Receivers?

[ForeverAutumn]

So now that we have a new 4K TV, and fibre optics cable, I decided that it was time to upgrade our 15-yr-old receiver. But the technology is so different now, there's a lot of stuff in the specs that I just don't understand anymore. Receivers used to be so easy...AM/FM radio. Plug in a couple of speakers a turntable and CD player and you were good to go.

I ordered this Denon on-line last night. I can return it if I need to, but it seemed to serve all our needs (and then some) but since I don't understand a lot of the stuff on it, I thought I'd run it past my Audio gurus (yes, I mean you guys. :) ).

Denon 525-Watt 7.2 Channel 4K HD Network Home Theatre Reciever (AVRS700W) : Home Theatre Receivers - Best Buy Canada (http://www.bestbuy.ca/en-CA/product/denon-denon-525-watt-7-2-channel-4k-hd-network-home-theatre-reciever-avrs700w-avrs700w/10299196.aspx?path=aed337e12901bba10b4bdb161eaedd1 1en02)

This was my other option. The specs include a lot of stuff that the Denon doesn't, but since our needs are simple I thought it might be stuff that we wouldn't use...but the truth is that I'm just not sure.
Onkyo 7.2 Channel Dolby Atmos Network Home Theatre Reciever (TX-NR636) : Home Theatre Receivers - Best Buy Canada (http://www.bestbuy.ca/en-CA/product/onkyo-onkyo-7-2-channel-dolby-atmos-network-home-theatre-reciever-tx-nr636-tx-nr636/10297752.aspx?path=d111c54a288240e576fd70e957a1acb 0en02)

I'm powering a pair of Paradigm Studio 60s as my fronts and two-channel, and a pair of Studio Lab bookshelf speakers for my rears and a Studio Lab centre. Also a 4K TV, and a Sony blu-ray player (that we almost never use). I want to be able to connect my iPod to it, and possibly use wireless speakers eventually.

I doubt that there will ever be a game console on this receiver...at least not in the foreseeable future.

Thoughts? Will the Denon do the job? Am I missing anything?

[Jack in Wilmington]

There are good reviews on each of your choices on Audioholics.com. I like the Denon because I feel that Onkyo cut out some of the good features of their older receivers to implement some of the new features. They went cheaper on the speaker setup by getting rid of Audessy and going to a cheaper system. Also the implementation of HDMI 2.0 is not full 2.0 and actually has the same data rates as HDMI 1.4 therefore it will not be able to carry the 4K signal on BluRay discs when they come out next year. That may not interest you since you said you rarely play BluRays. If I had a 4K set, I would want to see what it looks like as soon as I could, so I would want my receiver to be ready to step up when needed.

[Mr Peabody]

Looks like the Denon will do what you want. You'd probably not use the Onkyo's Dolby Atmos which would require more speakers in the room, ceiling mounted. The Denon has Wyfi and the internet tuner is built in which is cool. The Denon claims to be 4 ohm compatible so should drive your speakers alright, although it looks like it only is 75 real watts per channel, but with a sub and if you don't listen terribly loud you should be fine. It is Bluetooth compatible so will play music from phone or tablet, and also a USB input that plays music files. So, I think you did good.

[ForeverAutumn]

Thanks guys. I appreciate your input. I feel better about my decision having received your comments.

I wasn't sure about the 75 watts, our current receiver is 100. But I think we'll be okay. I don't listen to music nearly as loud as I did in my younger days. :) To get the extra wattage, it looks like I need to jump up in the $500+ price range which I'd prefer not to do if it can be avoided. However, the great thing about Best Buy is that I can test drive it and return it if we find the 75W isn't enough.

[m3incorp]

I have the higher-end Denon in my family room and the Onkyo TX-NR 838 in my living room. While I do like Audusy for setting up speakers, I have found that the solution that the Onkyo uses, actually works fine also.

I hear so many people make statements about HDMI 2.0 and HDMI 1.4 that are not true.

HDMI 1.4 WILL carry the 4K signal but at 24 frames per second (fps). HDMI 2.0 carries the 4K signal at 50 and 60 fps. The important thing to remember is that HDCP 2.2 is required in order watch content that is digitally protected, which is most likely how future blu-ray content will be delivered. The new Blu-ray standards just came out in CES 2015 and true 4k blu-ray players will be hitting the market this summer....by true capable, this means they will include the HDMI 2.0 outputs that have the HDCP 2.2.

Many cable companies don't even broadcast in 1080p, so I would not expect them to be doing 4K anytime soon. Netflix claims that it will be streaming 4K movies, will have to see how that goes and if they will digitally protected.

I like my Denon receiver also, but you had better know what you are doing to get the most out of it, as their manuals absolutely suck.


There are good reviews on each of your choices on Audioholics.com. I like the Denon because I feel that Onkyo cut out some of the good features of their older receivers to implement some of the new features. They went cheaper on the speaker setup by getting rid of Audessy and going to a cheaper system. Also the implementation of HDMI 2.0 is not full 2.0 and actually has the same data rates as HDMI 1.4 therefore it will not be able to carry the 4K signal on BluRay discs when they come out next year. That may not interest you since you said you rarely play BluRays. If I had a 4K set, I would want to see what it looks like as soon as I could, so I would want my receiver to be ready to step up when needed.

[Mr Peabody]

Having to buy new HDMI cables is a real detourant to 4k for me, I suppose a good reason not to go high end in this area. Not to mention the expense of the gear but that can be replaced in time as needed.

