Diet soda linked to stroke, cardiac risk

[Smokey]

I drink two to three regular sodas a day, and this news about diet soda which suppose to be healthier (for lack of better word :D) is not too comforting.

LOS ANGELES - It's far from definitive proof, but new research raises concern about diet soda, finding higher risks for stroke and heart attack among people who drink it everyday versus those who drink no soda at all.

"This needs to be viewed as a preliminary study but for those trying to cut calories, diet soft drinks may not be an optimal substitute for sugar-sweetened beverages," said lead researcher Hannah Gardener of the University of Miami.

The numbers come from the Northern Manhattan study, which enrolled about 2,500 adults over 40 in the New York area from 1993 to 2001 through random phone calls. Participants filled out a standard survey about their diets at the start of the study, and their health was tracked for nearly 10 years. In that time there were 559 strokes or heart attacks, 338 of them fatal.

Daily diet soda drinkers (there were 116 in the study) had a 48 percent higher risk of stroke or heart attack than people who drank no soda of any kind (901 people, or 35 percent of total participants). That's after taking into account rates of smoking, diabetes, waistline size and other differences among the groups.

No significant differences in risk were seen among people who drank a mix of diet and regular soda.

A simple solution, health experts say, is to drink water instead.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/41499101

[Mr Peabody]

I drink diet soda. I started drinking it way back when my wife developed some sugar issues during her pregnancy. Once I got used to it I couldn't stand how sweet regular soda was. Smokey you sure know how to ruin a guy's day :)

[rakeford]

I quit drinking the crap about 35 years ago. It has no redeeming values.

1. It make you fat.

2. It rots your teeth.

3. It make you burp

4. It tastes bad.

5. It cost too much.

6. It make make you enjoy all those silly commercials.

[JohnMichael]

I reduced my consumption of diet beverages due to irritation to the bladder. Now I drink coffee in the morning until noon. Filtered water until around 8 o'clock in the evening and then wine until I can crawl in bed with myself.

I also found artificial sweetners cause problems with my sinus and auditory canals. I could not drink carboanated diet beverages and be able to hear components/speakers I might be auditioning.

[Smokey]

I am guessing Soda witrh all that caffeeine and suger can be addictive, although that might be too strong of a word. Some foods such as Hamburgers, Sandwitches, Pizza, Burritos and some snacks really can not be enjoyed without soda as water leaves kind of after taste. It seem the fattier the food, the more it require soda.

Tried diet soda but most of them taste like soda that has gone flat with no bites. And it even taste worse with food.

There is actually a soda that is good for you called Yogurt soda which have no calories, suger or caffeine and it taste awesome. But anytime ask my local grocer if they stock it, I get a blank stir.

[thekid]

I was drinking about 4-6 cans of Diet Coke a day (even learned to drink it warm when we were without power for several weeks after a hurricane...). It is addictive even though I do not need the caffeine. I managed to stop completely for awhile but recently started back up to a can or two. This news, while not surprising, means I need to get back to drinking water.

[Feanor]

I don't drink much soda; perhaps three cans a week, but all of it's diet. I drink diet to keep the calories down but even more not irritate my GERD, (gastroesophageal reflux disease).

I drink about 3 cups of coffee a day -- too much. I drink 1-2 cups of tea and 1 beer or glass of red wine. Other than that its fruit juice, mostly orange, or water.

Hey, Smokey, given up on the ciggs yet? I dare say even more harmful than the diet sodas.

[Mr Peabody]

I'v never heard of diet soda messing with sinus. Maybe a week or two without it just to see what happens might be good. I drink water but variety is the spice of life, right, I need something to change out once in a while. I do have a bit of tea.

[3LB]

I heard this on the radio a week ago - I did drink three or four a day, but haven't had one since. Damn, what are supposed to drink? Water is boring.

[Smokey]

Hey, Smokey, given up on the ciggs yet? I dare say even more harmful than the diet sodas.

And more expensive. Last tally is $200 a month on ciggs http://www.sherv.net/cm/emo/smoke/smiley.gif


Damn, what are supposed to drink? Water is boring

Try Cranberry juice on ice. Very refreshing.

[RGA]

A friend told me about a test where they fed Aspertame to 50 rats at a rat sized dosage - they all died from brain hemorrhages. Interestingly, I used to drink huge amounts of diet pop and I would feel this severe pain in my head like I was being electro-shocked. It was instant and would go away. Suffice it to say I drink it a lot less. I also try to buy pop or diet lemonaid that contains Splenda as it has been around a lot longer and to my knowledge doesn't have these issues. Some soda brands - Diet Rite and oddly some of the cheaper house brands use it instead of Aspertame.

