Help with budget receiver. Turntable??

[HokieVT]

I'm looking a cheap receiver for the kids playroom. It will push a set of Fluance SX-HTBs. So far, I have found two good candidates: Yamaha HTR-5730($180) and a Denon AVR483($200). I also have a Pioneer VSX-D514S($200) on the map. There seems to be a ton of < $200 receivers out there. You can even get a Teac for $130 before shipping.

However, I need to be able to use a turntable with the receiver. Wife's orders. So how will I know which units will be able to use a turntable out of the box? What do I look for in the description?

[hershon]

If you buy a cheapass receiver like the ones you are listing, mark my words, you'll be putting it on EBAY within a year at 1/4 the cost as you'll get crappy quality. I'd recommend for $40-$80 more with shipping to get JVC RX-DV31SL which you can currently get brand new for $229 plus shipping on Amazon.com. This receiver also has a built in DVD player which I'm happy with but alot of people on this board are against. The sound on this is great. The only drawback is the setup directions for a layman like me are complicated and I paid someone to set it up (not the wiring but the internal configurations). The bottom line, even if you're one of the people who are against all DVD receivers, for the price range, especially your budget, your not going to get a better deal for a receiver that gives great sound.
I'm looking a cheap receiver for the kids playroom. It will push a set of Fluance SX-HTBs. So far, I have found two good candidates: Yamaha HTR-5730($180) and a Denon AVR483($200). I also have a Pioneer VSX-D514S($200) on the map. There seems to be a ton of < $200 receivers out there. You can even get a Teac for $130 before shipping.

However, I need to be able to use a turntable with the receiver. Wife's orders. So how will I know which units will be able to use a turntable out of the box? What do I look for in the description?

[Woochifer]

I'm looking a cheap receiver for the kids playroom. It will push a set of Fluance SX-HTBs. So far, I have found two good candidates: Yamaha HTR-5730($180) and a Denon AVR483($200). I also have a Pioneer VSX-D514S($200) on the map. There seems to be a ton of < $200 receivers out there. You can even get a Teac for $130 before shipping.

However, I need to be able to use a turntable with the receiver. Wife's orders. So how will I know which units will be able to use a turntable out of the box? What do I look for in the description?

I don't know of any $200 AV receivers that have the phono input that will allow you to play a turntable out of the box. You need to either get a receiver with a phono input built in or buy an external phono preamp. Phono preamps cost about $50 at Radio Shack and the cost goes up from there. You pretty much have to go into the $300-400 range before you start finding phono inputs on some entry level receivers, but those units also give you other features that you might find useful.

Another alternative would be to get a turntable that can output at standard line level rather than the lower phono input level. I believe that ProJect's entry level turntable (about $200) has a switchable phono/line level output.

[This Guy]

If you buy a cheapass receiver like the ones you are listing, mark my words, you'll be putting it on EBAY within a year at 1/4 the cost as you'll get crappy quality. I'd recommend for $40-$80 more with shipping to get JVC RX-DV31SL which you can currently get brand new for $229 plus shipping on Amazon.com. This receiver also has a built in DVD player which I'm happy with but alot of people on this board are against. The sound on this is great. The only drawback is the setup directions for a layman like me are complicated and I paid someone to set it up (not the wiring but the internal configurations). The bottom line, even if you're one of the people who are against all DVD receivers, for the price range, especially your budget, your not going to get a better deal for a receiver that gives great sound.

Wow. You're reccomending YOUR receiever/dvd player AGAIN in a situation he doesn't need it. He wants a Good receiver, not a DVD player. You do realise your JVC is more is because you're paying for the DVD player right? And you're calling a Denon and Yamaha receiver "cheap assed" compared to your JVC? I bet that JVC weighs no more than 20 lbs, and that's with a dvd player built in. And remember, with the JVC, if the amplifier or dvd player in it fails, you have to bring the whole thing back leaving you without sound or video for dvds. JVC makes a decent sub $200 Receiver, not combo dvd/receiever. I owned a JVC receiever for almost two years, it didn't have enough inputs, and it didn't sound too clean do to clipping when listening loudly. Not to mention my dvd player weighed almost as much as it did (18 lbs). Yamaha and Denon are both very reputable brands, you can't go wrong with either. I'd probably leave out the Pioneer, they don't really get good until their Elite line. And for your turntable question, the receiver needs a PHONO input. I'm not sure if these lower end receivers have any. I think you'll need to buy a phono pre-amp to get it to work with the receiver. Just stay away from the JVC, others on this board will agree with me. You could also do a search for "orb" for more reasons why the JVC isn't the way to go. It was a situation similar to this and Hershon just got too biased about the products he bought.