It will be interesting to see what happens with 4k as DVD is still being sold. People who have seen4k says PQ is awesome though.

[ForeverAutumn]

I like my Denon receiver also, but you had better know what you are doing to get the most out of it, as their manuals absolutely suck.

No kidding. I'm still considering returning it because I can't figure out the damn manual. I have until Jan. 26 to make a final decision.

I actually found a website that "translates" Denon manuals. It's pretty sad that somebody realized that the manuals were so bad they felt the need to create a website to help people decipher their manuals.

[bfalls]

I find Denon to be more musical than Onkyo. One thing I did notice with the Onkyo is it upconverts to 4K where the Denon doesn't. The Denon has HDMI passthrough which will be OK if the original content is 4K, but won't convert other sources to 4K. I haven't seen any results from conversion to 4K, so not sure if it's a good feature, but would probably want it iif I had a 4K TV. My darn Sony XBRs are still going strong after 7+yrs, so can't justify an upgrade. I have seen 4k and it is pretty awesome, but still willing to wait for the Sonys to fail on their own. Maybe by that time the new DTS version will be out as well as full versions of HDMI and HCDP. I had been intrigued with Atmos, but the DTS is supposed to be better.

[Hyfi]

I am assuming you have read this Manual but maybe not. There are Youtube tutorials, quick start guides and possibly an Official thread over at AVS Forums, where people can tell you every feature and usage.

AVR-S700W (http://manuals.denon.com/AVRS700W/NA/EN/)

DENON AVR-S700W QUICK START MANUAL Pdf Download. (http://www.manualslib.com/manual/715542/Denon-Avr-S700w.html)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vwirOyV0_8U

Denon AVR-X2000 vs. Denon AVRS700W - AVS Forum (http://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-receivers-amps-processors/1777378-denon-avr-x2000-vs-denon-avrs700w.html)

I still don't understand several of the settings on my Integra

[m3incorp]

Oh yes upgrading is darn expensive, the HDMI cables are the cheapest of the whole upgrade. Monprice.Com is the place to buy cables.. Do Google searches and you will discover that their $8 HDMI cables equal the performance of the expensive cables by companies we see in the stores.




Having to buy new HDMI cables is a real detourant to 4k for me, I suppose a good reason not to go high end in this area. Not to mention the expense of the gear but that can be replaced in time as needed.

It will be interesting to see what happens with 4k as DVD is still being sold. People who have seen4k says PQ is awesome though.

[Mr Peabody]

Keep in mind if you have a 4k TV it has to upconvert any incoming video signal to it's native resolution, so if that's 4k, then any other conversion in the chain isn't necessary. So pass through of the video would be fine.

[bfalls]

Oh yes upgrading is darn expensive, the HDMI cables are the cheapest of the whole upgrade. Monprice.Com is the place to buy cables.. Do Google searches and you will discover that their $8 HDMI cables equal the performance of the expensive cables by companies we see in the stores.

Unless all of your hardware is HDMI 2.0 compliant, is it really necessary to upgrade cabling? From what I've read HDMI 2.0 provide extended bandwidth (up to 18mbps), 10-12 bit deep color, 50p-60p frame rate, 32ch audio, CEC control of up to 15 devices and dual video streams to the same screen. How much of this can be utilized until after manufactures and comsumers grasp the technology? Unless you have an Atmos system and/or a 4k player capable of playing "The Hobbit" in 4K 48p or have gaming systems capable of of the higher frame rates, you're probably OK with HDMI 1.4 cabling for the time being.

[m3incorp]

For people that have HDMI cables that are rated as High Speed.

HDMI 2.0: Do I Need New Cables? Do I Need HDMI 2.0?
Fortunately for MOST consumers, existing HIGH SPEED HDMI cables that were manufactured, certified, and tested to the version 1.4x specification will meet HDMI 2.0 standards. So how does a version 1.4x cable - previously tested and certified to 10.2Gbps (for example) now meet the version 2.0 specification which states support to 18Gbps? A version 1.4x HDMI cable has 19 connector points - and up to 19 wires. In version 1.4x, only 6 wires (1 each for Red, Green, and Blue plus ground) are used for the 3.4Gbps (times 3 = 10.2Gbps). The HDMI 2.0 specification makes uses of the other connectors and wires to "spill-over" data to achieve the 18Gbps. For example, the wire controlling CEC information only was used to send a very tiny data stream of codes back and forth between HDMI devices. HDMI 2.0 protocols (for devices supporting HDMI 2.0), the additional bandwidth needed uses a more efficient signaling method as well as the additional wires to achieve this newer 18Gbps. Both the SOURCE DEVICE (such as a 4K Media Player) and the DISPLAY DEVICE (such as a 4Kx2K Ultra HDTV) must support these specific HDMI 2.0 features in order to make use of these new capabilities.




Unless all of your hardware is HDMI 2.0 compliant, is it really necessary to upgrade cabling? From what I've read HDMI 2.0 provide extended bandwidth (up to 18mbps), 10-12 bit deep color, 50p-60p frame rate, 32ch audio, CEC control of up to 15 devices and dual video streams to the same screen. How much of this can be utilized until after manufactures and comsumers grasp the technology? Unless you have an Atmos system and/or a 4k player capable of playing "The Hobbit" in 4K 48p or have gaming systems capable of of the higher frame rates, you're probably OK with HDMI 1.4 cabling for the time being.