New Ohm Speakers

[JJohnson]

I am in the process of auditioning speakers for a two channel bedroom type system and have run across the Ohm speaker website. In my price range, I'm interested in the Micro Walsh Tall. I would also consider the Ohm Walsh 100 Mk-2s. The reviews that I find sound good but I don't know how favorably they compare with the other speakers that I have auditioned such as the Paradigm Studio 20 and 40. The Ohms can only be purchased online but they do have a 120 day money back guarantee (less shipping).
What do you think?
Thanks,
Jeff

[cam]

I am in the process of auditioning speakers for a two channel bedroom type system and have run across the Ohm speaker website. In my price range, I'm interested in the Micro Walsh Tall. I would also consider the Ohm Walsh 100 Mk-2s. The reviews that I find sound good but I don't know how favorably they compare with the other speakers that I have auditioned such as the Paradigm Studio 20 and 40. The Ohms can only be purchased online but they do have a 120 day money back guarantee (less shipping).
What do you think?
Thanks,
Jeff
What the hell, I will respond to your question on both sites you posted. A review for a certain speaker is a review done with someone elses ears, not yours. I could give an awesome review right now on a certain product but unless you can audition and see them for yourself with some of your listening material that you know well, then my review means squat. Never ever get swayed into buying something because someone gave it a good review. You were auditioning speakers, keep other peoples reviews especially on speakers that you can't walk into a store and audition yourself different from what you experience.

[Worf101]

But I've been running vintage Ohm's for about 5 years now. I have a set of Walsh F's, Walsh 4's and Walsh 2's. I love them, their look and they way the work. I know Ohm has an "in home trial period". So try them you might like them.

Da Worfster

[Geoffcin]

I am in the process of auditioning speakers for a two channel bedroom type system and have run across the Ohm speaker website. In my price range, I'm interested in the Micro Walsh Tall. I would also consider the Ohm Walsh 100 Mk-2s. The reviews that I find sound good but I don't know how favorably they compare with the other speakers that I have auditioned such as the Paradigm Studio 20 and 40. The Ohms can only be purchased online but they do have a 120 day money back guarantee (less shipping).
What do you think?
Thanks,
Jeff


The "walsh" sound, is kinda like planar in it has devoted owners. Once you own it, you've never going to want to be without it. Ask anyone who owns Ohm. I've heard them, and I could live happily ever after with them. (that's all I need another speaker to obsess over)!

[RGA]

Ask yourself this "If the Paradigm impressed me WHOLLY and transported me to believing it made beautiful music why didn't I want to buy it then and there?"

I think you know the answer to that question and that is why you are hoping for advice on a speaker that will do that for you. The paradigm doesn'ty for me and obviously not for you. I can't say what Ohm will do only you can be the judge of that - but if that was my only option I would take the risk for the price of shipping. You can return them if it's no hassle then try it.

People who like planars tend to like them versus boxed speakers because they don't sound closed in or boxy or narrow. Try my speakers out somewhere - or even the Athena boxes versus the Polk Boxes at Future Shop - you will note that the Athena sounds more vibrant and dynamic that the Polk at nearly 3 times the cost. Both are not high end or the last word in speakers but I would take the $499 Athena over the $1299 polk I heard. And that says a lot.

I would try the Audio Note AX Two at $700.00Cdn. or $549.00US as a starting place to hear a boxed speaker that doesn't give you that impression - it like most Audio Note's project a panel like sound in the midband with incredile microdynamics the almost no other boxed speaker I have heard can match and usually only associated to electrostats but without all the nightmare aspects of owning stats. Very hard to find like Ohm but for the money I think you'll be impressed. Unlike most cheap speakers you don't have to worry about only playing certain genres well.

All speakers get good reviews from someone - means little until you hear them. Try as many as are in your available - if none really move you may as well try the Ohm. I would use them as a last resort because of the shipping - but IMO 95% of what is on the market I personally would not want to listen to for music. If I had not found the company I did I would not have bought speakers and kept what I had because like yo the usual suspects simply sound Banal.

