B&W CDM 1NT vs. NHT Classic Three?

[KLJTech]

Hi guys! I'm new to this forum and hate starting with a question but I could use some help.

I own a pair of B&W CDM 1NT's (bought them new in 03) yet I can buy a brand new pair of NHT Classic Threes at a nice discount and I'm wondering if anyone here has heard both to know if the Classic threes are in anyway better than the B&W's?

I'm using a Parasound A21 to drive the B&W's and I'd be using the same amp on the Classic 3's if I did in fact go ahead and buy them. I'm using 24" Target HR stands that once again would work well for both speakers.

Obviously we're talking opinion here but I've never heard the Classic 3's and have nothing but reviews to go by thus far. John Atkinson of Stereophile told me that the Classic 3's are terrific but he's never heard the CDM 1NT's to be able to compare the two. I know that Sam Tellig raved about the CDM1 SE that my 1NT's are suppose to have improved upon. Who knows?

Any feedback would be greatly appreciated!
Kevin

[dean_martin]

I have no experience with the Classic 3s but I do have 2 pairs of the older SuperOnes and I auditioned the CDM 1NTs in my home. I decided that B&Ws were not a significant enough upgrade at the time. I'm not sure whether the B&Ws were sufficiently broken in but I expected more bass response. Maybe I'm partial to the effects of NHT's acoustic suspension design. Assuming NHT still uses that design, you should give them a listen.

[JohnMichael]

Several years ago The Absolute Sound did a review of the Classic Three and it is available on-line. They called it the best speaker for $1,000. Today they sell for less.

I heard them in an audio shop and was impressed with their imaging and detail. It has been too long to comment more. I have not heard that model of B&W. All I can say is I have owned both brands and miss the B&W's the most. Not much help and good luck making the choice.

[bfalls]

I've lusted after the NHT Classic series for some time. I always check ebay and CL for deals, but none are to be found. You rarely see used ones and I see only retail list prices for the new. If you choose to keep the B&W, pass the good Classic deal onto another brother. I would definitely be interested.

[KLJTech]

I placed the order for the pair of Classic Threes yesterday, I look forward to hearing them for the first time. I'll be surprised if they're able to replace my B&W's but I've heard nothing but great things about the Classic Threes so who knows?

[dean_martin]

I placed the order for the pair of Classic Threes yesterday, I look forward to gearing them for the firs time. I'll be surprised if they're able to replace my B&W's but I've heard nothing but great things about the Classic Threes so who knows?

Please post your impressions.

[KLJTech]

I certainly will...I've got a silver (no rack-mount) Parasound Zdac coming in later in the month as well that I'm dying to hear. I don't want to change too many pieces of gear around the same time though until I get a feel for the Classic Threes themselves.

[blackraven]

I really like the NHT Classic three's and almost bought a pair if it were not for the deal that I go on my Monitor Audio S1's. I compared them to a pair of Paradigm Mini Monitors and a pair of NHT two's blew them a way. The B&W's will have a more lively sound than the NHT's but I found the NHT's to have a more natural and forgiving sound.

I have a Parasound A21 amp and I think that it will be a better match with the NHT's than the B & W's. B & W's tweeters will be very fatiguing with the Parasound. What are you using for a preamp?

By the way, I am using a hybrid tube Preamp and DAC with the A21 and they match really well.

[KLJTech]

Good to hear, I'm hoping that they sound as nice as I've heard/read. I go back and forth between a Vincent SA-31 and a Creek OBH-22 passive preamp.

I see that you have the 1.6 Maggie's, I'm using those in my Den...Love em'. At some point I'd like to get the new 1.7's as I've heard that they're incredible. The Classic Threes are for my office but that's where I actually get to listen to music the most...the room is only 12'X13' so it's a bit small to use the Magnepan's to their full potential.

Thanks for the info.

[blackraven]

Good to hear, I'm hoping that they sound as nice as I've heard/read. I go back and forth between a Vincent SA-31 and a Creek OBH-22 passive preamp.

