The death of Blueray [Archive] - Audio & Video Forums

dwayne.aycock

11-09-2010, 08:54 AM

Tarheel_

11-09-2010, 09:18 AM

dwayne.aycock

11-09-2010, 09:36 AM

Double Post - Merged and Removed by Moderator

Sir Terrence the Terrible

11-09-2010, 10:36 AM

Are any of you as frustrated as I am with firmware updates for blueray? I recently went to the store and purchased THE PACIFIC from HBO pictures on blueray. Here I am, sitting in my theater room with my beer and pizza (man cave time!!!) ready for some intense sound and action. I load the disk and......NOTHING! Frickin firmware update needed. I go through the pains of going online and burning the upgraded firmware disc. I load it into the machine and get this " disc can not be read"! I go through all the steps again and still the same result. I have the Sharp Aquos BD 1200. I called Sharp and they said pay $50.00 and send the player to them for the firmware upgrade. This will be required everytime a firmware update is needed. Needless to say... I am NOT going to do this e-bay here I come. Next I tried the movie on my Samsung BDP-1200. Same result. I took the player to the Geek Squad at Best Buy and they managed to update the firmware for $25.00. With this player, firmware can not be updated with a disc. It has to be tied to an ethernet cable and modum which I DO NOT have!! I have a mobil hot spot. Finally I tried this on my new Sony player and of course it worked. I enjoyed the movie, but from now on, I will hesitate when buying a blue ray because I never know if they will play. What happened to the days when you put a DVD in your player and just watched the movie? I know this is all about blocking out the movie pirates, but it is causing a big problem for legitimate users. The plan is to phase out the DVD and replace it with blueray. I am not feeling the love here. Will these frequent firmware updates with all the problems associated with them be the death of blueray?
Your thoughts.
Dwayne

Dwayne,
First, I could not find a Sharp player that has your model number. They are usually listed a BD-HPXX. As far as the Samsung, it is a really old player, but you did not need to take it to the Geek squad, you could have done the firmware upgrade yourself. The file is on their website, and all you needed to do was burn it to a CDR.

With the new Bluray players, there are not many firmware updates, and doing upgrades is easy peasy. I have the PS3, and upgrades are transparent to me. Of the newer players, firmware updates are far and in between. Mostly all of the newer players have wireless connections for both applications and firmware updates. The Samsung BDP-1200 and 1000 where pretty crappy players in the first place. When these were released, Sony, Panasonic and Pioneer had much better players with a lot less problems.

I would advise that you purchase a newer player to see how different the Bluray experience really is. It is nothing like it was when the Samsung BDP-1200 was released, it a far newer world.

Sir Terrence the Terrible

11-09-2010, 10:53 AM

horrible story...

but i think blu-rays death is online streaming. I streamed a 1080p/ DD+ movie of Ironman 2 Sunday via VUDU and it was every bit as good as a blu-ray movie in my HT.

I think Blu-ray will quickly become the laserdisc...a niche where repeat viewing is cost effective.

It will be a loooooooooong time before streaming will replace the disc. With the cable and telecoms slapping downloading limits(which effects streaming as well), this can put a real crimp in widespread streaming plans.

SlumpBuster

11-09-2010, 01:01 PM

New BD players are connected to the internet anyway. Updates come right thru the intertubes wire. For a $129 to $159, just pick up a new BD player.

Btw, The Pacific is awesome on BD.

SlumpBuster

11-09-2010, 01:05 PM

It will be a loooooooooong time before streaming will replace the disc. With the cable and telecoms slapping downloading limits(which effects streaming as well), this can put a real crimp in widespread streaming plans.

Point well taken. Check this out: http://www.slate.com/id/2273314/

But I have been watching alot more movies through Netflix streaming. Even with a much more limited selection, I'm probably 6 to 1 streaming to disk.