[kexodusc]

Funny you guys brought up the Audio Note AX Two's...
I tried those out at my uncle's place this weekend. He's a massive AN nut (builds their amps and speakers from kits too). My own opinion on the AN K's, and E's has is that they are overpriced for what you get, but they are a rather competent speaker. They have a very sweet midrange, full response, but they lack solid definition in the bass and treble regions that I like. That being said, their exceptional midrange would make them very well suited for many styles of music, and I suspect alot of other serious jazz and blues fans own Audio Note speakers.

The first thing we both noticed about the AX 2's was the overwhelming drop in midrange and bass as soon as you move anywhere off axis. (can you say Baffle Step Compensation? Cheap crossover?) So we tinkered with the toe-in a bit and found that pointed directly at your ears was the best compromise. I use the word compromise because these speakers do not deserve to carry the Audio Note name. I'm not a fan of the somewhat laid back tweeters (Vifa? Scan-speak? man, they look like my Vifa's) in most AN's, but the AX's lacked all trace of detail. And the top end is still quite loud. The only comparably priced speakers we had in the room were the Energy C-3's. The bass was pretty bloated in these, but once you got past that it was clear they offered a more balanced sound. They certainly imaged better and presented a better wider deeper soundstage. I'd fault them for being overly boomy though.

You should try these out and make your own determinations...but don't judge the AX's (especially the AX 1's with that rotten 4" midwoofer) as being indicative of AN's larger speakers.
My own feeling is this was a bad case of AN compromising like so many other companies, entering a new market and price-point, abandoning what go them there. But I don't know how long these have been out, so maybe they just got better with their bigger speakers.

Totem makes some exceptional speakers that I would put on par with AN, Ohm, or Paradigm's Studio series any day. Like the others, they have a few different beliefs that may or may not jive with you.

RGA makes a good point. If the speaker doesn't wow you when you hear it (in a proper setup of course) then you've got look at more speakers, or re-evaluate your expectations for your budget. Good luck.

[Geoffcin]

But I've been running vintage Ohm's for about 5 years now. I have a set of Walsh F's, Walsh 4's and Walsh 2's. I love them, their look and they way the work. I know Ohm has an "in home trial period". So try them you might like them.

Da Worfster

Ohm gives you on trade in. It almost pays to buy a used pair just to trade it in!

[RGA]

Funny you guys brought up the Audio Note AX Two's...
I tried those out at my uncle's place this weekend. He's a massive AN nut (builds their amps and speakers from kits too). My own opinion on the AN K's, and E's has is that they are overpriced for what you get, but they are a rather competent speaker. They have a very sweet midrange, full response, but they lack solid definition in the bass and treble regions that I like. That being said, their exceptional midrange would make them very well suited for many styles of music, and I suspect alot of other serious jazz and blues fans own Audio Note speakers.

The first thing we both noticed about the AX 2's was the overwhelming drop in midrange and bass as soon as you move anywhere off axis. (can you say Baffle Step Compensation? Cheap crossover?) So we tinkered with the toe-in a bit and found that pointed directly at your ears was the best compromise. I use the word compromise because these speakers do not deserve to carry the Audio Note name. I'm not a fan of the somewhat laid back tweeters (Vifa? Scan-speak? man, they look like my Vifa's) in most AN's, but the AX's lacked all trace of detail. And the top end is still quite loud. The only comparably priced speakers we had in the room were the Energy C-3's. The bass was pretty bloated in these, but once you got past that it was clear they offered a more balanced sound. They certainly imaged better and presented a better wider deeper soundstage. I'd fault them for being overly boomy though.

You should try these out and make your own determinations...but don't judge the AX's (especially the AX 1's with that rotten 4" midwoofer) as being indicative of AN's larger speakers.
My own feeling is this was a bad case of AN compromising like so many other companies, entering a new market and price-point, abandoning what go them there. But I don't know how long these have been out, so maybe they just got better with their bigger speakers.