[Woochifer]

If you buy a cheapass receiver like the ones you are listing, mark my words, you'll be putting it on EBAY within a year at 1/4 the cost as you'll get crappy quality. I'd recommend for $40-$80 more with shipping to get JVC RX-DV31SL which you can currently get brand new for $229 plus shipping on Amazon.com. This receiver also has a built in DVD player which I'm happy with but alot of people on this board are against. The sound on this is great. The only drawback is the setup directions for a layman like me are complicated and I paid someone to set it up (not the wiring but the internal configurations). The bottom line, even if you're one of the people who are against all DVD receivers, for the price range, especially your budget, your not going to get a better deal for a receiver that gives great sound.

The model you're recommending isn't exactly futureproof either. It's basically an entry level receiver with a built in DVD player. If you're calling those other entry level receivers "cheapass" with "crappy quality", then you'll need to include that JVC in the group as well because aside from the DVD player, there's nothing different about that model from any other entry level receiver.

And in checking JVC's website, I saw no phono input listed for that receiver. And the original poster said nothing about needing a DVD player, so I don't see how your recommendation is the best fit for his needs.

[markw]

Both Denon and Yamaha produce fine gear. You can't really go wrong with either.

To base your decision purely on a phono stage could do you more harm then good. Too few units bother with turntables anymore and, at the level you're looking, this $$ would probably have been better spent on other areas of the receiver.

Either consider one of the previously mentioned turntables with a built in phono preamp or, if you already have the TT, the little separate phono stages can be had for as little as $30 or so at RatShack. Of course, you could spend a little more and get a better unit. I think NAD and Rotel sell one for around $100 or so.

FWIW, I think the smallest Denon with a built on phono stage is the 180x, although I don't know too much about that particular series you mentioned.

[hershon]

I mised the part about the phono input but there are auxillary inputs on the JVC receiver. In regards to This guy's and Woochifer's comments, again I disagree with you on the what if the DVD breaks down part. While there is a chance this could happen, I'll acknowledge as much, I think the odds of that happening are very small & shouldn't figure into the equation especially in the dollar range we're talking about, also if that did happen you could always plug another DVD player into its receiver. My main thing is that too me the sound is great for this unit and price, which lists for $450 but you can get currently on Amazon for $229, for both CD's and DVD's. I guarantee you will be more than happy with this unit if you like listening to rock and blues. I have great ears and have produced some legendary English rock musicians who believe in them too. The other thing I referred to as cheapass for- albeit I've never heard but am assuming they're junk. I could be totally wrong on that, I admit. The thing I find fascinating about this board is that people seem to recommend product they don't use or have never had themselves (I'm assuming this based on the posts). Be afraid, be very afraid.
The model you're recommending isn't exactly futureproof either. It's basically an entry level receiver with a built in DVD player. If you're calling those other entry level receivers "cheapass" with "crappy quality", then you'll need to include that JVC in the group as well because aside from the DVD player, there's nothing different about that model from any other entry level receiver.

And in checking JVC's website, I saw no phono input listed for that receiver. And the original poster said nothing about needing a DVD player, so I don't see how your recommendation is the best fit for his needs.

[markw]

The other thing I referred to as cheapass for- albeit I've never heard but am assuming they're junk. I could be totally wrong on that, I admit.

To first call Denon and Yamaha "cheap ass" and then claim ignorance of the brand causes me to seriously question if you have any idea what you are talking about in general.


Actually, after reading your posts, I don't question your advice any more. I just ignore it and would strongly encourage others do the same.

[hershon]

I hate to tell you this but I'm one of the few people on this board that speaks plain English. Most of you people are totally inarticulate and clueless and legends in your own minds who recommend product that they've never had. As I said, be afraid be very afraid.
To first call Denon and Yamaha "cheap ass" and then claim ignorance of the brand causes me to seriously question if you have any idea what you are talking about in general.


Actually, after reading your posts, I don't question your advice any more. I just ignore it and would strongly encourage others do the same.