Sir Terrence the Terrible

11-09-2010, 01:38 PM

Point well taken. Check this out: http://www.slate.com/id/2273314/

But I have been watching alot more movies through Netflix streaming. Even with a much more limited selection, I'm probably 6 to 1 streaming to disk.

I am like you, every since Sony offered Netflix as a crossbar application(as opposed to inserting the disc), I have been watching movies like crazy when I have time. However, when you think about 2% of the Netflix subscribers taking 20% of the internet bandwidth, you can see the lights of the train coming at ya when more people begin to use Netflix. Are net speeds are not getting faster, they are getting more expensive. We are not South Korea, and we are just not ready for mass streaming anytime soon.

SlumpBuster

11-09-2010, 01:54 PM

Yeah streaming is great. I've seen some really enjoyable movies that I would have missed otherwise. Plus if it doesn't grab you in the first ten minutes, just switch.

But, my cable provider is charging 8.99 for single new release HD stream. That pricing model will fail.

Sir Terrence the Terrible

11-09-2010, 02:22 PM

But, my cable provider is charging 8.99 for single new release HD stream. That pricing model will fail.

While it is failing, and Netflix is succeeding, how long do you think it will be when your cable provider decides bandwidth packaging and limits is better for them than allowing Netflix's traffic to swamp their system? This is what is facing streaming going forward. Cable and the telecom's are going to get territorial and attempt to choke or limit Netflix streaming while trying to push customers towards their own offerings.

Mr Peabody

11-09-2010, 05:51 PM

Dwayne, if you registered your 1200 Samsung will actually send you the update for free, a disc through the mail. Of course, the pizza will be mighty cold by then. I disagree with Sir T on the 1200, it was a great machine and much better than Sony or Panasonic at the time, especially the next gen models by Sony, Panasonic and almost every other brand. The 1200 has exceptional DVD upconverting as well as BD playback. PS3 excluded from prior comments. As you can tell by the build quality of the 1200 over what you have been buying it was a quality unit. It is older and suffers from some of the drawbacks of early gen players but that has nothing to do with it being a bad machine just BDA putting out a format before it was ready. I've got two 1200's still going strong. What made me replace it in my main system was wanting DTS decoding. In fact, now that I remember the 1200 actually won a shoot out over higher end more expensive brands like Denon in DVD upconverting and playback.

budgetaudio76

11-09-2010, 09:16 PM

for the crappy and expensive net i have(clearwire) They have a limit of 1 gigabyte for any 24 hour period.

Even streaming a few minutes of youtube can take up to 10 times longer than it should...BTW. Im paying for s1.5 meg downloads and 256 kilbits up(dont remember if its bytes or bits...

audio amateur

11-10-2010, 12:29 AM

I believe there's always going to be an fairly easy way to get these updates. For example, can you not download the update on to a pen drive using a public computer or friend's computer (If you dont have internet) and use that to update the player?
Indeed, burning to a CD is a bit more of a hassle. To be fair though, in this day and age, anyone who owns a BD player will have the ability to update his/her BD player fairly easily and straightforwardly.

I bought Sony's Playstation 3 which updates automatically (if it's connect via ethernet or wifi) and I haven't encountered any such problems. It's a great machine.

Tarheel_

11-10-2010, 05:09 AM

If you have streaming access, you should try VUDU. We watched another HD (720p) movie last night for $4.99, and it was a fantastic experience. My high speed internet really moves the data so that helps.

The VUDU interface is easy and complete with all filters and plus, when you hit 'Rent' the movie starts in 1-2 secs without intros of any kind. They have all the latest releases (unlike Netflix - which I have a subscription). Very well done site/company.