Totem makes some exceptional speakers that I would put on par with AN, Ohm, or Paradigm's Studio series any day. Like the others, they have a few different beliefs that may or may not jive with you.

RGA makes a good point. If the speaker doesn't wow you when you hear it (in a proper setup of course) then you've got look at more speakers, or re-evaluate your expectations for your budget. Good luck.

The AX one is rubbish - It was a mistake to bring out a product that sounds like most everyone elses. (Though to Audio Note's credit they no longer make it) There is no roll off in the highs - their current J and E speakers are rated flat to 19khz -1db and 23khz -6db and for the E 22hz -3db and 16hz -6db. The midrange is their strongest suit. It is important however to get the models with silver wiring and Birch wood.

The AX Two works best in a a corner position with very slight toe in(Soundstage depth will be achieved if not too close to the back wall). The Totrm Mani two is a joke compared to the bigger AN J and or E. Please. Soundhounds had to drop Totem - they'd be laughed out of the store due to their price performance ratio when right there you can get a speaker that actually resmbles music. An appropriate comparison for the AX Two would be the Totem Mite. A fellow teacher (I'm not one yet but soon) has owned the mani's for several years and went to the E. The Mani may be the best speaker Totem makes sound wise but it is clear that side by side it's not surprising they had to drop the company.

I detected no audible problem with the AX Two with baffle cancellation - nor is there any problem with off axis response(cohesion with any speaker using a metal tweeter trying to attain a sonic characteristic match will result in worse results - which is why almost all speakers using the cheap metal tweeters sound terrible - people don't get it they need to hear better than shrill tripe offerred by the mega corps).

In Corners with heavy toe in ALL their speakers will have bass heaviness and loss of presence in the mmidband which I notice on my own speakers - but you would have to be sitting very well off axis - like in the back corners for this to be an issue. AN Also does not require a toe in at all and I would suggest one try that position first. They are designed for corners to virtually eliminate reflected waves clutterring up the sound. other speakers will offer superior FAR off axis results - but if they sound so much worse to start on axis where most people listen that is hardly an advantage.

The AX Two I ran with a basic Rotel integrated and Teac player in a fairly large but narrow room. Speakers in corners toed in and anyone sitting on a 3 person couch would have little problem with the stereo image. There is a pronounced treble compared to the K(Though the K/Spe result with the lower end gear faired wrse than when presented with better equipment) or higher speakers no question but that's mroe because the midrange isn't as full - no speaker this small Is.
But the double bass and lower piano notes are never confused with krall's vocals and don't become smudged running into one another like the the Studio 20V3 which doesn't differentiate instruments very well on a microdynamic level - The subtle soft to loud passages of separate intruments at the same time.

The vocals of the AX Two are presented exceptionally clearly without box thumpiness of speakers like the C3 or the Studio 20V3. The AX Two is not perfect by any stretch - there is a limit to bass depth and volume and they can become a bit hard when pushed (but gee so do all speakers), and you are limited to the presence offerred in the midband and there is a shift to a pronounced top end. After all there is a reason that AN has the K, J and E. Don't expect the world from the AX Two - it has a more hi-fi sound than the bigger models no question - there are limits. But there is certainly a house sound within the vocal band.

PS
AN does not use Vifa in the J or E anymore - these use a custom Foster 1 inch tweeter SEAS 8 inch woofer.

I will be happy to A/B the Studio 20V3 with the AX Two later this week. I figured if it took down the 705 I would not need to bother but I will. The little I heard of the 20V3 very much reminded me of the 100V3. The 100V3 IMO is bad value and frankly a bad speaker for this much money. Marginally better than the monitor series - same kinda sound for a lot more money - no wonder it was difficlt to finally hear them no one wants to carry them because against the Totem $2500 models etc they'd be quickly embarrassed. The V2 IMO are far better because they don't sound hollow or lacking in the lower registers and despite my complaints of a hot treble they seemed more lively and entertaining.

