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peggy7
04-17-2004, 04:47 PM
I'm replacing my 22 yr. old Rogers bookshelf speakers. I bought a 100 watt sony receiver, and would like to spent no more than $600, though less is fine. I'm NOT an audiophile, but I'd like a really good pair of speakers. I listen to a lot of chamber music, gregorian chants, some rock, blues and other vocal music. no symphonies, modern classical or hard sounding music. my living room is 15' square and has a 7' wide opening onto the kitchen, which is 8' x 15'. There's almost no way for me, without a local store to listen to anything in, to find enough information to make an informed decision. Hope you can help, without lots of technical info, please! Thank you.

T-Bone
04-17-2004, 04:58 PM
I'm replacing my 22 yr. old Rogers bookshelf speakers. I bought a 100 watt sony receiver, and would like to spent no more than $600, though less is fine. I'm NOT an audiophile, but I'd like a really good pair of speakers. I listen to a lot of chamber music, gregorian chants, some rock, blues and other vocal music. no symphonies, modern classical or hard sounding music. my living room is 15' square and has a 7' wide opening onto the kitchen, which is 8' x 15'. There's almost no way for me, without a local store to listen to anything in, to find enough information to make an informed decision. Hope you can help, without lots of technical info, please! Thank you.

You can totally get a decent set of speakers for $600 or less. I had a similar situation face me. For your music taste, I would recommend getting a bookshelf speaker with a soft-dome tweeter. A good budget speaker would be any bookshelf from the Mission line. If you can find them, I purchased Visonik speakers (made in Berlin). They are very good for accoustic/vocal music, but don't do rock very well. Check out the websites:
www.visonik.de
www.mission.co.uk

Try to listen before you buy. If you want a brighter sound, check out B&W. I personally don't like their sound, but a LOT of people do.

Pat D
04-17-2004, 05:07 PM
I'm replacing my 22 yr. old Rogers bookshelf speakers. I bought a 100 watt sony receiver, and would like to spent no more than $600, though less is fine. I'm NOT an audiophile, but I'd like a really good pair of speakers. I listen to a lot of chamber music, gregorian chants, some rock, blues and other vocal music. no symphonies, modern classical or hard sounding music. my living room is 15' square and has a 7' wide opening onto the kitchen, which is 8' x 15'. There's almost no way for me, without a local store to listen to anything in, to find enough information to make an informed decision. Hope you can help, without lots of technical info, please! Thank you.
It is difficult to choose speakers you will like if you can't listen to them. Some people find it difficult to choose speakers they like even when they can listen to them! Not too long ago, I heard the Paradigm Monitor 5, version 3, and it was pretty impressive at the price. You might look at their Reference Series at the Paradigm Studio 20, which is a very nice speaker and you should be able to get them for not too much more than your budget. Some companies like Axiom specialize in mail order sales, and the Axiom M22Ti has gotten good reviews and measures pretty well.

Mark111867
04-17-2004, 06:08 PM
I was recently on the hunt for a pair of bookshelf speakers. I checked out a bunch of companies. KEF, Boston Acoustics, Paradigm, Athena Technologies, B&W, & Klipsch, to name a few. Top of my budget was a couple of hundred dollars less than your max. I ended up buying a pair of Cambridge Soundworks Newton M-80 speakers. They are $400, but check e-bay. Sometimes they are on there for $249. The M-80's seem to play most music pretty well (IMO). Most of what I listen to is folk and classical. Rock also sounds good. Others that I also thought sounded nice were the Boston Acoustics CR-85 ($400) and the Paradigm Titans (can't remember, maybe in the $200 range?). As Pat D mentioned, the Axiom M-22's seem to have created a buzz, but I have never heard them, so really can't comment on them. Mirage Speakers might be something to check out as well. I have owned a pair of M-290 bookshelf speakers for close to ten years and can't say enough good about them. Good luck:)

N. Abstentia
04-17-2004, 06:24 PM
For your budget and music tastes, the Paradigm Studio 20 would be at the top of my list.

RGA
04-17-2004, 07:04 PM
I'm replacing my 22 yr. old Rogers bookshelf speakers. I bought a 100 watt sony receiver, and would like to spent no more than $600, though less is fine. I'm NOT an audiophile, but I'd like a really good pair of speakers. I listen to a lot of chamber music, gregorian chants, some rock, blues and other vocal music. no symphonies, modern classical or hard sounding music. my living room is 15' square and has a 7' wide opening onto the kitchen, which is 8' x 15'. There's almost no way for me, without a local store to listen to anything in, to find enough information to make an informed decision. Hope you can help, without lots of technical info, please! Thank you.