Sir Terrence the Terrible

11-10-2010, 07:53 AM

Anyone who thinks the Samsung BDP-1200 was a good player needs to take one trip over to Bluray.com and look at the archived threads on the player, and Samsung response to firmware upgrades. According to a dealer of Bluray players, the Samsung BDP-1000 and 1200 was returned to his stores at triple the rate of a Sony, Pioneer or Panasonic. Samsung was terribly slow in providing firmware updates, and their players were the most problematic amoung all players. The biggest joke amoung the insiders there was a running bet that the Samsung players would not be able to play the new releases for that week. I could go on and on, but I would not buy into the one sided biases of people who owned the player, and are in denial of the players obvious weakness. I remember them complaining about the player and firmware upgrades as well on this site.

http://forums.audioreview.com/showthread.php?t=29489&highlight=Samsung+BDP-1200

Great player huh.......

Worf101

11-10-2010, 08:01 AM

Ah feel you. I'm lucky that my Oppo BDP self upgrades rather well. I'll turn it on, it'll tell me it's flashing my firmware and not to turn off the thingy, next thing you know I'm in business. It's been fairly painless thus far. Not to say I might not run into a disk I can't read in the future but, so far so good. Hope you get it straightened out. I watched "The Pacific" in real time on HBO and while I liked it, I didn't love it like "Band of Brothers".

Worf

kevlarus

11-10-2010, 08:22 AM

This is what I hinted at some time back with regard to frequency of updates with Blu-ray players almost being like a computer. Monthly firmware/software updates. I'm just glad I decided to go with a player that had wifi connection instead of just wired.

dwayne.aycock

11-10-2010, 08:40 AM

I know the process of updating the firmware. I have called Samsung and they FINALLY sent the upgrade disc. The problem is that the player will not read the disc. The only thing that has worked is using an ethernet cable. Since i only have a mobile hot spot, I have to find a friend that has a modem and upgrade from there. I purchased a new blur ray player back in September. Sony makes a pretty good player, I have just never been thrilled about Sony products. Time will tell is there is a problem upgrading to 3D.
Dwayne

poppachubby

11-10-2010, 09:25 AM

Hello Dewayne,

you may notice that I have merged your Blu Ray threads and removed one. Double posting is forbidden at the Audio Review forums.

Great topic however...

dwayne.aycock

11-10-2010, 10:44 AM

Sorry about the double post. I guess I leaped before I looked.
Dwayne

pixelthis

11-10-2010, 01:24 PM

Are any of you as frustrated as I am with firmware updates for blueray? I recently went to the store and purchased THE PACIFIC from HBO pictures on blueray. Here I am, sitting in my theater room with my beer and pizza (man cave time!!!) ready for some intense sound and action. I load the disk and......NOTHING! Frickin firmware update needed. I go through the pains of going online and burning the upgraded firmware disc. I load it into the machine and get this " disc can not be read"! I go through all the steps again and still the same result. I have the Sharp Aquos BD 1200. I called Sharp and they said pay $50.00 and send the player to them for the firmware upgrade. This will be required everytime a firmware update is needed. Needless to say... I am NOT going to do this e-bay here I come. Next I tried the movie on my Samsung BDP-1200. Same result. I took the player to the Geek Squad at Best Buy and they managed to update the firmware for $25.00. With this player, firmware can not be updated with a disc. It has to be tied to an ethernet cable and modum which I DO NOT have!! I have a mobil hot spot. Finally I tried this on my new Sony player and of course it worked. I enjoyed the movie, but from now on, I will hesitate when buying a blue ray because I never know if they will play. What happened to the days when you put a DVD in your player and just watched the movie? I know this is all about blocking out the movie pirates, but it is causing a big problem for legitimate users. The plan is to phase out the DVD and replace it with blueray. I am not feeling the love here. Will these frequent firmware updates with all the problems associated with them be the death of blueray?
Your thoughts.
Dwayne

Dont give up on the Sharp yet.
Your firmware disc will work, but you have to burn thr right type.
What you need to burn is an "image" to either a CD rom or DVD rom(which type
depends on your player).
Once you burn an image to disc it should work.
I have a Sharp, love love love it, it loads fast, but it needed a firmware upgrade a
week after I bought it. No worries, it has net access, took about a minute.
But on my last blu player, a Sony, I got stuck like you did, reading the instructions
helped.
THERE are going to be frequent firmware upgrades until the form factor sorts itself out.
This also happened with DVD at first, but when was the last time you needed to upgrade a DVD player. EVENTUALLY THIS WON'T BE A PROBLEM ANYMORE.
As for the ":death" of BLU, that might be sooner than most think, the net might do to
Blu what it did to the video rental store.:1:

