps from friends or a dealer and see if that helps. Make up your own mind how something sounds. Some people believe there's no difference in amplifiers. See if you agree.

Hope this helps