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electronicsprof2
11-11-2011, 11:32 AM
I have been trying to build up a new system in my second home for a year or so without breaking the bank.
I have a very good quality CD and turntable, and a very nice set of PSB Image T6 speakers, but the bass seemed weak and the dynamics just weren't there; it didn't seem to make sense.
My first home has a $30k system with an Audio Research LS-26 preamp and 3B-SST Bryston amp with Vandersteen speakers and subs, so my standards are kind of high re sound quality.
I decided that the NAD C356BEE amp I was using had to be the culprit, but I wasn't absolutely sure.
Anyway, I ordered a Musical Fidelity M3i from Audio Advisor becuse of the 30-day free trail they give, and 10 minutes after I hooked it up, I knew it wasn't going back.
I was totally unprepared for how wonderful this amplifier sounds. It is drop-dead gorgeous. I have never heard anything better for under $4k, and it is close enough to my big system at the other house that I can listen and not feel too disadvantaged...lol.
This is a remarkable amplifier for $1500; no two ways about it.

Jack in Wilmington
11-11-2011, 12:25 PM
I have been trying to build up a new system in my second home for a year or so without breaking the bank.
I have a very good quality CD and turntable, and a very nice set of PSB Image T6 speakers, but the bass seemed weak and the dynamics just weren't there; it didn't seem to make sense.
My first home has a $30k system with an Audio Research LS-26 preamp and 3B-SST Bryston amp with Vandersteen speakers and subs, so my standards are kind of high re sound quality.
I decided that the NAD C356BEE amp I was using had to be the culprit, but I wasn't absolutely sure.
Anyway, I ordered a Musical Fidelity M3i from Audio Advisor becuse of the 30-day free trail they give, and 10 minutes after I hooked it up, I knew it wasn't going back.
I was totally unprepared for how wonderful this amplifier sounds. It is drop-dead gorgeous. I have never heard anything better for under $4k, and it is close enough to my big system at the other house that I can listen and not feel too disadvantaged...lol.
This is a remarkable amplifier for $1500; no two ways about it.

I checked this amp out when I was looking. It drove my Ushers fine, but felt it didn't have enough power to drive my Dynaudios. That's when I looked at the Krell, Bryston and Anthem.

frenchmon
11-11-2011, 02:25 PM
Jack you had the MF in your home? Did you write up a review of it? IF not what was it like? Was it bright, warm, tube like in sound? Give me the skinny.

Jack in Wilmington
11-11-2011, 06:35 PM
Jack you had the MF in your home? Did you write up a review of it? IF not what was it like? Was it bright, warm, tube like in sound? Give me the skinny.

Right after I got the Dyns, I brought one home for a weekend trial. It didn't take me long to realize that I liked my Jolida better. I then hooked the M3i up to my Ushers and it drove them beautifully. I took the M3i back on Saturday morning and asked them what else I could take home. They had just hooked a pair of Ayre MX-R mono blocks to the Wilson Sophias and had an Audio Research DSi200 that was looking for a home. The DSi200 handled the Dyns so well that I guess I forgot all about writing up the M3i.

frenchmon
11-11-2011, 06:43 PM
I would love to have that Musical Fidelity Primo preamp...its got 6 tubes in it....and cost about $10,000. So I guess I will never have one.

electronicsprof2
11-12-2011, 08:21 AM
My PSB Image T6 speakers are very efficient (89 db/W), and with most speakers the M3i will have enough power (80-100W). The M3i is wonderful with them and has plenty of power.

Obviously, you must feel you need more power for your speakers, but that will not be a problem for most people. I wonder why you would need more than 100 watts, since your speakers are rated at 86 db/W; that is pretty efficient. That means you will get 106 db at 100W; serious loudness! The 200W of the AR will of course give you 109db; twice as loud.

One thing confuses me. The Ushers are rated 88db/W by the manufacturer, and your Dynaudios are rated at 86 db/W, which is a small difference. Well...the Ushers ARE a little more efficient. 2db is 2 db. Guess that could be significant in which amp will work, or not.

So, let's see...you got the Audio Research DSi200, which sells for $6000, and it sounded better than the $1500 Musical Fidelity amp....duhhhhh....why doesn't that surprise me?

I have the Bryston 3B-SST in my big system, and it is excellent with the AR LS-26 preamp (at the other house). I have not found anything that sounds better in the $10,000 price range. than that amp/preamp combo.

But the whole point of my post was that I was looking for an outstanding amplifier for under $2000; I found one.