But if you're unlcle hates the AX two's I'd be glad to take em off your hands. I dunno the E did win a blind listening panlel Best Buy award in Hi-fi Choice which means they are excellent but also very exceptional values price wise given the speakers in that $5,000.00US+ price range. And those silly reviewers didn't even position them right.

BTW - not an attack on Totem - but I think their looks seduce people too much and their bass response impresses people more because they're small. The B&W CDM 2Se at $1049Cdn when i auditioned was far more believable than the Model One at $2100.00Cdn. And since then this, I have felt to be the case with all their speakers I've heard. On the other hand this is no insult because they DO provide excellent sound - but if anyone is overprioced for what you get Totem IMO is at the top of the list.

By all means your mileage may vary but this is the way I hear it it is just another opinion among many. So the best advice in the end is to go listen to them directly against the others same room same gear properly set up and hear for yourself. I stand by it.

lastly to the original poster. More people have been listening to Audio Note speakers lately and you can get more info from other people besides me on them at www.audioasylum.com go to the speaker and or general forums or the Audio Note kit forums.

[kexodusc]

How much Audio Note stock do you own? :) I'm not a gonna start a war here...because it's entirely possible (and has been proven) that even the difference in the shape of our ears can impact huge sonic variances.


There is no roll off in the highs - their current J and E speakers are rated flat to 19khz -1db and 23khz -6db and for the E 22hz -3db and 16hz -6db. The midrange is their strongest suit.
Hmmm, surprised to see you quoting specs...there is a very noticeable deterioration in the harmonic overtones, and what I would describe as the decaying frequencies...Now considering there aren't a whole lot of measurements that test speakers for this, and how harmonics are said to affect anywhere from 20-80% of sound, a flat frequency response only tells part of the story. There's tons of cheap speakers that have flat responses (I've built a few)...there's tons of super expensive speakers that measure close to perfrection but sound like crap.


The Mani may be the best speaker Totem makes sound wise but it is clear that side by side it's not surprising they had to drop the company.
I'm sure Audio Note has never, ever been dropped for similar reasons.



I detected no audible problem with the AX Two with baffle cancellation - nor is there any problem with off axis response(cohesion with any speaker using a metal tweeter trying to attain a sonic characteristic match will result in worse results - which is why almost all speakers using the cheap metal tweeters sound terrible - people don't get it they need to hear better than shrill tripe offerred by the mega corps).
Baffle cancellation? Are we talking about the same thing? BTW...Some of the best sounding tweeters in the world are metal (admittedly not Paradigm's)...and Focal, Vifa, Seas make some of them.



The vocals of the AX Two are presented exceptionally clearly without box thumpiness of speakers like the C3 or the Studio 20V3.
Granted, I have limited experience with the v3's, but I certainly didn't detect box thumpiness. I wish they weren't ported, but I think that's a necessary compromise for extended bass response. The AX's have impressive midrange.


PS AN does not use Vifa in the J or E anymore - these use a custom Foster 1 inch tweeter SEAS 8 inch woofer. Which SEAS? I'm coming to learn that most customs are custom "cosmetically" only...wonder if I could clone an AN?


I will be happy to A/B the Studio 20V3 with the AX Two later this week.
Would this really change anything? Does anyone, including you believe the outcome is not predetermined already?


I figured if it took down the 705 I would not need to bother but I will.
Hmmm, the 705 is superior to my ears.


The 100V3 IMO is bad value and frankly a bad speaker for this much money.
Agreed!!! And Paradigm doesn't have the best crossovers...2 kHz? You can buy those anywhere.