Sir Terrence the Terrible

11-10-2010, 05:41 PM

As for the ":death" of BLU, that might be sooner than most think, the net might do to
Blu what it did to the video rental store.:1:

Either you didn't bother to read the comments in post #7, or you just can't read period. There is no way any time soon that the net will dominate Bluray on any level at this point. Financially speaking, Bluray completely dominates streaming in revenue, it is almost no competition at this point. Secondly, Sandvine, a network management company sent out a report that documented Internet usage in North America. It found that between 8-10pm, Netflix accounted for 20% of the internet traffic, and the figure intertwined with data from Netflix showed that the 20% internet usage was coming from only 2% of the streaming subscribers registered. When that figure grows to 10-15% at the current bandwidth of the American system, the internet slows to a crawl, literally making Netflix unwatchable.

The report also showed that the cable companies and telecom's are slowing the rollout of their high speed connections, so a majority of the country will not have the speeds to keep traffic moving as the public moves more towards a streaming model. The telecom's and cable companies have not upped the speed of their connections fast enough to make a mass adoption of streaming possible, and not enough of the country will have the necessary speeds(or coverage) to move the public towards a streaming model. The American public is not buying internet packages with the highest speed, they are buying packages with the slowest speed instead, which is why 2% of Netflix subscribers can take up 20% of the traffic on the internet between 8-10pm.

Another fact - The cable companies are losing a lot of customers as of late, and at this point cable is the fastest potential speed you can get. At the same time Netflix is growing like gang busters, especially subscribers to streaming. Put on your thinking cap here for a moment(which probably would not help you anyway), if the cable company is not gaining customers, and Netflix is, how long do you think the cable companies(and telecoms for that matter)will allow all the Netflix traffic to flood their infrastructure without them wanting to control amount of downloading each customer does in a month? Already cable companies are slapping downloading limits on their customers, and that will eventually stunt Netflix's growth sooner rather than later. The only way an all streaming model with work is when bandwidth grows substantially yearly(ain't happening), consumer purchase the highest internet speeds(ain't happening) and can download as much data as they want, and the quality of the stream dramatically improves to the point where 1080p, 3D and lossless audio can be transmitted at substantially higher bitrates than we are currently seeing(that ain't happenin either!).

Every time I read predictions of Bluray imminent death at the hands of streaming, I am reminded of all these facts, and how the person who makes these comments is so delusional, that reality completely escapes them.

Tarheel_

11-10-2010, 06:14 PM

Every time I read predictions of Bluray imminent death at the hands of streaming, I am reminded of all these facts, and how the person who makes these comments is so delusional, that reality completely escapes them.

Guess I should have been clear in my earlier post. When I say streaming death is coming for Blu-Ray, i mean the hard disc itself. The newer tvs now come with widget apps (for streaming) bypassing the blu-ray player altogether.

My blu-ray player is used 90% for streaming, maybe even 95% over spinning a disc. And i'm an HT guy. Unless I see a blu disc as a repeat view, then i'm streaming the movie period.

Just like mp3s and ipods killed CDs, i see streaming killing DVDs and Blu Ray discs.

