How much effect does the transport system have in the scheme of things?

[phileserver39]

Howdy all,

I have a 10 year old Toshiba CD player which I will be trying out with my future owned PS Audio Digilink III (I am picking the PS unit up on Monday). Even though I will be using the PS unit primarily for my computer I am interested to hear how FLAC files played through the PC compare to the same tunes in their original CD form played through the CD player's transport.

My question is this: Have you guys found that the transport player makes much of a difference? I know that companies such as Theta and Rega make pure transport systems which can cost several thousands of dollars. Surely they wouldn't sell any of these units if they made no difference at all. However, for a guy like me who doesn't have a "golden ear" do you think that the difference between, say, a used $500 transport would be discernible as compared to my 10 year old Toshiba cd player when used as a transport?

Thanks~

[Dawnrazor]

Howdy all,

However, for a guy like me who doesn't have a "golden ear" do you think that the difference between, say, a used $500 transport would be discernible as compared to my 10 year old Toshiba cd player when used as a transport?

Thanks~

My take is that once you get things into the computer you wont ever play disks and if you have to (lets say a friend stops by) your toshiba will be find.

Said another way it is money spent in the wrong direction.

Do pay attention to the computer and look at some sights that help tweak it for audio. And if you have any kind of diy skill look into powering the drives in the computer separately from the supply in the computer.

Here is a link and look under alternate psu and the items below that. Just be careful to not exceed the limits of the psu and for 20$ you could get a few for power hungry drives. Though I recommend the sata laptop drives as they are less powerhungry, quieter and slower:

http://www.cicsmemoryplayer.com/index.php?n=CMP.05Components

yes the transport can make a difference, and with a computer you can see were things like separate psus can make a difference. Whether you can hear it is something I cant answer as it is system and person dependent. But if I can hear things like differences in ASIO drivers (things that shouldnt make a lick of difference but do) then my hunch is that most anyone with a decent system could hear differences in transports given time. In an a-b perhaps but I am talking about listening to a transport for a few months and someone sneaking another one in without you knowing...

[02audionoob]

I have a PS Audio DLIII and I can hear the difference between my Blu-ray on the Toslink input and the CD player on the SPDIF input. I don't know whether it's the player or the input that makes the difference, but it's there. I haven't bothered to swap and compare because I plan to leave them as they are, regardless.

[phileserver39]

Thanks Dawnrazor! Great response to my question. I appreciate your time and expertise and will take your advice to heart. I am a novice in terms of my DIY skills but I own a solder iron and all the necessary evils that go along with it. I have fashioned my own solid silver interconnects so hopefully I can follow the instructions in the link you provided. Maybe my experiences bare no resemblance to those required in the instructions but I sure ain't a-scared to give it the old college try! :)

[phileserver39]

Howdy 02audionoob,

Which source sounds better? Also, what do you think of your PS Audio DAC? Do you have any buyer's remorse at all? If so, could you tell me your thoughts? I value your opinion.

Thanks!

J

[Dawnrazor]

I have fashioned my own solid silver interconnects so hopefully I can follow the instructions in the link you provided. Maybe my experiences bare no resemblance to those required in the instructions but I sure ain't a-scared to give it the old college try! :)

Hey Phile,

If you built ICs then this is pretty easy. You are just taking the red and black wires and removing them from the mobo header so they can be connected to the alternate psu. # 16 shows it pretty clearly. I for one soldered mine and frankly if I could figure it out you can too. It is power so just be careful and make sure you double check everything.

[Feanor]

Howdy, Phile,

I can't say I hear a difference between my computer FLAC files and same music on CD, both played through my DAC. The computer is attached to the DAC via S/PDIF; the CDP via Toslink. So personally I have no interest in a better transport. But then again I don't sit around straining to hear minute differences between equipment & configurations -- some people do. If you're like them, there's no certainty what you might hear or imagine you hear.

For my upgrade money, I consider the following away ahead of a transport upgrade and/or other computer hardware upgrade ... PS Data Link III doesn't have an asynchronus USB receiver. On account of that, I'd consider upgrading to a sound card with a S/PDIF output. Then I'd run a 30+ foot cable to the PS' S/PDIF input. Such an arrangement is usually preferable to a synchronus USB connection on account of lower jitter. (On the other hand, the PS DAC does have asynchoronus upsampling which reclocks the input reducing jitter, so afterall you might not hear much difference).

If you want to go this route, a soundcard with S/PDIF Out and its own ASIO driver that's had good vibs lately is the ASUS Xonar Essence STX, (here (http://usa.asus.com/product.aspx?P_ID=zCDHPnfR1jymHK2f&templete=2)).

Generally more important than other hardware is your music player program. On Windows I'd suggest Foobar2000 or J. River Jukebox. Both prove for WASAPI or ASIO drivers; both have good music management, and both are free. Nerd alert: the CICS Memory Player program mentioned by Dawnrazor might, (or might not), be the ultimate for sound but is so user unfriendly that it's unworthy of consideration by sane individuals.

[Dawnrazor]

Howdy, Phile,

Nerd alert: the CICS Memory Player program mentioned by Dawnrazor might, (or might not), be the ultimate for sound but is so user unfriendly that it's unworthy of consideration by sane individuals.

