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ForeverAutumn
07-22-2004, 05:25 PM
I'm in the process of shopping for a new computer which I'm hoping to purchase in the fall. I'm not very technical and I have a few questions :confused: that I'm sure some of you have some opinions on.

1. Besides price and size, what are the pros and cons (if any) of Laptop vs. Desktop? I'm not likely to taking my computer out of the house, but I also work from home. Our home desktop takes up 1/4 of the desk space. It would be nice to be able to get the home computer off the desk to clear the space to work. Since I travel for work, my firm supplies a laptop for work purposes. Are there any reasons why I shouldn't consider a laptop for home use?

2. How much memory should I have for basic home use (internet, microsoft office, burning disks, editing photos)? I see computers advertised with anywhere from 40 to 200GB. How much do I really need?

3. Do I need to spend the extra money for a Pentium processor or would a cheaper processer suit my basic needs?

If I go the desktop route, I've been eyeing a nice Compaq box. It has the USB and Firewire ports on the front which means that I don't have to crawl behind my desk to the back of the box to change components. A very nice feature!

Any help you geeks can provide would be appreciated. ;)

Dusty Chalk
07-22-2004, 07:17 PM
1. Besides price and size, what are the pros and cons (if any) of Laptop vs. Desktop?Here's my speech on laptops: everyone I've ever known who has ever had a laptop has broken it by dropping it. I highly recommend getting a ruggedized one. At the time I was looking, they had something out called the "Toughbook", by Panasonic, I believe, but they were not available for general consumption new. Too bad.

The other thing is the screen. I don't care how good your laptop screen is, they can't compare to my Sony CRT (flatscreen). If you're going to be spending a lot of time on it, make sure to check out LCD's -- I hate them, I'm really glad I took some time to look at them, otherwise I might have gone in that direction. That said, my opinion is not everybody's. I don't know if I'm in the minority or in the majority, but I know it's pretty close to 50/50 than widely swinging one way or th'other.

You could look at a mini-case, depending on how much you plan to add to it. Take this for example: look here (http://www.ajumpminipc.com/ajump/smallformfactor.asp?dept_id=9996&refer=ajumpminipc).
2. How much memory should I have for basic home use (internet, microsoft office, burning disks, editing photos)? I see computers advertised with anywhere from 40 to 200GB. How much do I really need?That's two different things, memory and disk space. Memory is "forgotten" when you shut down the computer, disk space persists between power-downs. (Won't go into how memory is sometimes reinitialized to the same state it was before power-down by what's on the disk, as that'll just confuse you.)

Disk space -- bare minimum is 40G if you're buying new. Any less, and they're ripping you off. I'd say go for 100G...but it depends on what you want to use it for. If you're just using it for email and Internet, then 40G is more than plenty (I lived with 6G for years). If you're going to download music, I'd say double it at least. You'd be surprised how quickly that adds up, especially when you start discovering sites that have full shows, and then you want to get cable...and it's just nuts...if you're going to start downloading movies, or playing with video at all (e.g., converting videotapes to DVD), I say step right up to 200G.

Memory -- 256M minimum if you're going to use a Micro$oft operating system, such as 2000 or XP. More if you do anything intensive, like video, or large Powerpoint presentations. 1G is like maxing it out by today's standards, but 9 months down the road...who knows?
3. Do I need to spend the extra money for a Pentium processor or would a cheaper processer suit my basic needs?It depends. There are extremely specific applications that only work on Pentiums, such as certain music software (creation, not playback), but most applications work on Intel Pentiums/AMD Athlons/whatever whatevers all pretty much independently. If you're using Microsoft software, you're safe buying anything. If you plan on using any other software, check the software first.
If I go the desktop route, I've been eyeing a nice Compaq box. It has the USB and Firewire ports on the front which means that I don't have to crawl behind my desk to the back of the box to change components. A very nice feature! Geek-approved.

Micron PC is also pretty good. I almost got one a couple years ago. I have a Sony Vaio right now. It's alright. I paid a little too much for it, but that was my fault -- I never sent in the rebates. It should have been less than US$1K. I don't see any reason for anyone buying a more expensive PC these days (than US$1K) unless you plan to use it for much more than WWW and e-mail (and a lot of those sub-US$1K systems include monitors these days). If you're going to upgrade anywhere, I would say upgrade your monitor, as that is where you're going to be spending 99% of your time looking.

The problem is, every time Intel/AMD/whomever makes an advance in technology, squeezing that next 2x capability into the hardware, Microsoft comes out with a new Operating System (and software -- Office, etc.) that uses it up. That's why the machines are getting faster, yet don't appear to. But we're getting to the point where even Microsoft is having a hard time spreading out to take up all available space.

Worf101
07-23-2004, 10:01 AM
Or something.