[HokieVT]

http://www.audioreview.com/A-V,Receivers/Onkyo/PRD_171940_2718crx.aspx

The Onkyo 501 appears to have a phono input. I can get a reconditioned one for $185.

BTW eCost is eating shipping on all units.

[This Guy]

good job. Onkyo makes good stuff, and looks perfect for ya.

[Woochifer]

I mised the part about the phono input but there are auxillary inputs on the JVC receiver.

Doesn't count. Line level inputs like the ones you're describing don't do the level step up and RIAA equalization that a dedicated phono input will. The poster needs to hook up a turntable to the receiver, auxiliary inputs won't help.


In regards to This guy's and Woochifer's comments, again I disagree with you on the what if the DVD breaks down part. While there is a chance this could happen, I'll acknowledge as much, I think the odds of that happening are very small & shouldn't figure into the equation especially in the dollar range we're talking about, also if that did happen you could always plug another DVD player into its receiver.

Where did we mention the DVD breaking down part? That's another thread, not this one. I would recommend against the JVC simply because the poster DID NOT mention needing a DVD player. If he already has one or does not plan on hooking one up to the receiver, then why buy a unit that has one built in?


My main thing is that too me the sound is great for this unit and price, which lists for $450 but you can get currently on Amazon for $229, for both CD's and DVD's. I guarantee you will be more than happy with this unit if you like listening to rock and blues. I have great ears and have produced some legendary English rock musicians who believe in them too. The other thing I referred to as cheapass for- albeit I've never heard but am assuming they're junk. I could be totally wrong on that, I admit. The thing I find fascinating about this board is that people seem to recommend product they don't use or have never had themselves (I'm assuming this based on the posts). Be afraid, be very afraid.

Yeah, it sounds great to you and you recommend it because YOU OWN ONE. The poster did not say that they needed a DVD player, which this model DOES include; and the poster said that they needed a phono input, which this model DOES NOT include.

If you're going to start blasting other people on this board for making ill-informed advice, maybe you should actually address the need in question rather than prescribe a one-size-fits-all solution that just happens to be the exact same thing as what you own.

[N. Abstentia]

I hate to tell you this but I'm one of the few people on this board that speaks plain English. Most of you people are totally inarticulate and clueless and legends in your own minds who recommend product that they've never had. As I said, be afraid be very afraid.

No offense, but when a $300 bottom feeder receiver/dvd player is your only exposure to the world of home theater, handing out advice is the last thing you should be doing. Recommending a receiver/dvd player in this case is asanine. If he wanted a DVD player he could get the $199 receiver and add a $59 Samsung or Toshiba standalone. At $259 he's got a far better setup than a $299 JVC combo unit.

A $200 receiver is just fine for a kids playroom. If it does not have a phono input, either buy a phono preamp on Ebay for $15, or buy a turntable with a preamp built in. Sony and Pioneer both have models with preamps for $99 - $150 new. You can get them on Ebay for around $50.

[hershon]

I owe you everything my man but totally disagree with you here unless you've actually listened to the systems we're talking about (both of us) on a longtime basis. I don't mind people criticizing my love of my JVC receiver if they've had it and didn't like it, but from the limited facts offered, no these people haven't owned one, so how can they criticize me and this receiver so emphatically. The same with recommending systems that they've probably never owned yet espousing how great they are. This is my main criticism with this forum and the people in it, the "Do as I say, not do as I do" attitude." If you or anytone else has actually owned these systems, then what you say holds alot of weight. But if you guys never owned the systems you espouse so much, its totally unfair to the person your recommending it to. Fighting for peace is like flucking for virginity!

No offense, but when a $300 bottom feeder receiver/dvd player is your only exposure to the world of home theater, handing out advice is the last thing you should be doing. Recommending a receiver/dvd player in this case is asanine. If he wanted a DVD player he could get the $199 receiver and add a $59 Samsung or Toshiba standalone. At $259 he's got a far better setup than a $299 JVC combo unit.

A $200 receiver is just fine for a kids playroom. If it does not have a phono input, either buy a phono preamp on Ebay for $15, or buy a turntable with a preamp built in. Sony and Pioneer both have models with preamps for $99 - $150 new. You can get them on Ebay for around $50.