But if you're unlcle hates the AX two's I'd be glad to take em off your hands.
Nope, he's more of an Audio Note fanboy than you :) ...but he'll readily admit their limitations...incidentally he got his for $449 USD, though...might be because he's bought tons of AN stuff? Might be indicative of mark-up?



BTW - not an attack on Totem - but I think their looks seduce people too much and their bass response impresses people more because they're small.
I'll give you that to a point, too. But to be fair, the finish isn't actually as costly as you'd think. And I have my doubts the interiors are veneered as well. I'm not a fan of the Mani's, at least not at their retail price...I do like some of their cheaper offerings. The Rainmaker is surprisingly good.



lastly to the original poster. More people have been listening to Audio Note speakers lately and you can get more info from other people besides me on them at www.audioasylum.com go to the speaker and or general forums or the Audio Note kit forums.

Just to add, my comments weren't an attack on Audio Note,who has a huge (and fanatic at times) fanbase...just an attack on what I call their "sell-out" speakers (the AX's). The E's are incredible if you've got the coin, and European drivers are the way to go for the sweet, sweet midbase. But even RGA (who is one of the more experienced and reputable posters here) wouldn't be sold bold as to come out and say that all AN's are the best value speaker on earth in their price categories.

PS: Sorry to hijack the thread!

[Pat D]

Funny you guys brought up the Audio Note AX Two's...
I tried those out at my uncle's place this weekend. He's a massive AN nut (builds their amps and speakers from kits too). My own opinion on the AN K's, and E's has is that they are overpriced for what you get, but they are a rather competent speaker. They have a very sweet midrange, full response, but they lack solid definition in the bass and treble regions that I like. That being said, their exceptional midrange would make them very well suited for many styles of music, and I suspect alot of other serious jazz and blues fans own Audio Note speakers.

The first thing we both noticed about the AX 2's was the overwhelming drop in midrange and bass as soon as you move anywhere off axis. (can you say Baffle Step Compensation? Cheap crossover?) So we tinkered with the toe-in a bit and found that pointed directly at your ears was the best compromise. I use the word compromise because these speakers do not deserve to carry the Audio Note name. I'm not a fan of the somewhat laid back tweeters (Vifa? Scan-speak? man, they look like my Vifa's) in most AN's, but the AX's lacked all trace of detail. And the top end is still quite loud. The only comparably priced speakers we had in the room were the Energy C-3's. The bass was pretty bloated in these, but once you got past that it was clear they offered a more balanced sound. They certainly imaged better and presented a better wider deeper soundstage. I'd fault them for being overly boomy though.

You should try these out and make your own determinations...but don't judge the AX's (especially the AX 1's with that rotten 4" midwoofer) as being indicative of AN's larger speakers.
My own feeling is this was a bad case of AN compromising like so many other companies, entering a new market and price-point, abandoning what go them there. But I don't know how long these have been out, so maybe they just got better with their bigger speakers.

Totem makes some exceptional speakers that I would put on par with AN, Ohm, or Paradigm's Studio series any day. Like the others, they have a few different beliefs that may or may not jive with you.

RGA makes a good point. If the speaker doesn't wow you when you hear it (in a proper setup of course) then you've got look at more speakers, or re-evaluate your expectations for your budget. Good luck.
What?! You mean A-N is not the greatest thing since sliced bread? I am shocked! And after all that RGA has said about them!

Nice midrange. Well, if a speaker doesn't have a good midrange, it's not a good speaker.

I'm surprised that you would find the Energy C-3 to have bloated bass--it seems hardly big enough for that, I should think! Here are the NRC measurements shown on Soundstage.

http://www.soundstagemagazine.com/measurements/energy_connoisseur_c3/

Where would the bloated bass come from? Perhaps if one placed them on a bookshelf . . . how did you have them placed? When I heard them I thought they were a pretty good speaker, though not as neutral on massed strings as I would like. But a pretty good value at the price.

