car audio

[cgibsong002]

Hey guys, I'm hoping this is ok to post here. I know there's a sister site for this, but that forum is all but dead, or just starting, not sure which.
Anyway, car's a '78 camaro, so needs to stay with a shaft style receiver. currently i have an old blaupunkt daytona in there with 2 sony xplode's in the back. as is, i can't stand the sound when its turned up to a volume i enjoy listening at. the bass turns to complete flab and mud, while at the same time the highs are harsh and shrill. when playing with the bass and tone controls, there's no middle balance to help out.

Today I tried playing with my old speakers.. some real old pyramids, i forget the exact model. But they sounded basically identical to the sony's. So my guess is that the receiver is no good and isn't letting the speakers do their work. Now, does it make sense that my Blaupunkt receiver is no good? Yes, its probably from the 80's, but it is a top quality brand.

If I need a new receiver, what are my best options out there for shaft style? Should i go for another vintage such as a kenwood or alpine? Or should I go new and go with Auto sound, Pyle, Retro Sound, or something else that I might be missing?

[Mr Peabody]

What you probably need is an amp. Your Blaupunkt is running out of power trying to drive your speakers. If the stereo doesn't have preamp out you can find an amp with high level/speaker lead inputs. Kenwood amps used to be one of the best bang for the buck. You can go higher end and definitely cheaper but Kenwood will give you a decent amp for the money. Kenwood used to be more true to their power ratings than brands like Sony or Pioneer. Just to drive 6x9's I don't see any reason why to get a brute of an American amp like Rockford or PPI. And, if you buy something cheezy you'll be wasting your time and find you are back to square one with a bunch of distortion.

If Alpine still makes a shaft style that would be a good unit. Scosche used to sell factory replicas made for certain cars and I bet Camaro was one. Whether they still do is another story. But they used to be made by Pioneer with a Super Tuner and a couple other manufacturers. I might be wrong but I bet a higher end stereo in shaft style is hard to find.

[cgibsong002]

thanks for the reply as usual. So you're suggesting an amp possibly, huh? How could I determine whether my receiver is just not powerful enough, or just plain bad quality? Because if it's bad from the start, then an amp would just accentuate that, correct? But I see where you're getting at that possibly my problem is just that it doesn't have enough power to drive the speakers and is just distorting itself.

For receivers, there are plenty of sony, jvc, kenwood, pioneer, etc. shaft style receivers on ebay that are all from the 80's probably. But I'm hesitant to go with one of those after getting the old Blaupunkt. As for new shaft style radio replacements, I've found:

Cheap replacement by pyle http://cgi.ebay.com/PYLE-AM-FM-MPX-MP3-Shaft-Style-Dual-Knob-Radio-w-USB-SD-/380209574296?cmd=ViewItem&pt=Car_Audio_In_Dash_Receivers&hash=item588641b198

retrosound makes some real nice looking ones around the $200 mark.. sound wise I haven't a clue: http://www.retrosoundusa.com/

and here's some by autosound: http://www.casmfg.com/Camaro_Firebird_Radios.htm

[Mr Peabody]

I would suspect the Sony speakers aren't too hard to drive. If you have a typical car stereo with 5 watts or so per channel an amp would definitley help. If you have a "high powered" radio which usually boasts 20 to 25 watts per channel sometimes more, then your stereo should sound reasonably loud before distortion without an amp. Now the specs may say 20 to 35 watts per channel but that's not really what they will do. However they are more powerful which would drive a typical car speaker pretty well.

Was the stereo installed by some one who knows what they are doing? Some older car stereos had a common or floating ground where there were three wires for a set of speakers opposed to four. Any miswiring could cause distortion, if, you get sound.

One other thing that comes to mind is if the speakers are blown. Sometimes they will still work but distort when a bass note is hit.

If your balance works properly then you are most likely wired alright.

I would be sure the radio is the problem before spending money to replace it.

If it comes to replacement I wouldn't use the Pyle. You should try to find out who manufactures the stereos for Autosound and Replica, go with one you know for quality.

[cgibsong002]

the stereo was installed by me and my dad about 5 years ago. forget exactly what we did. but he worked with car audio for about 10 years a long time ago, so he should've known what he was doing. balance and fade both work just fine on the unit. the speakers are fine, I tested out another pair of speakers with the same result.