[chimera128]

Hershon I don't think people have a problem with you saying that you like your system. I think that they have a problem with you discrediting other systems that you probably don't own ("I don't mind people criticizing my love of my JVC receiver if they've had it and didn't like it, but from the limited facts offered, no these people haven't owned one, so how can they criticize me and this receiver so emphatically.") just because you like your system. Saying that you wouldn' t buy a cheap ass receiver (I don't know what you consider cheapass but I could buy 4 of your dvd/receivers for what I paid for my center channel) is ludicrous because that is exactly what you did. Anything that comes packaged together, whether it be a dvd/vcr, vcr/vcr, dvd/receiver, or even a receiver will not have the quality of products purchased separately. Now you may like your system but if you continue to put down other products (out of ignorance I am sure) then you should be prepared for people to continue to respond negatively to your posts.

[N. Abstentia]

I owe you everything my man but totally disagree with you here unless you've actually listened to the systems we're talking about (both of us) on a longtime basis. I don't mind people criticizing my love of my JVC receiver if they've had it and didn't like it, but from the limited facts offered, no these people haven't owned one, so how can they criticize me and this receiver so emphatically.

I'm not criticizing your receiver, but you're recommending that he buy one just like yours just because you have one and you think it sounds good. Take away the DVD player and it's a $199 receiver just like the others he's looking at, which you say is 'cheapass'. He does not need the DVD player. He can take that $100 and get either a better receiver or a new turntable with the preamp built in.

You say he shouldn't buy a 'cheapass' receiver, then tell him to go buy a receiver with a DVD player built in, which is far more cheapass than the others he's looking at. That don't make sense.

[hershon]

You may have a point in me saying negative things about systems I haven't heard, I'll make a conscious effort to tone that down, but a great many people who profess to be experts on this board do the same thing but only worse. At least I advocate a system I have which is more than I can say for many of the other people here (from what I can ascertain). The one thing that I don't get from 98% of the posts here is what exactly makes their system so great, what do they play that sounds so hot, what their friends think, etc. In short most of these posts lack total emotion and passion. I for one would rather hear someone say this system kicks ass and the drums sound like they're being played live in your living room then the absolutely dry drone technical generic responses. At least for me, if I was shopping for a system in a store and a salesman described the product the way these people do, I'd say next and probably walk out of the store. I simply am not impressed with how alot of people here go into their likes and dislikes and would never hire any of them to market my product.The other thing I get from reading these posts is that most of these people don't actually seem to have any love or passion for music to listen to, they're more concerned about technical things then how the actual CD sounds like. Again, if the only way you can listen to gut rock is by playing it on a super expensive system, then you're missing out on the whole experience.
Hershon I don't think people have a problem with you saying that you like your system. I think that they have a problem with you discrediting other systems that you probably don't own ("I don't mind people criticizing my love of my JVC receiver if they've had it and didn't like it, but from the limited facts offered, no these people haven't owned one, so how can they criticize me and this receiver so emphatically.") just because you like your system. Saying that you wouldn' t buy a cheap ass receiver (I don't know what you consider cheapass but I could buy 4 of your dvd/receivers for what I paid for my center channel) is ludicrous because that is exactly what you did. Anything that comes packaged together, whether it be a dvd/vcr, vcr/vcr, dvd/receiver, or even a receiver will not have the quality of products purchased separately. Now you may like your system but if you continue to put down other products (out of ignorance I am sure) then you should be prepared for people to continue to respond negatively to your posts.

[hershon]

I probably was wrong criticizing systems I haven't heard,my main point being I'm recommending a system I actual have and listen too rather than other people recommending systems they probably don't have.
I'm not criticizing your receiver, but you're recommending that he buy one just like yours just because you have one and you think it sounds good. Take away the DVD player and it's a $199 receiver just like the others he's looking at, which you say is 'cheapass'. He does not need the DVD player. He can take that $100 and get either a better receiver or a new turntable with the preamp built in.

You say he shouldn't buy a 'cheapass' receiver, then tell him to go buy a receiver with a DVD player built in, which is far more cheapass than the others he's looking at. That don't make sense.

[chimera128]

I probably was wrong criticizing systems I haven't heard,my main point being I'm recommending a system I actual have and listen too rather than other people recommending systems they probably don't have.