Totem does make some very fine speakers, but I've only heard two models. The Totem Mani-2 is a very fine speaker with really deep, solid bass, but it likes a lot of power. It is also quite expensive, but if you want "that" sound, you pays your money and makes your choice. An the fellow I know who has them likes 'em a lot, and so do I. I heard the Sttaf at some length, too, and it is rather pleasant, but too laid back for me--the highs are quite subdued. It has such a small woofer that I think it's would not have much low frequency power handling, and that was my impression.

Have you heard any of the Paradigm Signature Series? I thought the S2 was a very fine speaker, though I would like to have listened longer. I did listen to the S8 with quite a lot of material and it's a wonderful speaker.

I would like to hear some of the PSB Platinum speakers. Audio Ideas Guide liked them and they measure quite well, though they don't seem as quite as flat as the Stratus Minis--they probably have an even better off axis dispersion, though.

[Buzz Roll]

Check out the Microwalshes. I can see the devotion thing among owners (as with Maggies) happening - but it's not a gimmicky sound. I will not send my pair back (still within the demo time limits), but instead of saying that I will never buy anything again, I'll just say that whatever comes next for me, will not sound like (or probably look like) a box.

Because you can't try them in a store, seek out as many reviews as you can, just for a little info. You're not buying the speakers on someone else's recommendation, you're just trying them out with the money back option. Your ears should be the final judge, in your own home, with your own gear.

[RGA]

kexodusc

I wanted to delete my reply but I went out for dinner and came back and replies abound. One of the reasons they post so little regarding specs is because they tell you so little about the speaker in YOUR room or mine or the dealers. You are probably right that auditioning yet again will serve no purpose because it is inevitable as to what I will say. The 20V3 from what I heard is a speaker I would not be able to live with end of story --- on a budget the AX Two I could.

The problem is this - this is where I start from - same for movies - I have a gutteral response of I loiked that or I don't like that and then later I try to put an intellectual reason behind it. Sometimes like in an Ebert review it works better than other times. By no means are any Audio Note speakers perfect nor are anyone elses for that matter. But because the speaker, t least to me, have made me have a highly passionate response to them I want to focus on the strengths and shy away from weaknesses. I have no doubt that one can get AN speakers for less money - these are list price figures and you should be able to get 10-20% reductions on most any brand.

I also don't want to get into this is better than that - to you the 705 is better to me it's not the case. But both of us have heard them in different rooms with different systems and no doubt different positions and as you note different ears and or tastes. Terry runs Soundhounds here in Victoria and we spent the day listening to several of the brands he sells and he said he can't say anuything bad about his products for obvious reasons - though after listening things we would look at each other an in stereo give the ol Caesar thumbs down to stuff. (But hey he didn't say anything :D ). I asked him why carry these things and sometimes it's because they carry the brand say NAD and sometimes you get a dog from them, othertimes he gave a quick listen at a CES or somewhere and decides to pick something up (like Clear Audio Turntables) but they, he, decide that they can't get it to sound right so they quickly dump them.

There are issues of tough sells and I don't want to single out Totem but because I have followed and been a fan of Totem (recommended them often) I am seeing something different perhaps than some of my Amercian Counterparts where the brand is much more mainstream than it once was. The models selection has increased they have moved to home theater they have lost the dane drivers (and some argue the point that they are making better ones) I dunno the older ones sounded better to me. The High end dealers have or will soon drop the line in our stores. They havbe moved into the big box chains as their premium brand - trouble is they don't really sound better than Energy in those stores largely because they don't sound BIG and they're tougher to drive - and these stores run less than great stereos. The manager at my A&B Sound has brought in several brands as possible replacements. Ie; they're, IMO, in trouble. They're not good enough to justify their price at high end stores like Soundhounds. They're too expensive for A&B Sound --- so the prices have been dropping like a stone In the last 6 months the Arro has dropped $500.00Cdn and the manager told me they still don't sell. The Rainmakler and dreamcatchers by far sell the least of all their home theater. They may in fact be the best they sell for Home theater but A&B needs to sell and they won't carry dead weight. Then where will Totem go? Future Shop - if they do they'll have to pull a Polk and they're not big enough - they would have to drop their prices by half and even then they'd be pricey for Best Buy and Futre Shop.