You're going to find a big difference with todays speakers especially many slim line designs using metal tweeters which may sound hollow and shrill. Because of the music you listen to I think you can save some money - a fair amount actually and get the Mission M72 (Anything in the M70 line I would take over the afformentioned Paradigm 20V2) (Not the M50 series however) and you'll probably save $300.00 or more). But again this is taste - but don't assume because it costs more it's better - a lot of money from some companies goes into heavy heavy advertising with zero sonic benefit. Some companies are in it solely for the profit others are interested primarily because they have a passion for what they're doing(like a rich man's hobby).

Again though you need to find a way to listen because people love speakers I hate and vice versa and unless YOU listen you simply won't know. As EVERY speaker gets a good review reviews become useless, as two speakers measure very similarly and sound totally different they too are useless.

There are many speakers at $400.00 that I like better than speakers costing $1500.00 as some of the former models may lack a bit of bass but sound relatively smooth and non-fatiguing while some $1500.00 speakers can rock the house but become very fatiguing after 15 minutes.

There is not a whole lot of sense even in me recommending Mission - but they generally sound smooth.

If buying unheard I would rather recommend a "SAFE" sounding speaker over ones that many feel are bright - many don't but many do so Mission is a bit safer. Speakers from LINN are also pretty smooth. http://www.hifichoice.co.uk/review_read.asp?ID=2095

Another should include: The B&W 602S3 which should be ~$550.00US and will probably offer the boldest full sounding speakers in the price range with a lot of deep powerful bass response and offers up credible dynamics where as some more expensive offerrings from paradigm and Energy thin out and sound conjested. Best of all it's cheaper. http://www.hifichoice.co.uk/review_read.asp?ID=2451

92135011
04-17-2004, 10:47 PM
try out Quad 11L

nusiclover
04-19-2004, 12:49 AM
for your type of music, id second the b&w 602 and the Quad 11L

Bryan
04-19-2004, 05:30 AM
Could look at the Shamrock Audio (http://www.shamrockaudio.com) Eilish for $499 delivered (look at both Shamrock's message board and the one at audiocircle.com for more information about it), Odyssey (http://www.odysseyaudio.com) Epiphany for $595 (unsure about shipping), or possibly the Magnepan (http://www.magnepan.com) MMG for $550 delivered.

manek
04-20-2004, 12:24 AM
try the quad 11L/12L
B&W 602.S3
wharfedale diamond 8.2, evo 10.

royphil345
04-20-2004, 04:20 AM
Don't know how long I'd want to listen to Quad, B&W, or Paradigm hooked up to a Sony reciever. How well would it drive Magnepans? Like the Wharfedale Diamond, Mission and Cambridge Soundworks ideas. Might even try the Sony SS-MB350H ($99.00 pair)possibly with the SA-WX700 sub ($250.00) for your rock and blues. Or the Sony SS-MF750H towers ($220.00 pair) if you have room. Might just like them and get off cheap!!!

Bryan
04-20-2004, 07:15 AM
I'd go with the JBL E90s over the Sony towers. Granted, twice as much but better sounding, IMO. Also could check out used speakers at audiogon.com in order to save some money.

royphil345
04-20-2004, 09:20 PM
Thought the last series they had were a little muddy sounding and the Studio Series were a little too lean. The new ones I heard when I checked out the Sonys sounded about right to me. Very similar to the Sonys though. JBL doesn't give you HUGE bass without going to the larger drivers. Highs pretty good, but not the absolute best. A more detailed speaker might sound harsh when driven by a Sony receiver anyway and it's capabilities wasted. Think either speaker would be a pretty good choice. I couldn't pass up the Sony Towers for $100.00 each though. Thought they sounded just a tad bit warmer than the JBL which I guess is just what I like. I know it's hard to believe Sony makes a halfway decent speaker now but... When hooked up at home with some decent electronics and wire they sound way better than they have a right to for the price.

46minaudio
04-21-2004, 04:52 AM
You're going to find a big difference with todays speakers especially many slim line designs using metal tweeters which may sound hollow and shrill. Because of the music you listen to I think you can save some money - a fair amount actually and get the Mission M72 (Anything in the M70 line I would take over the afformentioned Paradigm 20V2) (Not the M50 series however) and you'll probably save $300.00 or more). But again this is taste - but don't assume because it costs more it's better - a lot of money from some companies goes into heavy heavy advertising with zero sonic benefit. Some companies are in it solely for the profit others are interested primarily because they have a passion for what they're doing(like a rich man's hobby).