Mr Peabody

11-10-2010, 07:56 PM

[QUOTE=Sir Terrence the Terrible]Anyone who thinks the Samsung BDP-1200 was a good player needs to take one trip over to Bluray.com and look at the archived threads on the player, and Samsung response to firmware upgrades. According to a dealer of Bluray players, the Samsung BDP-1000 and 1200 was returned to his stores at triple the rate of a Sony, Pioneer or Panasonic. Samsung was terribly slow in providing firmware updates, and their players were the most problematic amoung all players. The biggest joke amoung the insiders there was a running bet that the Samsung players would not be able to play the new releases for that week. I could go on and on, but I would not buy into the one sided biases of people who owned the player, and are in denial of the players obvious weakness. I remember them complaining about the player and firmware upgrades as well on this site.

http://forums.audioreview.com/showthread.php?t=29489&highlight=Samsung+BDP-1200

Only growing pains my man. I did forget about that particular movie though. Still don't take away the fact that I have two still in service and the excellent PQ. I have never had a problem with the 1200 reading a disc from the factory. I could never get one I made myself to work but I believe that's due to my error. I am a novice at burning and downloading with a computer. I later found out I wasn't unzipping the file properly. But as long as Samsung will send the disc I'm not worrying about it.

The first time I watched a new release from something other than a disc was when Dishnet gave me some free PPV, and that was fairly recent.. If it was priced competitive I might do it more but if I liked the movie enough I'd still buy the disc. If I got BD quality with direct access to any movie I wanted to watch on a whim then I could get interested.

Sir Terrence the Terrible

11-11-2010, 08:14 AM

Guess I should have been clear in my earlier post. When I say streaming death is coming for Blu-Ray, i mean the hard disc itself. The newer tvs now come with widget apps (for streaming) bypassing the blu-ray player altogether.

My blu-ray player is used 90% for streaming, maybe even 95% over spinning a disc. And i'm an HT guy. Unless I see a blu disc as a repeat view, then i'm streaming the movie period.

Just like mp3s and ipods killed CDs, i see streaming killing DVDs and Blu Ray discs.

I believe everyone in the film industry knows that streaming is the wave of the future. However, until all of what I mentioned is addressed along with the fact that the streaming experience quality wise must catch up to the disc(i.e. lossless audio, 3D, 4K, and true 1080p without overcompressing), it will be years and years from now. The bandwidth is just not there, and won't be for the foreseeable future.

I am digging streaming right now, but it is mostly non big budget movies, older movies, and comedies. I would never stream a movie like 2012, The Day the Earth Stood Still, or The Day After Tomorrow, because who wants to see it in heavily filtered and compressed 720p with stereo audio when you can get unfiltered 1080p with lossless audio?

With the BDA blowing out the Bluray format like it has, Bluray has a pretty long life ahead of it. I predict it will be around as long as DVD has.

Now where we agree is that streaming will definitely spell curtains for DVD, especially when Netflix begin offering DD+ on more of their titles.

pixelthis

11-11-2010, 12:13 PM

Either you didn't bother to read the comments in post #7, or you just can't read period. There is no way any time soon that the net will dominate Bluray on any level at this point. Financially speaking, Bluray completely dominates streaming in revenue, it is almost no competition at this point. Secondly, Sandvine, a network management company sent out a report that documented Internet usage in North America. It found that between 8-10pm, Netflix accounted for 20% of the internet traffic, and the figure intertwined with data from Netflix showed that the 20% internet usage was coming from only 2% of the streaming subscribers registered. When that figure grows to 10-15% at the current bandwidth of the American system, the internet slows to a crawl, literally making Netflix unwatchable.

The report also showed that the cable companies and telecom's are slowing the rollout of their high speed connections, so a majority of the country will not have the speeds to keep traffic moving as the public moves more towards a streaming model. The telecom's and cable companies have not upped the speed of their connections fast enough to make a mass adoption of streaming possible, and not enough of the country will have the necessary speeds(or coverage) to move the public towards a streaming model. The American public is not buying internet packages with the highest speed, they are buying packages with the slowest speed instead, which is why 2% of Netflix subscribers can take up 20% of the traffic on the internet between 8-10pm.