I checked this amp out when I was looking. It drove my Ushers fine, but felt it didn't have enough power to drive my Dynaudios. That's when I looked at the Krell, Bryston and Anthem.

electronicsprof2
11-12-2011, 08:29 AM
If you can audition the Audio Research LS-17, which most dealers will sell for around $3300, you just might fall in love with it and perhaps that's one you can afford. It's very very good! It now uses the 6H30 supertube, which is an incredible rugged low-noise tube developed by the Russians for hi-tech aerospace applications in the 1980s. Up to now they only used that tube in the Reference and LS26/27 preamps, which are pretty expensive but wonderful.

I have been using the LS-26 for about 4 years now, and even the AR reference, for $12,000, is only a bit better; sound to die for. They just don't get much better. An LS-26 used might be had for $4000...IF there is anyone who would let theirs go...I never will!




I would love to have that Musical Fidelity Primo preamp...its got 6 tubes in it....and cost about $10,000. So I guess I will never have one.

Jack in Wilmington
11-12-2011, 09:03 AM
My PSB Image T6 speakers are very efficient, and with most speakers the M3i will have enough power (80-100W). The M3i is wonderful with them and has plenty of power.

Obviously, you must feel you need more power for your speakers, but that will not be a problem for most people.

So, let's see...you got the Audio Research DSi200, which sells for $6000, and it sounded better than the $1500 Musical Fidelity amp....duhhhhh....why doesn't that surprise me?

I have the Bryston 3B-SST in my big system, and it is excellent with the AR LS-26 preamp (at the other house). I have not found anything that sounds better in the $10,000 price range.

The Ayre monoblocks are that much, Wow. Way out of my league, as are the Sophias. The Krell that I looked at (S300i) is $2500 and the Bryston (B100-SST) runs $4700.

The DSi200 did sound better than the M3i on my speakers. But it might not on your speakers, and then you have a bargain. That's the odd thing about this hobby, you can take $10,000 speakers and a $10,000 amp, put them together and it sounds like crap sometimes. There are no rules.

electronicsprof2
11-12-2011, 09:27 AM
No rules is right!!!

I started my quest for a decent system in 1980 by buying a pair of Polk RTA-12 speakers for $1200.

They were pretty good speakers; sounded wonderful at Absolute Audio, which was run by Neil Sinclair then. They sounded like **** when I got them home. A not-so-good amp (an old Award series Harmon-Kardon 50W integrated) and a piss-poor turntable might have had something to do with it...rofl.

After buying a Harmon-Kardon turntable for $500, which was quite good, a better cartridge, and a NAD 3020 amplifier, things were much much better! Not quite SOTA, but getting better!

After many many years of saving, listening and more listening and saving my pennies, I gradually got better and better stuff; it was NOT without great effort and lots of auditioning of stuff. Lots of expensive stuff went from the store to my house and went back again after failing the listening tests.

Good stuff usually isn't cheap...but expensive is no guarantee of good sound quality.

I have never listened to that particular amp from AR; the guy I have done business with for years mainly sells Audio Research equipment and Vandersteen speakers, and he doesn't like the 200; a tube man all the way...lol. But it was more money than I was up for for my second system, and my #1 system is pretty much set in stone with the LS-26, 3B-SST, and the Vandersteens.






The Ayre monoblocks are that much, Wow. Way out of my league, as are the Sophias. The Krell that I looked at (S300i) is $2500 and the Bryston (B100-SST) runs $4700.

The DSi200 did sound better than the M3i on my speakers. But it might not on your speakers, and then you have a bargain. That's the odd thing about this hobby, you can take $10,000 speakers and a $10,000 amp, put them together and it sounds like crap sometimes. There are no rules.

Jack in Wilmington
11-12-2011, 12:22 PM
I took the 200 home because it's an integrated like my old Jolida, with a lot more power. When I was auditioning my Anthem they had it in a room with Vandy 2CE Sig II speakers. They also had a pair of Totem Winds, Paradigm Sig 2's, and Golden Ear Triton Twos. The Vandys sounded good, but the Totems sounded better. That was my first experience with Vandys. I had always heard they were a love/hate type of speaker like Thiels and Maggies. You must like yours, cause they're in your No. 1 system.

electronicsprof2
11-16-2011, 05:25 AM
My experience with Vandersteens is that everyone pretty much likes them, but some people think that they are too mellow. They are definitely not an "in-your-face" type of speaker that just blows you away with their "hi-fi" presentation. I don't think its really a love-hate thing, just which flavor suits you...lol.

