Do you believe in magic? [Archive] - Audio & Video Forums


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10-01-2016, 03:12 PM
Had a friend over last night to check out my new amp. Earlier this year I gave him my Blue Jeans Cable Belden 10g speaker cables when I purchased a used pair of Acoustic Zen Satori cables.

So he asked me how the AZ cables had improved the sound, and was it worth the upgrade. I hemmed and said I was happy. But I paid $25 for the BJC (bare ends) and $450 for the AZ cables. Now the AZ cables are quite impressive to look at (about the thickness of a garden hose) and very well made. But perhaps I should have spent the money on vinyl.

Any good cable stories / opinions out there?

10-03-2016, 05:10 AM
Here is a re-copy of an older post I had at AK-

First let me preface this post to say that the discussion is intended to be between those who have tried cables to alter the sound and can post about their real world experiences. If you need to interject and play the naysayer-DBT Challenge game, please take it elsewhere.

Using Cables as Tone Controls

In some discussions here at AK, one member has repeatedly discussed his use of various cables as Tone Controls. After reading his posts and results, and coming across a pair of ICs that I have had for some time now, I was able to tame a particular setup by using this set of cables between my OPPO93, which I think lacks bass output in Analog mode, and my Rotel 1052 Integrated.

When I first got the OPPO, I posted my impressions here as well as in the Official thread at AVS. I got various responses around break-in and related gear, but nothing about cabling.

Secondly, this setup using the OPPO for CD playback driven by the Rotel feeds a pair of JM Labs Tantal 509s, which like most lower level JMs or Focals lack deep bass. Distinct and detailed yes, just no extension.

A few weeks ago I had to re-arrange a few components in my rack due to the Integra 30.3 giving off lots of heat with no room above it in the 7" shelf. While re cabling everything back up, and not even remembering where this set of ICs were, I decided to put them in the main setup between Pre and Amp in place of the regularly used Synergistic Research ICs. I did not like the sound compared to the Synergistic cables. Dark and bassey and lacking a little of the detail I was used to. I removed the ICs and put the SRs back to regain my expected sound.

Next, since I got my Hafler Pre-Amp repaired and back in place in the gym along with it's 9180 amp driving a pair of Polk Monitor 30s, I tried the cables there again between pre and amp. Way too much base output and I ended up using the tone controls, Bass all the way down and Treble all the way up to compensate.

So after my discussions over at AK, I decided to try the cables in my OPPO Rotel setup. All I can say is WOW, they solved 2 problems. The OPPO is no longer shy on bass and neither are the JMs. I put a pair of Tara Labs Quantum CX ICs in the Hafler setup and ended up with a much mellower sound without too much bass.

So what are the cables that did so much magic in my system? A pair of Groneberg Series 3 ICs made in Germany and purchased through Odyssey way back when I bought my Stratos Amp. By the way, they use the same cable for the internal wiring of all Odyssey amps which may contribute to the bass output they give, who knows.

Anyway, I just decided to look at the Odyssey page and found an interesting blurb;

""As a matter of fact, these cables, and especially the Quattro Reference cables for their specific price/performance ratio is so good that we decided to use only Groneberg cables in our Stratos amplifiers exclusively. Klaus Bunge

Designed and manufactured in Germany, this cable offers a very high value and performance. No need to use different cables for different signals. Patented Groneberg design (DE 43 36 230 C1) in TS Premium and Quattro Reference models solves the problem and cable can be configured for different purposes: IC, Idigital cooax, loudspeaker cable and power cord. One cable to rule them all.

Do not be reluctant to give this cable a try, maybe there are better ones, but they are much more expensive, and cheaper competitors stay far behind from the performance Groneberg cable achieves. Several reviews in Germany and Europe have rated this cable over products from other famous brands, you'll be surprised.

Groneberg Quattro Reference: Patented design for optimized and constant electron flow Four conductor lines Stabilizing inner core Shielding braid Excellent soundstage, detail and deep bass reproduction Harmonics coherent delicate and revealing mids & highs Excellent voice reproduction 530 pF/m Propietary jacket formulation.

Groneberg Serie 3: Stripped version of Quattro Reference Shielding braid Open and detailed sound Good bass extension Slightly warm sound 240 pF/m Propietary jacket formulation. ""

Anyone here have a similar experience? Speaker cable or ICs? I don't notice as much of a drastic change in speaker cables between two quality constructed similar pairs as I do between various ICs.

JoeE SP9
10-03-2016, 06:02 AM
Those Groneberg Quatro's have quite a high capacitance (530pF/m). I wouldn't use them for connecting a TT.

10-03-2016, 08:03 AM
My experience to this day is that solid core cables are superior to stranded cables. No I have not tried them all but as far as straned I have used Kimber, Transparent, Monster many years ago and of course lamp cord in the early days. I am sure there are others and as I remember them I will add them. My system is currently wired with Audioquest Rocket 33 or 44 speaker cables depending on the speaker and both Diamondback XLR's and IC's.

I believed in magic once going with cables with multiple individually insulated solid core conductors.

10-03-2016, 10:30 AM
Those Groneberg Quatro's have quite a high capacitance (530pF/m). I wouldn't use them for connecting a TT.

I have the Groneberg Serie 3