Mostly I drink coffee and tea, V8 (low sodium) and water and the occasional fruit juice. Coffee though can give you a headache withdrawal when you have it a lot and then stop.

If you want to have coffee with less caffeine drink the BOLD and Extra Bold variety as it has a lot less caffeine than medium roasts. It tastes stronger though - but it's not. Probably why mild roast is called the morning coffee because it has the most caffeine.

[noddin0ff]

A friend told me about a test where they fed Aspertame to 50 rats at a rat sized dosage - they all died from brain hemorrhages.

Well, since I once went on at great length about asparteme on this board, (http://forums.audioreview.com/showpost.php?p=143756&postcount=3) I have to cry bull**** here. No personal assault intended. Anecdotes are just that.

I'd also comment that the key author of the study emphasizes that "It's too preliminary to suggest any dietary advice." (http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2011/feb/9/diet-soda-tied-to-stroke-risk-but-reasons-unclear/) I'd just point out that the media are picking up on something Gardener presented in a talk, not a peer reviewed publication. And, that the abstract of her talk clearly indicates that her primary intention was to present data on sodium, not on diet drinks. Abstract below.

The use of "preliminary" in science conversations is always interesting. It can mean anything from uncertain to intriguing. But mostly it suggests that one should be skeptical. And, by skeptical, I don't mean 'unbelieving'. Belief has nothing to do with it. One should just look hard at the results and context before jumping to conclusions. So, for kicks...

One large study I looked up put the frequency of stroke for individuals age 55 or older at ~5% and around 7% for those 65-84, looking at 19,132 Europeans (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10854359)

Another study of 10,647 persons (Spain) has it at 6.4% for persons 70 and over with a range of 3.8-8.7% prevalence when you look at rural vs urban and 5.6-7.3 when you look at women vs. men. (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17042941)

I'm not really trying to be definitive, just took the first hits I got from my search.

The study abstract below's mean age was 69, so lets take a rate of 6% as a simple number and assume Europeans and Northern Manhattenites (I don't really know where the people in the study came from) are similar.

The press articles (http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2011/feb/9/diet-soda-tied-to-stroke-risk-but-reasons-unclear/) say there were 116 daily diet soda drinkers and that they had a 48% higher risk of stroke or heart attack than those who drank no soda.

At a 6% risk, out of 116 people you would expect 7 to have strokes. At a 48% increased risk, you could estimate the observed # strokes at 10 (actual study figures not know to me).

10 is 8.6% of 116, and not that different from the rates given above.

A difference of 3 strokes between these groups is all it takes to make the press jump all over a story on diet drinks?:nono:

Sounds weak to me. Bigger studies are necessary to see if this difference wasn't just a fluke. If you flipped a coin 100 times and got 47 heads, a difference of 3 heads from the expected average, would you cry out that the coin was rigged? No, you'd want to do more trials first.

Link to published abstracts for the International Stroke Conference Oral Presentations (http://stroke.ahajournals.org/cgi/reprint/STR.0b013e3182074d88)

Dietary Sodium Intake is a Risk Factor for Incident Ischemic Stroke: The
Northern Manhattan Study (NOMAS)
Hannah Gardener, Tatjana Rundek, Clinton Wright, Univ of Miami Miller Sch of Medicine,
Miami, FL; Norbelina Disla, Mitchell S Elkind, Columbia Univ, New York, NY; Ralph L Sacco;Univ of Miami Miller Sch of Medicine, Miami, FL