When you put them with an amplifier that complements them, though, they get everything absolutely right. The model 2s, which I used to have, tend to sound bass-shy with many amplifiers, which is not good. The model 3, which I have, is much better all around, but a bit pricey these days at $4500 (they were $2800 when I bought them many years ago). I also have two Vandersteen 2W subs, which I kick in for huge kettledrums or pipe organ music or that sort of thing that goes way way low.

Another issue with the model 2s (and 3s) is that they are fussy about where you place them in the room in order for them to sound their best; I have seen them in showrooms where they are definitely NOT giving the bass or imaging they can give because of poor placement.

Once you get them set up properly, they are impressive.

For the money ($1200) I am very happy with the PSB Image T6 speakers. They are not big enough to go super-low in the bass, but for 98% of my music, they do very well; especially with the M3i amp. IT's an extremely nice system for the money. I would think you would have a hard time equaling it for the price.

I have been very impressed with PSB and KEF speakers generally; I think both companies put out products that perform very well at their price points (I have the KEF iQ9 speakers in my AV system at my big house).

I have never heard the Totem Winds, but for $14,000 they should be pretty damn good if they expect to sell them. A fair comparison would be to put them up against the $10,000 Vandersteen Quattros, I guess. That's more than I would care to spend on ANY speaker, in any case. A retired teacher can only stretch the budget so far, lol.

(by the way; is that Wlimington, CA or Delaware...?)





I took the 200 home because it's an integrated like my old Jolida, with a lot more power. When I was auditioning my Anthem they had it in a room with Vandy 2CE Sig II speakers. They also had a pair of Totem Winds, Paradigm Sig 2's, and Golden Ear Triton Twos. The Vandys sounded good, but the Totems sounded better. That was my first experience with Vandys. I had always heard they were a love/hate type of speaker like Thiels and Maggies. You must like yours, cause they're in your No. 1 system.

JohnMichael
11-16-2011, 07:10 AM
I have been enjoying the Krell S-300i in my system. It is a very powerful integrated amp for it's $2,500 price. The amp is neutral with strong extended bass and detailed but not bright upper frequencies. The amp drives my Monitor Audio RS 6's easily and with excellent control.

I wanted an amp that I could use for many years and drive just about any speaker I might afford. A $2500 amp driving a pair of $1000 speakers is making some great music. Of course what brought it together was the synergy achieved when I installed the AntiCable speaker cables. Amp, cables and speakers now have a wonderful partnership and together they produce the best sounds I have had in a home system.

Jack in Wilmington
11-16-2011, 07:23 AM
My experience with Vandersteens is that everyone pretty much likes them, but some people think that they are too mellow. They are definitely not an "in-your-face" type of speaker that just blows you away with their "hi-fi" presentation. I don't think its really a love-hate thing, just which flavor suits you...lol.

When you put them with an amplifier that complements them, though, they get everything absolutely right. The model 2s, which I used to have, tend to sound bass-shy with many amplifiers, which is not good. The model 3, which I have, is much better all around, but a bit pricey these days at $4500 (they were $2800 when I bought them many years ago). I also have two Vandersteen 2W subs, which I kick in for huge kettledrums or pipe organ music or that sort of thing that goes way way low.

Another issue with the model 2s (and 3s) is that they are fussy about where you place them in the room in order for them to sound their best; I have seen them in showrooms where they are definitely NOT giving the bass or imaging they can give because of poor placement.

Once you get them set up properly, they are impressive.

For the money ($1200) I am very happy with the PSB Image T6 speakers. They are not big enough to go super-low in the bass, but for 98% of my music, they do very well; especially with the M3i amp. IT's an extremely nice system for the money. I would think you would have a hard time equaling it for the price.

I have been very impressed with PSB and KEF speakers generally; I think both companies put out products that perform very well at their price points (I have the KEF iQ9 speakers in my AV system at my big house).

I have never heard the Totem Winds, but for $14,000 they should be pretty damn good if they expect to sell them. A fair comparison would be to put them up against the $10,000 Vandersteen Quattros, I guess. That's more than I would care to spend on ANY speaker, in any case. A retired teacher can only stretch the budget so far, lol.

(by the way; is that Wlimington, CA or Delaware...?)

Wilmington, De. I didn't even know there was a Wilmington, Ca.
My wife is a retired teacher also, so I know about the budget not stretching like it used to.

My dealer has just recently added the Vandys and Totems so I'm sure they're still tweeking the setups on both. Now that I'm retired I'll have more time to go and check out both speakers.