Again though you need to find a way to listen because people love speakers I hate and vice versa and unless YOU listen you simply won't know. As EVERY speaker gets a good review reviews become useless, as two speakers measure very similarly and sound totally different they too are useless.

There are many speakers at $400.00 that I like better than speakers costing $1500.00 as some of the former models may lack a bit of bass but sound relatively smooth and non-fatiguing while some $1500.00 speakers can rock the house but become very fatiguing after 15 minutes.

There is not a whole lot of sense even in me recommending Mission - but they generally sound smooth.

If buying unheard I would rather recommend a "SAFE" sounding speaker over ones that many feel are bright - many don't but many do so Mission is a bit safer. Speakers from LINN are also pretty smooth. http://www.hifichoice.co.uk/review_read.asp?ID=2095

Another should include: The B&W 602S3 which should be ~$550.00US and will probably offer the boldest full sounding speakers in the price range with a lot of deep powerful bass response and offers up credible dynamics where as some more expensive offerrings from paradigm and Energy thin out and sound conjested. Best of all it's cheaper. http://www.hifichoice.co.uk/review_read.asp?ID=2451

Speakers from LINN are also pretty smooth. http://www.hifichoice.co.uk/review_read.asp?ID=2095

Another should include: The B&W 602S3 which should be ~$550.00US and will probably offer the boldest full sounding speakers in the price range with a lot of deep powerful bass response and offers up credible dynamics where as some more expensive offerrings from paradigm and Energy thin out and sound conjested. Best of all it's cheaper. http://www.hifichoice.co.uk/review_read.asp?ID=2451

As EVERY speaker gets a good review reviews become useless,
Yet you seem to have no problem posting them...

RGA
04-21-2004, 07:48 PM
I try not to post from magazines that like everything. And while there is an irony in my postings - I do at least make the warning not to go by reviews. Since Audio Note doesn't advertise they have to let the sound sell itself - on that they have little to worry about. However, since people are being barraged with mega corporations advertising in every magazine with full page spreads and product placements on tv shows and even dialog in movies then fans of companies' speakers will have to get the word out to just listen. The reviews are there to hopefully get people to audition them so they might get to own the same speakers the reviewers have decided to purchase and listen to in their lives as references rather than justthe speakers they give a review to and quickly let them go.

Soundbro
04-22-2004, 09:57 PM
I recently purchased Studio 20s for a similar listening situation and room for just over $600. I can't imagine you'd be disappointed, but you really should go to a dealer and hear them or arrange a demo period so you could return them if unsatisfied. Everyone's tastes are too different to offer a quantitative reply.

3db
04-23-2004, 05:56 AM
I'm replacing my 22 yr. old Rogers bookshelf speakers. I bought a 100 watt sony receiver, and would like to spent no more than $600, though less is fine. I'm NOT an audiophile, but I'd like a really good pair of speakers. I listen to a lot of chamber music, gregorian chants, some rock, blues and other vocal music. no symphonies, modern classical or hard sounding music. my living room is 15' square and has a 7' wide opening onto the kitchen, which is 8' x 15'. There's almost no way for me, without a local store to listen to anything in, to find enough information to make an informed decision. Hope you can help, without lots of technical info, please! Thank you.

I highly recommend these speakers. I use the smaller versions, the Image 1 for my surrounds and I a m still astounded at the sound that this little speaker can put out. It uses a 5 1/2" woofer and a 1' aluminun done. Although deep bass is lacking (no suprise there because of their size) , the acoustic bass in Dianna Krall's "Love Scene" CD still comes in suprisingly strong. Vocals are clean and well presented. Tchiakowski's violin concerto in D comes across unfailing smooth and clear. I've never heard violins play this high and I own a lot of classical music. The Image 1Bs render this very well without sounding the least bit sharp or shrill. Just detailed.

I recommend the 2Bs because they use the same tweeter as the 1Bs but use a larger 6 1/2'" woofer compared to the 1B's 5 1/2" . The midrange and the highs of the 1B and 2B ar comparable. However, the bass output of the 2Bs is much better than the 1B because of its larger driver and cabinet size. Give the 2Bs a listen and tell us what you think.

royphil345
04-23-2004, 07:12 PM
I notice that Sony receivers (unless it's an ES series) do usually have a slightly compressed sound. Rolled off highs and a little light on the bass. I think any speaker with aluminum tweeters or a really crisp high end would be risky. Would probably get harshness instead of detail. Many places will let you send speakers back if you don't like them though, so I guess anything's worth a try if you're careful. PSBs can sound really nice. All of the speakers recommended on this thread are fine speakers.

jwh
05-03-2004, 01:49 PM
It's got to be the quad 11L/12L. I've owned most of the speakers listed with the additions of PSB image and stratus monitors, I guess I can't drop the upgrade bug. The Quads are by far the most speaker for the money. Additionally, if you're married, no other speaker listed, in fact none other under $2000, matches them in quality and finish. There is no guess why what hifi has named them monitor of the year for like 3 years now. The B&W
is a great piece, the 602, but not the finish. I have a pair of Signature 805's now for my mains in red bird's eye which was an upgrade from the quads. The finish is no better, however, sound is but they cost $3000 more.