The American Heart Association (AHA) recommends limiting sodium intake to less than 1500mg daily to achieve ideal cardiovascular health. Although dietary sodium intake has been linked to vascular disease by direct relationship to the development of hypertension, few studies have supported an association between sodium intake and risk of ischemic stroke. The study population included participants of the Northern Manhattan Study, a multi-ethnic populationbased cohort study of stroke-free individuals to examine the incidence and risk factors for stroke. Participants completed a baseline food frequency questionnaire and total daily sodium intake was calculated from responses using DIETSYS software. Sodium intake was evaluated continuously and by five levels of consumption: ables: age, sex, race/ethnicity, education, alcohol use, physical activity, total daily caloric consumption, smoking, diabetes, hypercholesterolemia, hypertension, and previous cardiac disease. Of 2657 participants who completed a food questionnaire with valid diet data, the mean age was 69 +/-10 years, 64% were women, 21% white non-Hispanic, 53% Hispanic, and 24% black non-Hispanic. The mean daily sodium intake was 3031 mg +/-1470, median 2787 mg (IQR 1966-3815 mg). Over a mean follow-up of 9.7 years, 187 ischemic strokes occurred. When dietary sodium intake was modeled continuously, a 16% increased risk of ischemic stroke was observed for each 500 mg increase in daily consumption (95% CI: 1.06-1.27). Subjects who consumed 4000 mg sodium daily had an increased risk of ischemic stroke (adjusted HR 2.29; 95% CI: 1.07-4.92) as compared to those who consumed chemic stroke. The new AHA strategic dietary goals will help promote ideal cardiovascular, as well as brain health. This evidence may be used in campaigns aimed at reducing cardiovascular disease risk by targeting dietary behavior.

Author Disclosures: H. Gardener: None. T. Rundek: None. C. Wright: None. N. Disla: None. M.S.V. Elkind: None. R.L. Sacco: None.

[bobsticks]

Dammit Noddy!! Why ya gotta ruin a perfectly good The-sky-is-falling moment with something pesky like...um...facts?! :smilewinkgrin:

[noddin0ff]

Dammit Noddy!! Why ya gotta ruin a perfectly good The-sky-is-falling moment with something pesky like...um...facts?! :smilewinkgrin:

Sing along...

Facts are simple and facts are straight
Facts are lazy and facts are late
Facts all come with points of view
Facts don't do what I want them to
Facts just twist the truth around
Facts are living turned inside out
Facts are getting the best of them
Facts are nothing on the face of things
Facts don't stain the furniture
Facts go out and slam the door
Facts are written all over your face
Facts continue to change their shape

[JSE]

Whatever, I drink Diet Soda all the time. It's my one vice. I have given up and lot of other things but Diet Soda is the one thing I allow myself and I am just.............................................. .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. .?

[bobsticks]

Whattup Herr Fartvergnügen...?!

[GMichael]

I have never been much of a soda drinker. Diet soda even less. Give me a nice cup of fresh coffee and I'm happy.

[(O0o*o0O)]

I thought I had nothing to worry about, but ya - fast food. I drink pop with fast food and junk. I don't to often, but when out and about I'll stop for food. Other then that I have a healthy intake.

I spend about $100 or more in cheap dirty weed every month. I smoke like a person smokes cigarettes so I'm just as bad..

[ForeverAutumn]

Nothing but water, soda water (zero sweeteners of any kind), and decaf coffee for this girl. I will occasionally drink a Ginger Ale (not diet) if I have an upset tummy. And of course a glass of red wine a couple of times a week, but that's good for you. :)

I've never liked the flavour of soda...or as we call it here in the GWN, pop. I guess I'm lucky that way.

Feanor, cutting down on some of that caffiene may help your GERD. I suffer from it too and switching to decaf coffee made a huge difference for me.

[GMichael]

I thought I had nothing to worry about, but ya - fast food. I drink pop with fast food and junk. I don't to often, but when out and about I'll stop for food. Other then that I have a healthy intake.

I spend about $100 or more in cheap dirty weed every month. I smoke like a person smokes cigarettes so I'm just as bad..

Huh? Is that bad for us now too?!

[Smokey]

Huh? Is that bad for us now too?!

Yes. Bad for your pocketbook :D

[JSE]

Whattup Herr Fartvergnügen...?!

Sup?

Just dropping by to check in.

[GMichael]

Yes. Bad for your pocketbook :D
My wife's pocketbook is bad for my pocketbook.:crazy:

[bobsticks]

Huh? Is that bad for us now too?!

It is if said skunkprodukt is a cash crop that funds the spread of illigal immigrants/criminal elements. If yer gonna aid and abet at least ride a good horse...

[GMichael]

It is if said skunkprodukt is a cash crop that funds the spread of illigal immigrants/criminal elements. If yer gonna aid and abet at least ride a good horse...
What if I have a green thumb?:3:

[bobsticks]

Oh, well then it's perfectly acceptable...even lauded in some areas ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humboldt_County,_California )...just that most of the cow dung/oregano skunky stuff I hear about is comin' fro dem vatos loco boys...