Another fact - The cable companies are losing a lot of customers as of late, and at this point cable is the fastest potential speed you can get. At the same time Netflix is growing like gang busters, especially subscribers to streaming. Put on your thinking cap here for a moment(which probably would not help you anyway), if the cable company is not gaining customers, and Netflix is, how long do you think the cable companies(and telecoms for that matter)will allow all the Netflix traffic to flood their infrastructure without them wanting to control amount of downloading each customer does in a month? Already cable companies are slapping downloading limits on their customers, and that will eventually stunt Netflix's growth sooner rather than later. The only way an all streaming model with work is when bandwidth grows substantially yearly(ain't happening), consumer purchase the highest internet speeds(ain't happening) and can download as much data as they want, and the quality of the stream dramatically improves to the point where 1080p, 3D and lossless audio can be transmitted at substantially higher bitrates than we are currently seeing(that ain't happenin either!).

Every time I read predictions of Bluray imminent death at the hands of streaming, I am reminded of all these facts, and how the person who makes these comments is so delusional, that reality completely escapes them.

Wow, you sure ought to know about "delusional".
"NAKED DSL" is becoming more and more popular, netflix is taking up to 43% of the
net at times, and people are increasingly giving up cable for TV over the net.
As usual you are assuming your preferences are the same as the masses, who probably would be quite happy with 720p and stereo audio.
BASICALLY, rental will go "network" eventually, the question for BLU is, is there enough of a collector market for it to survive? THATS what it will depend on.:1:

Sir Terrence the Terrible

11-11-2010, 04:45 PM

Wow, you sure ought to know about "delusional".
"NAKED DSL" is becoming more and more popular, netflix is taking up to 43% of the
net at times, and people are increasingly giving up cable for TV over the net.
As usual you are assuming your preferences are the same as the masses, who probably would be quite happy with 720p and stereo audio.
BASICALLY, rental will go "network" eventually, the question for BLU is, is there enough of a collector market for it to survive? THATS what it will depend on.:1:

Oh look, another red herring that requires more careful scrutiny. Naked DSL is only offered at the lowest DSL speeds(1.5mbps) which by the way has the current wide spread usage in the US. Widespread use of this speed going forward is not going to help cure bandwidth issues, it is part of the current problem that will only get worse going forward.

Come on, let's use that one brain cell you have left. With the average speed of 3.9 mbps, the US can barely stream Netflix's 720p HD offerings without buffering issues. Only those with connection speeds of 20+mbps can enjoy Netflix's 1080p DD+ offering, which means a great majority of American's are not equip to get this kind of Netflix option. Aside from that naked DSL cannot offer anyone the option of watching two Netflix streams in different rooms, there is not enough bandwidth to do so. If you are married, you men better enjoy Sex in the City films, or your wives Band of Brothers or it is likely you will be watching movies on different sets(which is not possible by the way).

Please raise your hand if you have a steady 20+ mbps connection. Hello.....oh I see one..two...three oh seven folks out there out of a crowd of one hundred!

If you come out of your little cubby hole and look around the net, the majority of folks when presented the Bluray vs streaming question - by a pretty substantial margin chose Bluray. PQ and SQ was the obvious advantage, along with 3D delivery and 4K potential, things that are a long way off quality wise via streaming.

One you closely examine certain statements, the logic is either one dimensional, or non existent.

kevlarus

11-12-2010, 07:14 AM

Come on, let's use that one brain cell you have left. With the average speed of 3.9 mbps, the US can barely stream Netflix's 720p HD offerings without buffering issues. Only those with connection speeds of 20+mbps can enjoy Netflix's 1080p DD+ offering, which means a great majority of American's are not equip to get this kind of Netflix option. Aside from that naked DSL cannot offer anyone the option of watching two Netflix streams in different rooms, there is not enough bandwidth to do so. If you are married, you men better enjoy Sex in the City films, or your wives Band of Brothers or it is likely you will be watching movies on different sets(which is not possible by the way).

Smokey referred to Netflix offering full 1080p, but I couldn't find anything on their site indicating what formats they could stream in (720 vs 1080). Are they currently offering full HD streaming ?