Got to be the Quads.

Hope is helps.

RGA
05-03-2004, 04:56 PM
It's got to be the quad 11L/12L. I've owned most of the speakers listed with the additions of PSB image and stratus monitors, I guess I can't drop the upgrade bug. The Quads are by far the most speaker for the money. Additionally, if you're married, no other speaker listed, in fact none other under $2000, matches them in quality and finish. There is no guess why what hifi has named them monitor of the year for like 3 years now. The B&W
is a great piece, the 602, but not the finish. I have a pair of Signature 805's now for my mains in red bird's eye which was an upgrade from the quads. The finish is no better, however, sound is but they cost $3000 more.

Got to be the Quads.

Hope is helps.

Quad certainly appears to be a good speaker to add to an audition list. I especially like what they say here:

"The tweeter unit is derived from a thorough understanding of high frequency acoustics. Although it is now fashionable to use metal dome tweeters, the supposed extra bandwidth (within the inaudible area of the sonic spectrum) these create, often comes at a heavy price - the often unpleasant 'tizz' of such drive units significantly hardens the sound and can sound very fatiguing. It is better, we believe, to make the audible frequency as accurate and precise as possible with a very relaxed, yet precise performance. This gives the Quad 22L a laid-back air of authority - never trying too hard, or sounding strained and unpleasant - but with no loss of detail. It is also a misconception that silk domes have a limited frequency response. We test every tweeter beyond 37Khz, way beyond the threshold of audibility. They have a useful response to around 50kHz"

You may or may not know that I generally dislike metal tweeters.

As for the wood though - It is a veneer like most spekaers in the price range - it may look nice but better than every speaker listed in this thread? My speakers are full Russian Birch front and back and the expensive B&W's no doubt have a higher grade wood. Not that this is overly important but still.

You also need to be a little cautious of What Hi-Fi --- I generally like the magazine but I have oftened liked speakers getting 4 stars over what they give 5. What-Hi fi projects a value rating per dollar as well as looks finishes and features. Did you know for example that they awarded the Roksan Integrated amp product of the year but said the Sugden A21a in the test group SOUNDED the best? The Sugden lost marks on features, looks and all things unrelated to SOUND quality. So if you were in the market and cared only about sound then you might miss out if you only paid attention to what got Product of the year. Now in this case the Quad they ay feel is the best all-rounder and with the quote and use of non-metal drivers have me on their side to a degree before I even listen - because the competition largely uses metal tweeters and all have the Tizzy Zing to one degree or another.

Mash
05-03-2004, 05:43 PM
Peggy7

If you cannot audition any speaker candidates you have a problem.

But!

Surf to Magnepan.com and consider their "pair of MMG's fpr $550 delivered" deal! You will have 2 full months (70 days, actually) to accept the MMG's, or send them back for $40. The MMG bass response is limited to 50 Hz but that should not be a problem for your stated requirements. If you want musical detail unmatched by any bookshelf, these are for you.

RGA
05-03-2004, 09:38 PM
Wow and you have heard every standmount? Detail = distorion IMO.

Ohh and Peggy ask most any high end dealer and they will allow you to take home a speaker to try for a weekend or a week or longer for free - sometimes let you take several home at a time to A/B them. Goes for any product - best of all you won't get dinged $40.00.

Heck some outlets that sell Audio Note will let you keep them for a year and if you want to upgrade they'll give you 100% to upgrade to another product in their line. B&W and many ooffer that. It's more of a dealer thing than a manufacturer thing but not bad none theless.

Though I agree with MASH in that you should definitely try and listen to a Magnepan or planar - the more designs you can hear the beter off you'll be. There is a dealer here that has Magnepan and when i'm in Vancouver in a few weeks I'll head down and listen to them - they carry the flagship model so I'll be excited to hear them. They carry the Linn $20K cd player and some lovely amps from Krell and Mark Levinson in well appointed rooms. I know my dealer does not like Magnepan so to each their own(which is why I say listen to lots of different designs) - just like most things.