I see that you have the 1.6 Maggie's, I'm using those in my Den...Love em'. At some point I'd like to get the new 1.7's as I've heard that they're incredible. The Classic Threes are for my office but that's where I actually get to listen to music the most...the room is only 12'X13' so it's a bit small to use the Magnepan's to their full potential.

Thanks for the info.

I live about 20min form the Magnepan factory in White Bear Lake Mn. I got to hear the first retail pair of 1.7's in the country. While they sound better than the 1.6's, the difference is not night and day. I would rather spend the money on upgrading the electronics than going from the 1.6's to the 1.7's. Or jump up to the 3.7's.

[KLJTech]

Before ordering the NHT Classic Threes I did consider trying a pair of the little MMG's. If the Classic Threes don't impress me (I think they will) I may still go that way. I've always loved Magnepan's and so has anybody that has ever taken the time to hear them in my home. There's magic in those panels. <grin>

[blackraven]

Before ordering the NHT Classic Threes I did consider trying a pair of the little MMG's. If the Classic Threes don't impress me (I think they will) I may still go that way. I've always loved Magnepan's and so has anybody that has ever taken the time to hear them in my home. There's magic in those panels. <grin>


The MMG's are a great speaker for the price. I run my MMG's with a Grant Fidelity Tube Preamp/DAC and a Class D Audio amp. I have them pushed out near the corners of the room in my basement and they put out some surprising bass. But they do sound the best with a good sub and plenty of clean high current and dynamic power. They are a totally different speaker than the NHT's. If you decide on the MMG's and a sub, consider a non ported sub like a Martin Logan Dynamo 700 or one of the non ported compact subs from svs.com I use an original Martin Logan Dynamo with my 1.6's and they match really well. A very musical sub with nice tight bass.

[KLJTech]

Well the Classic Threes arrived on Friday, at first I though they were a tad rolled off on the top end. After burning them in a bit over the weekend I've come to the conclusion that its more likely that I had just become accustomed to slightly brighter sounding Nautilus tweeter of the B&W's. I still love my B&W's yet these NHT's have some special gifts of their own.

The NHT Classic Threes (sealed box) do require more juice to come alive than do the ported B&W's (CDM 1NT's) but when they do, they sound great and image even better than I had expected. I do wish they sounded a bit fuller at low volumes on their own but this can be fixed by simply by turning on the sub.

The only other speakers that I've had in my office that could project such a wide and DEEP soundstage as the NHT Classic Threes have been Magnepan's. This is kinda funny because the ONLY other speaker that I've been considering (after placing my order for the C3's) is the Maggie MMG which I think would work well in my small office.

I haven't used a sub with the Threes yet as I want to hear how they sound on their own. I do have two subs on hand, both sealed box designs that provide tight bass...the Velodyne DD-12 and the Velodyne Optimum 10 (the 10 is what I'll use in my office).

Thus far, I'm pretty impressed with the NHT's...I have them sitting atop Target HR 70 stands with the speakers backs only 1.5' or so out from the wall and they still image like crazy. Male and female voices sound spooky real and acoustic music sounds incredible through the NHT's. Bass is tight and goes a tad deeper than I had expected.

Right now I have the speakers firing straight ahead (no toe in) and around 6' apart and they project a VERY realistic center image with the soundstage running wall to wall (and beyond) and sounding as if it goes 10' or so behind the speakers. These .75" tweeters must have great dispersion as I hear no hole in the middle even when I sit extremely close between them.

I'd like to run them for a few days more to see if that makes any more improvements in their sound but so far I'm pretty impressed. I'd still like to hear the MMG's in this room...I didn't realize that latest version of the MMG used the Quasi-Ribbon tweeter (maybe the MMG always has and I just never paid attention to this smaller model Maggie) which I bet makes for a great sounding speaker.

[blackraven]

Every Magnepan speaker from the 1.7's down use a quasi ribbon speaker. Glad to hear you like the NHT's. I have always liked them. The Classic 2's are not far off in sound form the 3's and are a nice speaker.

[KLJTech]

Every Magnepan speaker from the 1.7's down use a quasi ribbon speaker. Glad to hear you like the NHT's. I have always liked them. The Classic 2's are not far off in sound form the 3's and are a nice speaker.