Also, what restriction are you referring to with regard to streaming two movies at once from Netflix (bandwidth consumption aside that is) ?

If you come out of your little cubby hole and look around the net, the majority of folks when presented the Bluray vs streaming question - by a pretty substantial margin chose Bluray. PQ and SQ was the obvious advantage, along with 3D delivery and 4K potential, things that are a long way off quality wise via streaming.

This pretty much sums up my position with regard to streaming. We just don't watch enough in a month to make it worth while, especially with Redbox now offering both DVD and Blu-Ray. If we rent a movie and really like it (enough to watch a few more times), we'll buy the movie, otherwise, we just move on.

jvc

11-12-2010, 08:31 AM

Sir Terrence the Terrible

11-12-2010, 10:01 AM

Smokey referred to Netflix offering full 1080p, but I couldn't find anything on their site indicating what formats they could stream in (720 vs 1080). Are they currently offering full HD streaming ?

They are offering 1080p streams for the PS3 only. The problem with it is that it is heavily filtered and compressed, and does not look like anything close to 1080p on disc. While VC-1 is an excellent compression codec, it can only do so much with 10mbps worth of bandwidth on a 1080p encode. 1080p on disc usually utilizes 17-35 mbps bandwidth with AVC encodes.

The 720p HD streams are pretty plentiful, but you have to click on the movie to know if it is HD or SD

Also, what restriction are you referring to with regard to streaming two movies at once from Netflix (bandwidth consumption aside that is) ?

That restriction is not on Netflix, it is on the users naked DSL. With a 1.5mbps connection, there is not enough bandwidth for two separate SD streams, let alone HD ones.

This pretty much sums up my position with regard to streaming. We just don't watch enough in a month to make it worth while, especially with Redbox now offering both DVD and Blu-Ray. If we rent a movie and really like it (enough to watch a few more times), we'll buy the movie, otherwise, we just move on.

I do not think collectors or serious film buff's are anxious to degrade the quality of their movie watching experience just for the ease of streaming. I stream stuff that I have no intention of buying, but I would not stream what I intend to buy.

RGA

11-12-2010, 12:05 PM

people people people

Buy a Sony PS3. I have now been using this machine for a few months and it is probably my favorite device of all the devices I have ever used. The remote control is wonderful being a blu tooth device - don't have to aim it at the machine. Well laid out remote.

The game Dragon Age alone makes the whole purchase worthwhile - it is better than most movies as a story and I've probably put 180 hours into the thing already. As a per dollar per hour form of entertainment it's way better value than any movie.

Picture quality on DVD is also very good - BD movies - there is probably better but frankly I more interested in the moview than agonizing over whether the hue is 98% correct or 98.89% correct and paying an extra grand for a machine that is .89% better and not being able to play Dragon Age is not remotely worth it.

Further the PS3 is faster than most other machines - it plays when you put the disc in. It updates itself (pretty smart beastie it is). And the next machines will likely keep getting better and faster.

Also, I suspect that they will retain their value a little bit better than other blu ray players since you can sell it as a game console - so if Blu Ray does in fact die in the unlikely chance as some suggest - then you can still sell the machine as a game player.

It's the best $299 I've spent on a do everything machine. Although it doesn't seem to like outputting through the non HDMI cord. And it would be nice to have RCA outputs for audio. So it's not perfect but there are work arounds.

Having to burn a disc to upgrade is hugely lame. So I can get the frustration there. And even with the games it can be an issue. One PS3 upgrade stopped Dragon Age from working on many people's machine so Biware then had to make an upgrade patch for the PS3 patch to allow the game to work again. So that kind of stuff is irritating. So long as the game producers care enough about customer service (and not all do) then you're okay.