But enough about them they sound nice but I guess for $1900.00Cdn now for the Staff I would hope to get some midrange - they sound very sub satellite like with treble and bass pronouncements

As for the metal drivers...Well you are quite correct and bring up something I had just realised when you said it. You know I can't recall hearing a smaller speaker maker using Metal SEAS or VIFA drivers. The market flood has been B&W, Paradigm Energy and JBL in my area - none of these use quality drivers from those companies. Perhaps I need someone like you to make a suggestion of an Audio Note sized company or smaller using premium drivers like that to excellent effect.

I will be posting my thoughts later in the week of several speakers - I am unsure how to rate value. It is either something I could listen to or it isn't so one is valuable to me and the other isn't. For instance the Wilson Sophia I could listen to despite some reservations about it's dark quality but it was enjoyable - but it's $16,000.00 and to me is grossly overpriced - but I could live with that sound. The Paradigm 20 May be a good value to some for several reasons but to me I know It would highly irritate me - so it may be a better price or SANELY priced at ~1k and the Sophia isn't $15k better - but bottom line is one I could live with the other I couldn't ---- and it all comes down to the selection of compromises.

You might be surprised that Soundhounds' best selling speaker is the AX Two despite being ugly...with all of the changes they make improving speakers perhaps the version you head is not the one I heard. The AX Two uses a foam surround and what appears to be the K tweeter.

I am not the only person that likes the speaker. Looking back over the other forum several have preffered it to the N805. I'd want another listen to make that assessment to be sure - but to me the fact that it is even being brought up is a compliment to the AX Two. What is he running with them? Terry at Soundhounds claims the speaker should be used in modest systems - it's the only system I have heard it in.

[kexodusc]

Let me make few things clear here. I like the AN K, E, and J...I'll freely admit that the E's whoop anything by Paradigm I've heard, even the Signatures (which in my opinion aren't worth the extra money for the slight improvement they offer over the Studios). I'm not so sure about some their marketing/design philosophies though...By marketing I mean Birch and Silver. Baltic Birch is a great wood to work with for speakers, but compared to MDF, it is almost always a compromise sonically...how big depends on each slap of wood used, but unless you can be absolutely 100% sure that the Birch's density is uniform and the wood is flawless throughout, the cabinets strength couldn't be as good as MDF(though it certainly looks a helluva lot better)...maybe these are treated on the interior though.

The silver wiring, at such short lenghts seems odd to me too. How could this not require the use of silver cables to acheive the "improved performance", if in fact you believe silver does enhance the performance? The wiring would be a few inches at most? Does Audio Note sell exotic cables to go with these? Got to be honest though, I haven't heard the $15K An E's, just the cheaper ones.

Audio Notes have a sort of signature sound to me...probably because of the consistency in their design philosophies. I can understand their appeal. But to compare them to Paradigm or Energy isn't really fair most of the time since AN has always been concentrated in the $800 + category. Paradigm and Energy do most of their business in the entry level stuff. I'm of the opinion that PSB, Paradigm, Energy, and now Athena do the sub-$700 speakers as good as anybody out there. It would sort of be like comparing Ford to Infinity...they both make cars in the $25000 range, but you're hitting Ford's top end where Infinity just starts.