I read your post. Since you're not a Gamer, or doing any heavy duty movie or photo editing you could get by with a wide range of products from any of the "frontline" computer makers. Some also make "slimline" or small footprint desktops that will free up desk space as will going with a Flatpanel LCD. I always recommend buying as much computer as you can up front and let it become an obsolete doorstop more slowly. Some people feel the opposite, they buy lagging edge tech because it's cheaper and still suits their needs. I do have some basic features you should get in whatever puter you buy.

1. No less than an 80 gig Harddrive. Larger the better particularly if you're gonna be filling it with music MP3's or Wav's.

2. No less than 512 MB's of RAM (Random Access Memory) you stick it into your Motherboard. It speeds the loading and unloading of files, programs and anything.

3. Onboard Ethernet & Lan. If you have high speed Internet access you can skip the add-on card and plug it straight from the box into your motherboard.

4. Get a decent Graphics Card from ATI or NVidia. They speed up more than games and who know's where you might want to go in the future. Better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it.

5. Good monitor, plenty of space, high refresh rates so you don't hurt your eyes.

I could make a bunch more recommendations but this is just off the top of me head.

Don't hesitate to ask if you've any more questions...


Da Worfster :cool:

ForeverAutumn
07-23-2004, 02:03 PM
Thanks Dusty and Worf. I find this computer stuff so confusing. Like Worf said, I don't want to underbuy and have an expensive doorstop in a year, I did that with my first computer 12 years ago. But I don't want to spend money on a bunch of features that I don't need either. Not being very computer savvy, I'm finding it hard to know where that middle ground is.

I appreciate the advice.

If anyone else cares to chime in...please do.

DarrenH
07-23-2004, 02:27 PM
The biggest improvement I ever made was getting rid of that large a$$ CRT moniter and going with LCD flat panel.

Gone was the heat, the dust collection and the space that hog took up.

If you decide to go with a desk top system I can't recommend this enough. Worth the extra cost. I know, they can be expensive, but believe me, worth every penny.

Btw, I agree with Worf 100%, 512M ram minimum. Get that no matter what you're gonna do with it. I think newer computers even come with that now as standard equipment.

80 gig hard drive will be plenty. Shoot, hard drives so cheap anyway, go with a 120 gig. Won't cost much more that a CD or two. :D

Get the ethernet/nic card. You'll need that for cable modem or DSL hookup. Once again, most new computers come with as standard equipment anyhow.

Darren

Hyfi
07-23-2004, 07:57 PM
First of all, you have already gotten good advice from the prior replies.

Q1- Price vs Size vs Pros vs Cons

Yes Notebooks/Portables are smaller and most are expensive for whats inside. They come in all sizes from ones with full near size keyboards & 16" screens to ones as thin as a Sharpie and just as light. As said earlier, they are delicate and can be damaged easily. My good (unorganized) friend broke hers a few times and now just can't seem to find it. It becomes too easy to pile crap on top of them. Then there is the Battery Life or lack of it, and that fun to trip over power cord thats always in the way cause the battery only lasts a few hours. Now, in order to make a notebook, you need smaller flimsier components. The motherboard and modified for laptop CPUs are crammed way in there with the RAM and no good way out for the heat. When you want to add something to the system, you now need to get PC Cards and keep track of them and keep switching them out to do something else. And lastly but most important, they suck for ripping and burning music and worse yet, try copying on the fly with one drive. if you insist on a Laptop, don't skimp, look at custom gaming rigs like this-http://www.falcon-nw.com/fragbook2.asp


If you can't put a regular size or mini ATX size pc under your desk and try not to kick it, and you realy don't want it on the desk you have an alternative. Mostly used for gaming and LAN parties of Unreal Tournament, a cool item is the Cube. Usually about 8 inches square by maybe 12 deep, you can have a killer little box for alot less than a regular case pc. You wont have much room to upgrade but you get Mobo w/CPU, Ram, Video card, NIC card, and then go wireless keyboard and mouse. They also have half size keyboards if you need more room and have tiny fingers. Although I won't recomend Dell or any of the name brands, they all have come out with spacesaving models. Here is a sample of a cube but there are many brands and places to custom order what you want inside.
http://www.falcon-nw.com/fragbox.asp

Go to www.pricewatch.com and price things. Find a well known dealer with positive reviews. Don't forget Tigerdirect.

Q2- Memory
As clarified earlier, Memory-Ram and Storage-Hard Drive are 2 different things. You want no less than 512MB of ram. The speed of this Ram depends entirely on the Motherboards Front Side Bus(FSB) or Bus Speed. When you look at the specs of a Motherboard, it tell you what CPU it supports and quantity and speed of Ram. With the hard drive, as said before, at $1/Meg go big but do yourself a favor and partition it into smaller logical drives for maintenence and organization. You will only have to back up your Data Drive. Defrag wont take forever. All program files get loaded on separate drive from OS. Windows and supported programs are growing ever bigger in size. I just loaded the full MS Office 2003 suit and it took up just under 1 meg. Tunes ripped to fill an 80min comp take up close to a meg. Laptop Hard Drives are always smaller. Get about a 120 Gig drive and let me introduce you to Partition Magic.