Back in the day I bought a pair of the SMG's and then moved up to the 1.5's and then later the 1.6's and never realized that the MMG had the same tweeter (just smaller). Had I known that BEFORE buying the NHT's I probably would have just ordered the MMG's for my office. I'm impressed with the Classic Threes so its not a big deal.

I may need to find a place for a pair of MMG's...do they go as loud and deep as the Classic Threes? I know that Magie bass sounds a bit different than "most" box speakers. You have both, do the MMG's do things that the Classic Threes can't and vice versa?

The larger surface area of Magnepan's and the lack of a box does wonders; they're great at making you think that "live" music is playing in your home. My 1.6's will do this as I'm walking around the house just listening to music and not thinking about the gear

Thanks in advance for any feedback.

[blackraven]

The MMG's go down to 50Hz but lack that nice bass thump. The bass is markedly improved if you can mover the MMG's out to the corner of a room. But they sound best with a good sub with tight bass. I prefer non ported subs although high end ported subs like a REL Britannia match well. The MMG's also sound better tilted forward and raised up off the floor a bit.The sweet spot as with all Maggies is small.

I think that you made a good choice with the NHT's for your office. I agree with your comparison of the NHT's to the B&W's. Some people initially don't like the NHT's compared to B&W's because the tweeters are so different. I think the NHT's produce a more natural sound.

[KLJTech]

I've let the speaker’s burn in this past week while making sure that I'm not listening during that time so that my ears aren't just adjusting to the new speakers. My opinions thus far have been based on times in which I've shut everything else down and simply took a half hour or so to just sit back and listen (only using good source material).

I think that the Classic Threes are very neutral/transparent sounding speakers and with this being the case they don't jump out at you right away like a speaker would that has either an inflated bass response or tilted up midrange/tweeter.

It struck me last night that "at times" the Classic Threes remind me a bit of the Apogee Centaur’s (not the Minor, not the Major…the middle size one that didn't require stands) that I had years ago. Mainly I’m referring to how male and female voices sound extremely lifelike and just hang in space like few others speakers I've heard. I've certainly heard this from Maggies, from the Apogee Stage and Centaur but not as often from dynamic/cone driver speakers. Maybe the key to what I’m hearing is the 2” metal done midrange and .75” metal dome tweeter…I’m not sure.

I haven’t used the Threes with either of my subs yet but both the Velodyne DD-12 and the Velodyne Optimum 10 are sealed designs and are capable of extremely tight, never-boomy bass.

[KLJTech]

I've lusted after the NHT Classic series for some time. I always check ebay and CL for deals, but none are to be found. You rarely see used ones and I see only retail list prices for the new. If you choose to keep the B&W, pass the good Classic deal onto another brother. I would definitely be interested.


I'll let you know if I decide to let the NHT Classic Threes go, I'm surprised that they can hang with the much more expensive B&W's. Blackraven is correct, the B&W's do sound a "bit" more lively (on the top end) with the Nautilus tweeter but the Classic Threes are right there with a terrific midrange, tight bass (deep and wide soundstage w/good recordings) and a very neutral overall sound.

I'm giving the Schiit Audio Lyr a shot as a preamp (LOVE it as my headphone amp) this week and it certainly gives the Classic Threes a bit more dynamic sound than they had with my Creek OBH-22 passive feeding the Halo amp. The Lyr has a ton of gain so I can only use the volume up to about 10-11 o'clock but I really like having the tube hybrid "bloom" in the mix. I could always turn the levels down on the back of the Halo to allow more rotation at the Lyr's volume but its tracking is perfect all the way down to silence so I'm not sure that adjusting the Parasound's level is worth it.

I plan on keeping only one of these speakers, either the B&W CDM-1NT's or the Classic Threes will have to go once I've made a decision. Its going to be a tough choice, that's for sure.

By the way, I added the Parasound Zdac (silver) this past month and I'm glad I did as I've been blown away by this DAC. Listening to the Zdac through the Lyr sounds incredible.