Some of us can't recommend the system that we currently own because it goes beyond the budgetary limitations of others. The system I have currently has cost me roughly $10,000. I did not spend $10,000 just to spend $10,000 but because I liked the components (mainly the speakers) and the sound that they produce. That is not to say that I didn't like other gear that costs less than what I currently own (or wouldn't buy it if it did offer the level of performance as the speakers that I got), it's just that for me it was worth the extra cost. I did however listen to a wide range of products (as I am sure many posters here have) before settling on what I bought. Just because we do not own them doesn't discredit what we have to say about them. I also have family members who are home theatre nuts that own b&w and other speakers. As I have said before I think it is great that you like your system and I'm sure for you it probably has the best performance/value ratio. But it is not the only good system (it may even be a great system but unfortunately they aren't available for listening) for under $1000. As for specs lol, I think some people think of them as bragging rights (my sub will go lower than your sub with less distortion etc) but they are also useful information. You wouldn't want a sub that only goes to 50hz or a tweeter to 10khz because you will be missing some of the music.

[hershon]

Hi, I'm asking this question out of curiosity not trying to put you on the defensive as I never experienced hearing rock on a relatively expensive system and am trying to visualize what I may be missing out on, really. Assuming you listen to rock CD's (if you don't your answer won't be applicable) what exactly do you hear differently playing say the Beatles, Stones, Hendrix, etc. on a CD from a $10,000 system than a $1,000 system. I'm asking out of curiosity because I never heard any rock CD played on a relatively expensive system. Is the difference, the difference between night and day, or just slight? I'm really curious on this. I know if someone heard a thousand dollar system and your system blindfolded, they could tell the most expensive system, but are the differences that apparent?
Some of us can't recommend the system that we currently own because it goes beyond the budgetary limitations of others. The system I have currently has cost me roughly $10,000. I did not spend $10,000 just to spend $10,000 but because I liked the components (mainly the speakers) and the sound that they produce. That is not to say that I didn't like other gear that costs less than what I currently own (or wouldn't buy it if it did offer the level of performance as the speakers that I got), it's just that for me it was worth the extra cost. I did however listen to a wide range of products (as I am sure many posters here have) before settling on what I bought. Just because we do not own them doesn't discredit what we have to say about them. I also have family members who are home theatre nuts that own b&w and other speakers. As I have said before I think it is great that you like your system and I'm sure for you it probably has the best performance/value ratio. But it is not the only good system (it may even be a great system but unfortunately they aren't available for listening) for under $1000. As for specs lol, I think some people think of them as bragging rights (my sub will go lower than your sub with less distortion etc) but they are also useful information. You wouldn't want a sub that only goes to 50hz or a tweeter to 10khz because you will be missing some of the music.

[chimera128]

I think I have stated before that I mostly listen to classical. However, I can tell you that the difference is pretty substantial from when I went from my $2000 system to a $10000 system. I recently went to Vegas and saw some shows there (Mamma Mia and Blue Man Group). I bought the cds/dvds for the shows and was pleased by how closely my system is able to recreate them. The major difference that I noticed was in the bass reproduction. I'm sure many people on here can attest to how much a good subwoofer can add to a system. You have stated in previous posts that you don't like overpowering bass so I won't bore you with the capabilities of the subs. However it is the musicality and tight response of the subs that I liked. Bass drums, kits, etc. take on a whole new realism. Friends that have been to concerts and brought over live recordings said it was like being there again. I also noticed things that I have never heard before. Whisperings and people coughing in the audience during a classical recording for instance. I'm sure you could probably find some high end audio places close to where you live. Most are more than welcome to allow you to bring in your own cds to listen to. I'd take some time out and do it just for fun. You might even be able to take in your satellites so you can do a side by side comparison.

[HokieVT]

I decided on the Onkyo SR502. Tonight is hookup night. Off to the Shack for coax ad S-video cables

[topspeed]

Good choice Hokie, Onkyo makes really nice sounding receivers and their quality is top notch. BTW, interested in a little side bet for August 28th ;)? Should be a good game, too bad you lost Vick tho.
Oh yeah...
Fight On!

Chimera,
Blue Man Group is too much fun, brother! What a viceral experience! I was sooo ready to dump a can of blue latex over my head and jump onto a kit and join 'em. They have a dvd-a disc that sounds amazing (great test disc) and would probably pressurize your house with all those DT's you're running. Enjoy!

[HokieVT]

You give me 50 points and I might consider it. Vick was a really big loss. He was as good a receiver as he was a QB.

The 502 runs hot but not horribly. I watched Thin Red Line last night/today and never got anything over IIx to work. Star Wars II, I get Dolby D