And if you're not a gamer - play that game - if you like Lord of the Rings then chances are this will be for you. LOTR is total caca compared to Dragon Age - the characters are better written - voice acting is quite good across the board - the story is more interesting and fleshed out - and you can decapitate lots of bad guys - cool man!

http://www.gamespot.com/pc/rpg/dragonage/video/6238644/dragon-age-origins-video-review

Tarheel_

11-13-2010, 05:24 PM

I also believe it's going to be a very long time before streaming takes over the disc. It may happen sooner in cities like L.A., NYC, Chicago, etc. Cities that have millions of people, that have access to broadband, will stream a lot. But, there are a lot more small towns, than big cities, in this country. Once you get outside the city limits, people don't have the easy access to broadband. To a lot of country people, the closest thing to broadband they can get is satellite internet. That's more expensive than most is willing to pay. Since streaming requires a broadband connection, and since a very big part of the country doesn't have access to broadband, streaming taking over discs is a long way away.

I think you are wrong here....i live in a town with 1 caution light (<500 people). No delivery pizza (sucks) and i have a smokin' high speed connection.

Trust me, i still have no cell phone coverage and if I have that type of internet speed, then folks outside of large cities may have similar speeds.

As someone mentioned earlier, the question is whether blu-ray discs can survive as a niche market.

Tarheel_

11-13-2010, 05:33 PM

I am digging streaming right now, but it is mostly non big budget movies, older movies, and comedies. I would never stream a movie like 2012, The Day the Earth Stood Still, or The Day After Tomorrow, because who wants to see it in heavily filtered and compressed 720p with stereo audio when you can get unfiltered 1080p with lossless audio?

You may not stream these movies because of 720p or stereo sound, but you must see the masses don't care to the level we do. I say "we" due to the fact we're on this forum because we dig audio/video, but for most folks they only want a good picture and good sound. If streaming supplies this and the convenience of never leaving home, then it's no disc.

As a side note, I'm 20 mins from the nearest Red Box so why would i ever consider it when i can stream Vudu in full HD and DD+.

jvc

11-13-2010, 09:57 PM

I think you are wrong here....i live in a town with 1 caution light (<500 people). No delivery pizza (sucks) and i have a smokin' high speed connection.

Trust me, i still have no cell phone coverage and if I have that type of internet speed, then folks outside of large cities may have similar speeds.

As someone mentioned earlier, the question is whether blu-ray discs can survive as a niche market.
I live in a town much larger than one stop light (Goldsboro, NC). We have Seymour Johnson Air Force Base here. Once you get a few miles out of the city limits, broadband isn't possible in most areas. I deliver phone books in the county every October, and talk with a lot of people. Most houses out there are either Dish Network or DirecTv, because they can't get cable. A handful of houses has a Hughs Net satellite internet dish mounted, but not many. Out in the county like that, you can certainly forget DSL too.

I've seen the same thing in Va. too, when we've been to visit my dad. Knowing how it is here, in all these small towns, and thinking of all the mid western states, where's there's miles and miles and miles of nothing but open fields and such, I don't think I'm too far off with what I said. Of course there's going to be exceptions. There are with anything. But this is an awfully big country, with an awful lot of small towns scattered all over it. I guess we'll just have to wait and see..............

N. Abstentia

11-25-2010, 06:14 PM

jvc

11-25-2010, 07:06 PM

And keep in mind a very small portion of the population has broadband right now. Most of the folks in my city can't even get it.
Exactly! Same thing I've been saying............. Very long way away from streaming taking over discs.

pixelthis

11-28-2010, 04:20 PM

Does anybody else see the irony of suggesting that streaming is going to kill BluRay because of stuff like the OP is complaining about...firmware updates and the inability to do so?

If he can't even update his firmware with his internet.....how's he gonna stream anything? And keep in mind a very small portion of the population has broadband right now. Most of the folks in my city can't even get it.

It won't unless we let it. Its important that this format becomes well established.
ONE thing going for it, the BLU disc is going to be pretty much universal as a storage medium, so BLU should be able to hang around for awhile. But it will need support.
Not like DVD where you can't live without it.:1: