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poppachubby
06-15-2010, 06:15 AM
Well everyone, I have settled on a new pair of speakers. New to me anyhow. This Thursday I will be picking up a super minty pair of Mission 707 w/ original stands for a cool $100.

I had been hawking Klipsch really closely, especially after Mr. Peabody's success. The KG3 and KG4 were within my reach, I was seriously considering the KG3.

I also had a line on some tasty B&W DM 22's for a great price.

I have never owned any Mission speakers. I know critically they get a bad rap for having crumby mid range. I plan on hooking these into my main rig. They actually mimic the specs of my existing pair, except my current pair are rear ported. I expect that the Mission will deliver a bit better all around.

Any thoughts would be great, no matter how opposed. I also hope to speak to any owner's of Mission or the 707.

Keep in mind this model sold a ton for Mission, so in spite of critics, the consumer side of things was up 'n up. I am looking for an efficient 2 way, 8 or 10" woofer, that has a lively sound.

Here's a pic from the local ad of the exact pair I will be buying.

http://img1.classistatic.com/cps/kj/100207/760r5/3694mlf_20.jpeg

bfalls
06-15-2010, 06:42 AM
Usually when I look on ebay for bookshelf speakers, Missions are always in the running. I especially like their no-nonsense styling and have heard much about their imaging. I had considered several sets in the past and was surprised to see on some models they had used leather to cover the baffle, similar to what Sonus Faber does.I know sooner or later I'll own a pair.

Other brands I look for on ebay are Paradigm, PSB, NHT, Klipsch, legacy... I just picked up a pair of Klipsch Synergy B2s, NIB for $125 shipped. They compared favorably with my Klipsch Kg4s, B&W LM-1s and Emotiva ERM-1s (however the ERM-1s pretty much blew them away).

I think I would have still gone with the Kg4s, knowing how great a speaker they are. With the Crites upgrades, they're a pretty hard act to follow in their price range.

poppachubby
06-15-2010, 09:25 AM
Thanks for the insight bfalls. The KG4 were in mint condition, but he wouldn't sell for less than $375. I had him at $200 for the KG3. So you can see, for the price difference I will be getting a great return in quality.

Eventually I will own some Klipsch. I think the RB-61 would be a better fit in the $400 range, and that for a NEW pair.

What gear do you run the KG4 with?

bfalls
06-16-2010, 04:57 AM
I've had the Kg4s with different systems. They're currently doing HT duty. I have them mated with a KV3 center and RS-3 surrounds. Although not really needed, I also have a custom ACI Saturn compound sub handling low-end. For sources I have a PS3, HD-DVD, Pioneer CLV-1000 Combi-Player (LD/DVD/CD) and Dishnetwork HD receiver. Occasionally I'll switch the center out with a KLF-C7, but prefer the KV3. The receiver is a Denon AVR-3300.

For fun, I've also used the Kg4s with a Yamaha M-65 amp, NAD P450 preamp and different sources. They've also been played through a Yamaha 2095 receiver, two Marantz M-700 w/NAD preamp, Sony STR-D5300ES and last but not least Emotiva XPA-5 5ch amp. I think the best sound was acheived using the Yamaha M-65 and NAD combination.

I was fortunate to pick up a pair of Klipsch Synergy B2 bookshelf speakers for $124 shipped from one of Amazon's "lightening deals". I haven't been a big fan of the Klipsch plastic-era speakers, but these do a really good job. I've owned and enjoyed the KSF-2.1 and KSF-3.1, the 2.1s a little better and didn't really expect much from the B2s. So far they've compared very favorably with my Kg4s and B&W LM-1s. I still have some Scandyna Minipods, T&A Triton series bookshelfs, PSB Intros, Emotiva ERM-1s and Genesis Genre IIs I want to compare them with.

Don't we have the best time with this hobby?:3:

poppachubby
06-16-2010, 12:42 PM
Hey bfalls. Sounds good. H/T system huh?

Any thoughts on the RB-61? I would want to run them with my main rig. I'm going to pick up those Missions tommorrow morning. I'm super excited. They really are minty.

blackraven
06-16-2010, 07:46 PM
The 700 series Missions were nice sounding speakers. Back in the early 1990's I almost pulled the trigger on a pair.

poppachubby
06-16-2010, 07:50 PM
Do you remember which model? 700 series? Anyhow I'll post my thoughts in this thread tommorrow raven.

Funny there's a guy selling a Cyrus Amp, CDP and DAC also. Old school, all Mission system? Then I'll just need one of those cheesy racks with the glass door.

Check it out...http://london.kijiji.ca/c-buy-and-sell-electronics-Mission-Cyrus-1-amp-CD-player-with-DAC5-bitstream-converter-W0QQAdIdZ211194253

blackraven
06-16-2010, 08:17 PM
Sorry Pops, I don't remember the model but they were sold at Audio King here in St Paul and I think they were in the $700-1k range for the pair in 1993 or 94. I went back to buy a pair a few months later and they dropped the brand and replaced them with KEF's or BP's if I'm not mistaken.

Feanor
06-17-2010, 02:59 AM
Well everyone, I have settled on a new pair of speakers. New to me anyhow. This Thursday I will be picking up a super minty pair of Mission 707 w/ original stands for a cool $100.
...

Any thoughts would be great, no matter how opposed. I also hope to speak to any owner's of Mission or the 707.

Keep in mind this model sold a ton for Mission, so in spite of critics, the consumer side of things was up 'n up. I am looking for an efficient 2 way, 8 or 10" woofer, that has a lively sound.
...

Doesn't Target Hifi here in London carry Mission? :yesnod:

I was temped by a particular Mission model about a decate ago; don't remember the model but they did sound great. (I listened to them a Bay Bloor Radio in Toronto. Ever been there?). That model also received some great reviews. But it's struck me over the years that Mission reviews have varied greatly model to model. I don't recall about the 707 specifically, but for $100 you can't go far wrong.

poppachubby
06-17-2010, 03:27 AM
Yes Target carry Mission Bill. They have the M32i and couple other of M series. The problem is, for that money I would rather have something else.

Bay/Bloor Radio has been there since I was a kid. My old man used to take me in there occasionaly, as well as High End. I used to go in to sample headphones, as they stock quite a few.

I agree with you, for $100 it's a no brainer. The fact that they are mint with stands makes it a fantastic deal.

poppachubby
06-17-2010, 09:47 AM
After an hour of listening, I'm super impressed. They live up to their reputation. Superb imaging matched with incredible detail and clarity. Overall, fast and open. A great match for my amp.

They still have their original foam surrounds. Although intact, I want to look into some rubber.

Geoffcin
06-17-2010, 10:57 AM
Sweet!!

blackraven
06-17-2010, 03:08 PM
Pops, you are piecing together quite a system there. Much Kudos!

poppachubby
06-17-2010, 03:31 PM
Thanks guys. I found a local seller for a rubber surround kit. Tommorrow I'll upgrade the woofers.

Things are sounding good but I still need a TT upgrade. It's becoming a thorn in my side.

Actually, I have been enjoying my computer system lately. My SX650 into the Sound Dynamics sounds crazy awesome. The 1200 SMT are 102db, so you can imagine the party.

JohnMichael
06-17-2010, 03:40 PM
Thanks guys. I found a local seller for a rubber surround kit. Tommorrow I'll upgrade the woofers.

Things are sounding good but I still need a TT upgrade. It's becoming a thorn in my side.

Actually, I have been enjoying my computer system lately. My SX650 into the Sound Dynamics sounds crazy awesome. The 1200 SMT are 102db, so you can imagine the party.



Great find Poppa but I was wondering if changing from foam to rubber would alter the woofers specifications. I would hate for you to lose the sound you now enjoy. Of course someone with speaker design knowledge could say for sure.

poppachubby
06-17-2010, 04:14 PM
Great find Poppa but I was wondering if changing from foam to rubber would alter the woofers specifications. I would hate for you to lose the sound you now enjoy. Of course someone with speaker design knowledge could say for sure.

Well, I am getting the kit from a pro. I have told him the model and he is putting the kit together himself. I say rubber, but that is my assumption. I have read in a few places, owners using rubber for the surround.

http://www2.ebtech.net/~sndsaver/

JohnMichael
06-17-2010, 04:38 PM
Well, I am getting the kit from a pro. I have told him the model and he is putting the kit together himself. I say rubber, but that is my assumption. I have read in a few places, owners using rubber for the surround.

http://www2.ebtech.net/~sndsaver/



Sounds like it should work.

frenchmon
06-17-2010, 05:21 PM
Hey bfalls. Sounds good. H/T system huh?

Any thoughts on the RB-61? I would want to run them with my main rig. I'm going to pick up those Missions tommorrow morning. I'm super excited. They really are minty.

He PoppaC...ever run across a pair of Klipsch KM-4? I have a pair and they are a very good speaker. If you find a pair, you may get them for little or nothing today. They are military issue from 1994-97. Not a bad speaker at all.

poppachubby
06-17-2010, 05:27 PM
KM? Never heard of it. I was considering the KG series, 3 and 4. Did you serve?

frenchmon
06-17-2010, 05:58 PM
After an hour of listening, I'm super impressed. They live up to their reputation. Superb imaging matched with incredible detail and clarity. Overall, fast and open. A great match for my amp.

They still have their original foam surrounds. Although intact, I want to look into some rubber.

Cool. I've always wonder what the upside down config did to the sound of a speaker?

thekid
06-18-2010, 02:15 AM
PC- Nice pick up!
They look great and it appears you really like their sound. Price was right which makes them even. I think you made the right call on the KG's. I don't think his price was crazy high but I seem them come up often enough around here on CL in the $200 range.

I would do a little research before switching the surrounds it could affect the SQ.

poppachubby
06-18-2010, 02:41 AM
Thanks kid. I've got a pro looking into the surrounds. I have read about rubber being used, we'll see what he has to say. He's been doing speaker repair for over 10 years, JUST speakers.

They do sound great. I suspected just by design and specs that they would. They have been accused of a boxy sounding mid range, but I haven't found that. In fact the mid range has VERY nice detail and accuracy.

As for the Klipsch, perhaps down the road. I am like you, too many speakers kickin around. There are a few pairs I just won't let go of. Right now I have fallen back in love with my Sound Dynamics, apparently perfectly matched with the SX650. I am going to try to start a Sound Dynamics thread on AK. They really are special...

Dude , have you been keeping an eye out for a Philips CDP for me? Don't forget, you know I'll pay you if you find one.

thekid
06-18-2010, 03:20 AM
Thanks kid. I've got a pro looking into the surrounds. I have read about rubber being used, we'll see what he has to say. He's been doing speaker repair for over 10 years, JUST speakers.

They do sound great. I suspected just by design and specs that they would. They have been accused of a boxy sounding mid range, but I haven't found that. In fact the mid range has VERY nice detail and accuracy.

As for the Klipsch, perhaps down the road. I am like you, too many speakers kickin around. There are a few pairs I just won't let go of. Right now I have fallen back in love with my Sound Dynamics, apparently perfectly matched with the SX650. I am going to try to start a Sound Dynamics thread on AK. They really are special...

Dude , have you been keeping an eye out for a Philips CDP for me? Don't forget, you know I'll pay you if you find one.

I have not forgot about you.
Got in late last night so I am getting half-day off, so I will probably hit the thrifts later today.
You know I will score a bargain for you if I can. I am sure you told me but can you give me some specific model numbers you'd like to get?

poppachubby
06-18-2010, 03:34 AM
Thanks man. First of all, here's my thread. Please chime in to help get it going. I think it's a valid idea. I bet that AK has the most Sound Dynamics owners than any other spot on the net. The ADS owners put together a similar thread, worked out nicely.

http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=305451

As for the Philips/Magnavox, just about any model between 80 and 960. There are too many to write out, here's a list I copied. Anything with the TDA 1541A is VERY well regarded because that DAC is no longer in production.

That said, any model with a CDM-1 is similarily regarded. The CDM-1 is made from metal and notoriously well made.

CD 650, CD 960 and CD 80/85. Remember, Magnavox rebadged most of these and Marantz also share a few models.

Here is a link that shows DAC and transport. You'll see why it's difficult for me to list every desirable model, there are many. However there are some which I would not want. Hopefully you'd be in a situation where you can contact me after finding it.

http://www.marantzphilips.nl/the_complete_d_a_dac_converter_list/#P

poppachubby
06-18-2010, 08:49 AM
Got my kit. You guys were right, it needs foam surrounds and that's what I got.

Am I ever happy I took the initiative. To the touch, the surrounds cracked or crumbled! However, they were visually perfect. This bit of info is worth the price and labour (PITA) of a refoam.

The 3 - 4 hours I spent listening were done at low levels. I can almost guarantee had I cranked it, the foams would have completely fallen apart. This tells me that low levels was how the seller spent his listening time. It's the only reasonable explanation for why the foam did not fall apart.

I guess my point is this, aside from near mint condition, I now also have a good idea regarding the true state of the speakers themselves. He was the only owner, having bought them retail. He gave me the original brochure and manual. I should be able to count on quite a bit of life out of this pair.


http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4024/4711604995_400cf82774.jpg

poppachubby
06-18-2010, 12:41 PM
All done. Why anyone would pay someone to refoam is beyond me. No mess and centered perfectly....we'll see what tommorrow brings.

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1266/4712760254_320f93cd91_b.jpg

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4051/4712761706_a4aafd8c66.jpg

thekid
06-18-2010, 02:30 PM
Good luck!
I have done a couple of refoams now with no problems so I am sure you won't have a problem. Just be patient and don't hurry through it. Should only take a couple of hours but it will be time well spent. Let us know how it goes.

JoeE SP9
06-18-2010, 02:37 PM
Best wishes on your new fangled "acoustic transducers". You are making me have some second thoughts about CD transports and DAC's.No, I'm not going the Phillips TDA route. Your thoughts about transports is what piqued my interest.

poppachubby
06-18-2010, 03:07 PM
Best wishes on your new fangled "acoustic transducers". You are making me have some second thoughts about CD transports and DAC's.No, I'm not going the Phillips TDA route. Your thoughts about transports is what piqued my interest.

You'll need to explain more. Are you planning to buy a CDP or DAC? I'm looking at a Mission Dac 5 locally, it has a TDA 1547.



Good luck!
I have done a couple of refoams now with no problems so I am sure you won't have a problem. Just be patient and don't hurry through it. Should only take a couple of hours but it will be time well spent. Let us know how it goes

kid I am already done. Just waiting for the glue to dry. I'll bang em out tommorrow evening.

thekid
06-18-2010, 03:42 PM
kid I am already done. Just waiting for the glue to dry. I'll bang em out tommorrow evening.


Ah...those are the after pics....
Looked so good I could not tell-Great job!

frenchmon
06-18-2010, 04:27 PM
KM? Never heard of it. I was considering the KG series, 3 and 4. Did you serve?

Naw...I bought them in Carolina from a friend who did. He had the KM-4, the big brother KM-6 and the center channel KM-C. He sold them all for $400 bucks. Me and another friend split the cost with him taking the KM-6 and the KM-C. I paid $175 and he paid $225

As I said, the KM series was made for military only, but they where the same as those in the KG series sold to civilians. The KM-4 is the KG-3.5 and the KM-6 is the KG-5.5

Check it out.

http://www.klipsch.com/na-en/products/archive/km-series/

http://www.klipsch.com/na-en/products/archive/kg-series/default.aspx

poppachubby
06-19-2010, 04:43 PM
My, my, my.

These speakers really are fun and lively. The imaging is bang on and really boosts the detail. Integration between channels is seamless, and they melt into the walls giving a wonderfully open stage.

I had the Paradigm Model 7se hooked up for the last day. As compared to those, the 707 is light years better.

http://www.progarchives.com/progressive_rock_discography_covers/4024/cover_1542014122009.jpg

LP Blue Note Re-Issue

The Paradigms do a nice job with jazz. The 707's however instantly brought the band into the room. Hancock's piano is way more present and defined. Cymbals, particularily the ride are distinct and rhythmic, as they should be. The Model 7se did a great job with trumpet but the 707 really pushed the bar. The tone is superb and high pitched trills and blasts send shivers with eerie realism. The Paradigms really lacked in staging, depth was not apparent as it is with the Missions. This of course added to the overall performance.

http://images.uulyrics.com/cover/f/frank-black/album-frank-black.jpg

Redbook CD

This album is a real rocker, an area the Model 7se does well. I didn't care for the bass with them however, very bloated and undefined. The 707 again performed wonderfully. The vocals really shone as compared to the Paradigm. Not only that, but the crystal clear imaging of Black and his guitar, center stage, gave the music real excitement. Superb detail and seperation between all of the performers. I found that any deep bass with sudden impact was a tad boomy. Too soon to make a call...

http://e.imagehost.org/0906/friday-night-in-san-francisco.jpg

LP Columbia Original

This LP presents an interesting challenge. It's all guitar, so the bass responsibilities are basically nil. Mid and high range rule here. The Paradigm did really well with this, I would have to say just about as good as the 707 in terms of output. I felt the 707 displayed more intensity with the range, when DiMeola for example does an insane, blisteringly fast walk up the neck.

Of course, it's back to the imaging again. This album already has great seperation having placed each player on the left, middle and right for the whole performance. Still, the 707 widened and dissapeared giving a real sense of "being there".

Anyhow, if you've read this far you're a trooper. I plan to spend the evening spinning LPs. I've got some original Beck and DiMeola plus a few jazz numbers I want to spin.

Life is good.

thekid
06-19-2010, 05:21 PM
My, my, my.

These speakers really are fun and lively. The imaging is bang on and really boosts the detail. Integration between channels is seamless, and they melt into the walls giving a wonderfully open stage.

I had the Paradigm Model 7se hooked up for the last day. As compared to those, the 707 is light years better.

http://www.progarchives.com/progressive_rock_discography_covers/4024/cover_1542014122009.jpg

LP Blue Note Re-Issue

The Paradigms do a nice job with jazz. The 707's however instantly brought the band into the room. Hancock's piano is way more present and defined. Cymbals, particularily the ride are distinct and rhythmic, as they should be. The Model 7se did a great job with trumpet but the 707 really pushed the bar. The tone is superb and high pitched trills and blasts send shivers with eerie realism. The Paradigms really lacked in staging, depth was not apparent as it is with the Missions. This of course added to the overall performance.

http://images.uulyrics.com/cover/f/frank-black/album-frank-black.jpg

Redbook CD

This album is a real rocker, an area the Model 7se does well. I didn't care for the bass with them however, very bloated and undefined. The 707 again performed wonderfully. The vocals really shone as compared to the Paradigm. Not only that, but the crystal clear imaging of Black and his guitar, center stage, gave the music real excitement. Superb detail and seperation between all of the performers. I found that any deep bass with sudden impact was a tad boomy. Too soon to make a call...

http://e.imagehost.org/0906/friday-night-in-san-francisco.jpg

LP Columbia Original

This LP presents an interesting challenge. It's all guitar, so the bass responsibilities are basically nil. Mid and high range rule here. The Paradigm did really well with this, I would have to say just about as good as the 707 in terms of output. I felt the 707 displayed more intensity with the range, when DiMeola for example does an insane, blisteringly fast walk up the neck.

Of course, it's back to the imaging again. This album already has great seperation having placed each player on the left, middle and right for the whole performance. Still, the 707 widened and dissapeared giving a real sense of "being there".

Anyhow, if you've read this far you're a trooper. I plan to spend the evening spinning LPs. I've got some original Beck and DiMeola plus a few jazz numbers I want to spin.

Life is good.

PC

Nice write-up!
I will have to keep my eyes open for that music, they sound like they could be reference pieces for evaluating gear. You mentioned Beck in your post. My son burned me a copy of "Sea Change" which I love for early morning listening.

poppachubby
06-19-2010, 05:27 PM
PC

Nice write-up!
I will have to keep my eyes open for that music, they sound like they could be reference pieces for evaluating gear. You mentioned Beck in your post. My son burned me a copy of "Sea Change" which I love for early morning listening.

You should definitely check out Frank Black if you haven't. Really great rock. His self titled and Teenager of the Year are both awesome. I have wonderful LPs of these...

http://image2.imusic.co.kr/cover/pop/0110/A0110236.jpg

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/512AMaClavL._SL500_AA300_.jpg