RGA: It is possible you could hear every metal tweeter on earth and not enjoy them. Some people only like silk tweeters or ribbon, or planars etc...I don't can't understand why. Myself, I haven't found any correlation between the material and the performance. There's plenty of crappy tweeters of all sorts of material out there. Most of the time, my suspicion is that even cheap metal or silk tweeters could be alot better with better crossover design, but then you start adding costs to fix a tweeters shortcomings.
I'll have to look into which smaller companies use which drivers. I know Totem uses Peerless drivers and in most of their units, but if memory serves they're almost all textile tweeters. My old Wharfedale Emeralds uses Vifa drivers throughout (though I think they were "custom" jobbies too)...Actually this lead to my first speaker project one I found out the replacement cost of a woofer for a $1600 USD speaker...I had a local speaker building store build me some full range towers using Vifa units that smoked my Studio 40's and Wharfedales for only $700. They've got an ugly carpet finish, but oh well. This has led to me undertaking a few other projects to get into the DIY hobby (the popular Ar.com's by Ed Frias is one of them). Paradigm previously used Vifa drivers (and maybe others?), but they claim to do it all in house now.

RGA, I haven't heard any of the "Absolute Zero" models...how do they hold up against other AN models in your opinion?

Pat D: Many speakers have "a good midrange". Audio Note's generally have an exceptional midrange, despite what other flaws I believe exist. I've heard few speakers anywhere near their price point do the midrange much better (and midrange is the most sensitive, and dare I say, important to our ears). I think this is what makes them so popular.
The C-3's (and the larger ones even more so) don't have a "deep bass" per se, but I found them a bit bloated in the bass/mid bass frequencies they do cover...say 80 -300 Hz or so? I'd have to see the response curve to confirm my suspicions for sure. But I really like the Connoisseur series in general, especially the smaller models.

[Geoffcin]

It seems anytime someone asks about speakers around here it turns into an AN discussion.

I'm not against that; If the guy asked about how his speakers compared to them, or even if he asked if people had any ideas about speakers in the general price range he's looking at. But, if you read the post he did not, and the whole thread was lost to this AN train.

I'm not trying to censor anyone, but for people to look at a listing about "New Ohm Speakers" and find two pages of the good & bad points of AN speakers just isn't right.

[kexodusc]

Geoffcin,
I support your attempts to limit threadjacking. Particularly since this thread was started by a newbie.
But this does bring up an interesting point...Is it the official view of the forums that discussions within a thread cannot move off topic, even if they remain civil, and courteous, with no demands for scientific evidence and no insults regarding inferior equipment? That is, can a polite conversation not develop naturally? Nobody is forced to participate who doesn't want to, and in the end, how much different would it really be if we were to take these posts to a new thread? Does a thread, once made, "belong" only to the original poster?
This happens in 99% of the other threads here too, and quite often is fun, and leads to some of the best discussions. (provided there's no insults or mention of dee bee tee's)
But it also leads to some of the worst flame wars...

I would appreciate clarification on this issue...but I'll move the AN discussion elsewhere. Good moderating!
(BTW: where've I been when all these AN discussions were going on? )

[Geoffcin]

Geoffcin,
I support your attempts to limit threadjacking. Particularly since this thread was started by a newbie.
But this does bring up an interesting point...Is it the official view of the forums that discussions within a thread cannot move off topic, even if they remain civil, and courteous, with no demands for scientific evidence and no insults regarding inferior equipment? That is, can a polite conversation not develop naturally? Nobody is forced to participate who doesn't want to, and in the end, how much different would it really be if we were to take these posts to a new thread? Does a thread, once made, "belong" only to the original poster?
This happens in 99% of the other threads here too, and quite often is fun, and leads to some of the best discussions. (provided there's no insults or mention of dee bee tee's)
But it also leads to some of the worst flame wars...

I would appreciate clarification on this issue...but I'll move the AN discussion elsewhere. Good moderating!
(BTW: where've I been when all these AN discussions were going on? )


It was quite a well informed & civil discussion between you and RGA. I'm absolutly for in-depth discussions, and this one was well read by me.

Official policy? Not a chance! I'm not here to enforse stuck-up rules, I just want to see this site stay as good as it's been, and even better if I can help. You gotta feel for the poor guy trying to make up his mind about buying the Ohms sight-unseen, and getting this train instead.