Hey Feanor,

LOL. You are totally right if you never actually built one!! If all you have done is downloaded cplay, then YES that is a fair conclusion. It IS an unfriendly program on its own. Thought in the context of the memory player recipe it behaves quite differently. The memoryplayer build is like climbing a huge mountain and all you can see along the way are your feet digging into the mountainside. Though once you get to the top the view is beautiful and it all makes sense!!

Long story, but one part alot of people miss is that cmp is a program that REPLACES WINDOWS EXPLORER. It becomes the gui for the system and just sends files to cplay. With it going, cplay behaves much differently then it does on its own. So in cmp, you select the album or playlist and can sort by album, artist, genre, or all. When you select an album for instance or playlist, it opens up cplay over cmp and plays the selection.

What I really love about this combo is the remote. It is hard to describe but while technically you use a mouse, you dont move a cursor around on the screen. 90% or more is done with the scroll wheel, so it really is like using a remote and not a mouse. Volume, selection, navigation, etc. is done with either the scroll wheel scrolling or pressing down on the scroll wheel.

Now if you are talking about lacking pretty pictures well yes it doesnt support cover art.

Anyhow, look here as it explains it and under remote control you can see the graph for the mouse functions, and maybe it will make some sense. And fwiw, I was never successful with remote operation with any program besides cmp2. Sure you could do alot with a WMCE remote or other wireless remote, but you ALWAYS needed the cursor! Maybe I am daft, but you try Jrivers media mode and see how far you get with a wmce romote before you need the mouse. And while my wireless touch screen worked, it was a pain. This for me is much better.

http://www.cicsmemoryplayer.com/index.php?n=CMP.11CMPShell

[Feanor]

Hey Feanor,

LOL. You are totally right if you never actually built one!! If all you have done is downloaded cplay, then YES that is a fair conclusion. It IS an unfriendly program on its own. Thought in the context of the memory player recipe it behaves quite differently. The memoryplayer build is like climbing a huge mountain and all you can see along the way are your feet digging into the mountainside. Though once you get to the top the view is beautiful and it all makes sense!!

Long story, but one part alot of people miss is that cmp is a program that REPLACES WINDOWS EXPLORER. It becomes the gui for the system and just sends files to cplay. With it going, cplay behaves much differently then it does on its own. So in cmp, you select the album or playlist and can sort by album, artist, genre, or all. When you select an album for instance or playlist, it opens up cplay over cmp and plays the selection.

What I really love about this combo is the remote. It is hard to describe but while technically you use a mouse, you dont move a cursor around on the screen. 90% or more is done with the scroll wheel, so it really is like using a remote and not a mouse. Volume, selection, navigation, etc. is done with either the scroll wheel scrolling or pressing down on the scroll wheel.

Now if you are talking about lacking pretty pictures well yes it doesnt support cover art.

Anyhow, look here as it explains it and under remote control you can see the graph for the mouse functions, and maybe it will make some sense. And fwiw, I was never successful with remote operation with any program besides cmp2. Sure you could do alot with a WMCE remote or other wireless remote, but you ALWAYS needed the cursor! Maybe I am daft, but you try Jrivers media mode and see how far you get with a wmce romote before you need the mouse. And while my wireless touch screen worked, it was a pain. This for me is much better.

http://www.cicsmemoryplayer.com/index.php?n=CMP.11CMPShell
Thanks again, DR. One of these very fine days I will download the combo and give it a whirl.

Might not be today, though. Actually, when I went to your link today, IE gave me a "This website has been reported as unsafe" message ... !! :frown5:

[02audionoob]

Howdy 02audionoob,

Which source sounds better? Also, what do you think of your PS Audio DAC? Do you have any buyer's remorse at all? If so, could you tell me your thoughts? I value your opinion.

Thanks!

J

I think the sound with the Blu-ray to the Toslink is just ever so slightly less clear in the highs than the CD player to the SPDIF. I could certainly live with either one. The difference is quite small. I am very happy with the Digital Link III, with no remorse at all. I could probably get used to not having it if I had to, but it has a smoothness and resolution that the CD player on its own lacks. It sort of reminds me of the sound of the Rega CD player that convinced me I wanted to upgrade from the Music Hall or get a DAC. If I had it to do over again, I'd consider the new Rega DAC, too. But it wasn't around when I was looking to upgrade.

[Dawnrazor]

Thanks again, DR. One of these very fine days I will download the combo and give it a whirl.

Might not be today, though. Actually, when I went to your link today, IE gave me a "This website has been reported as unsafe" message ... !! :frown5:

Hi Bill,

Weird. It works for me no problem and no flags in firefox. Even norton doesnt chime in. Probably the bit police who turned it in.:yesnod:

Though there is a false positive on the cmp software. It has to do with the code for the remote control and it is mentioned in the faq. I have had an e-mail or 2 about this and some paranoia from people. I get this. But if one was really going to spread a virus would one advocate building a memory player with the internet TURNED OFF?? i find that really hard to believe.

NO rush on trying the combo. if you are happy then be happy. I WAS happy running winamp with asio, and made a cmp2 rig to debunk the theories. They seemed like bunk. Well needless to say the results with the same soundcard were enough to make me a cheerleader. How wrong I was...