Q3- $$$ for Pentium
You will always pay more for an Intel chip. Comparable AMD systems are always cheaper. It's real hard to match up an Intel and AMD chip for speed. Even if you can, AMDs run more processes /clock cycle than Pentium chips therefore they do more work faster at a slower Mhz. I think I will go AMD when I buy something new. I came by an older Athlon 650 with 128 mb ram that runs real smooth. Now when you asked about a pentium, I assume you meant Intel. What you will most likely get will be a P4. Plain ole Pentium chips are way old and slow. If you go AMD, what you want to look for is a system with an Athlon 2800+ and up to whatever your budget is. More and more MOBOs have integrated 3d graphics that are not bad but go for an AGP card with 128MB of it's own ram so it does not have to share the system ram.
As far as ports on the front go, they are a nice feature. You can also get little USB extension cords and leave them plugged in the back and ready in front as well as 3.5 inch bay mount kits with camera card readers, USB and Firewire ports in one package. So many options! Ya definately want a 10/100 NIC card for network/cable modem.

The other thing I hate about Dell ect., is that they load too much useless crap on the pc and not enough good software. They also don't give you a working copy of your Operating System most if not all of the time anymore. They give you an Image disk for repair but not the real disk. Email me and I'll rip a Software Comp for ya. The best thing to do with those systems when you get them is to wipe the drive clean, partition the drive properly, and then only load the software you nead.

Oh and one more thing, Monitors- If you must have a Flat Screen, DO NOT SKIMP or you will wish you had that huge dust attraction back in a jiffy. For some, they are fine. They don't refresh/scan as fast as CRTs so any gaming or action movies will look sloppy. These are not Plasma, they are LCD although you can get them but me thinks it will break your budget.

This is all just a guess. Good luck with whatever you pick.

Who you calling a Geek?

Finch Platte
07-23-2004, 08:04 PM
"Btw, I agree with Worf 100%, 512M ram minimum. Get that no matter what you're gonna do with it."

I've got 256M, and it seems like I can only get about 20 CDs worth of comps on it before it starts to freak. Sucks, dumping stuff you kinda wanted to keep in there.

fp

DarrenH
07-23-2004, 09:27 PM
Oh and one more thing, Monitors- If you must have a Flat Screen, DO NOT SKIMP or you will wish you had that huge dust attraction back in a jiffy. For some, they are fine. They don't refresh/scan as fast as CRTs so any gaming or action movies will look sloppy. These are not Plasma, they are LCD although you can get them but me thinks it will break your budget.

LCD flat screens work just fine Hyfi.

Been using the one I have for roughly two years now. Medal Of Honor: Allied Forces plays just fine. As does several other games I have. But I do have a fairly good graphics card. Well, a card that's a couple of years old now. Nvidia GeForce TI-200. Ancient history now.

Bottom line: flat panel screens will do the job and save space.

DarrenH
07-23-2004, 09:37 PM
"Btw, I agree with Worf 100%, 512M ram minimum. Get that no matter what you're gonna do with it."

I've got 256M, and it seems like I can only get about 20 CDs worth of comps on it before it starts to freak. Sucks, dumping stuff you kinda wanted to keep in there.

fp

That explains why I never got that Primus comp I requested. Lack of memory ;)

Could I have a copy please? Or am I on the short list.

Be glad to reciprocate. Need more Mule?

Darren

Hyfi
07-24-2004, 08:10 AM
LCD flat screens work just fine Hyfi.

Been using the one I have for roughly two years now. Medal Of Honor: Allied Forces plays just fine. As does several other games I have. But I do have a fairly good graphics card. Well, a card that's a couple of years old now. Nvidia GeForce TI-200. Ancient history now.

Bottom line: flat panel screens will do the job and save space.


I can't say they are all bad. I did say go for a higher end model. The last few Dell systems I have installed had the "Monitor Upgrade" so instead of getting a nice 17" flat crt you get the 15 inch LCD. These monitors they are using in these deals are crap. All grainy and wavy. One of them is in the process of getting replaced for the second time. A good graphics card is also the other factor which is why I recomend it even if the MOBO has decent onboard graphics. Yours beats my old Voodoo 3-3000! And for all the space it takes up, My Viewsonic A90 19 inch CRT is good to my eyes.


Nibbles & Bits,
Hyfi

Dusty Chalk
07-25-2004, 09:17 AM
...that will free up desk space as will going with a Flatpanel LCD.That's true. Since you're looking to be not necessarily mobile, but at least put-away-able, you might want to look at one of those flatpanels. Just make sure you look at them first, before you buy.