Maybe I should look at an amp from a site with a good return policy just in case that isn't the problem. Now, you mentioned a pre-amp out. I suppose this is probably on the back of my unit, if at all? Although I'm guessing a cassette model from the 80's most likely doesn't have this. What am I looking at if it doesn't have that pre-amp out? And could I possibly find something decent in the $100 range?

EDIT: actually, what do you think of this? great reviews, much cheaper than expected, looks like just what i need. It can take pre-amp and speaker level inputs. I figure there's no point in spending hundred or more on an amp when i only have an average system, and with the reviews its getting i think it should be just what i need. any thoughts?

[Mr Peabody]

Preamp outputs will be a couple of female RCA plugs hanging from the back of the unit. The shaft style would have them as well as anything, just depends on model.

If you posted a link it didn't show up on my computer. You could probably get a decent used amp for $100.00 or less but car audio is a bit more risk since you can't just plug it up to see if it works. You'd be really surprised at what an amp can do for your car audio system. You should try to get an amp from Kenwood, Kicker,Alpine, maybe an older Rockford. The old Rockford rated at 35 watts used to be a killer little amp that kicked many amps with large ratings square in the behind. Most any of the American amps are very good, Orion, Hifonics, Precision Power, Sound Stream but most of these will be expensive even used. Sony or Pioneer will do the trick just don't expect as much power as rated. I would urge you to stay away from no name cheezy amps, in most instances they'll just add more distortion to your system. They make wild claims of ungodly power that can only be produced if lightning strikes them.

[cgibsong002]

sorry for the lack of linkage, lol. here's a JVC for $50 on a scratch and dent http://www.crutchfield.com/p_105KSA3002/JVC-KS-AX3002.html?tp=115 .. has great reviews. and then there's this dual which is $120 at crutchfield but nearly half price at newegg http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16882255095

[Mr Peabody]

If it was me I'd take that JVC. Crutchfield will also help you out with tech support should you need it when installing. JVC always seems to be a good value product as well. It would work with your stereo whether pre outs or not too.

[cgibsong002]

If it was me I'd take that JVC. Crutchfield will also help you out with tech support should you need it when installing. JVC always seems to be a good value product as well. It would work with your stereo whether pre outs or not too.

i believe that's what I'm going to do. It has good reviews, it does what I want, and it's a great price. I don't see the need in spending more on an amp than what I've spent total on the rest of my system. Hopefully this'll solve my distortion problem and I can listen happily.

[Mr Peabody]

Be sure to let me know how it worked out.

Once hooked up be sure to set the gain control. If you don't want distortion, turn the gain on the amp all the way down. then turn the volume up to maximum on the radio. It shouldn't be that loud with gain all the way down. Then go back to the amp and slowly turn the gain up until it's as loud as you think you will ever listen or until you begin to hear slight distortion, back off a hair and leave it. This should allow you to be able to turn the stereo up without distorting the signal and leave your amp some reserve.

Be sure all the filters are turned off. I believe the description said it had both high and low pass. Another thing you may be able to do to prevent distortion and conserve amp power, depending on how the high pass was set up, cross the speakers at the lowest point like
40 Hz. If the filter didn't go down that far just turn them off. But I doubt if you'd get much info below 40Hz. It would have to be a very good cassette deck to provide those low frequencies and FM doesn't.

[cgibsong002]

Be sure to let me know how it worked out.

Once hooked up be sure to set the gain control. If you don't want distortion, turn the gain on the amp all the way down. then turn the volume up to maximum on the radio. It shouldn't be that loud with gain all the way down. Then go back to the amp and slowly turn the gain up until it's as loud as you think you will ever listen or until you begin to hear slight distortion, back off a hair and leave it. This should allow you to be able to turn the stereo up without distorting the signal and leave your amp some reserve.

Be sure all the filters are turned off. I believe the description said it had both high and low pass. Another thing you may be able to do to prevent distortion and conserve amp power, depending on how the high pass was set up, cross the speakers at the lowest point like
40 Hz. If the filter didn't go down that far just turn them off. But I doubt if you'd get much info below 40Hz. It would have to be a very good cassette deck to provide those low frequencies and FM doesn't.


awesome advice right there, you've been a great help, as you always have been to me here. thanks man, i'll hopefully be able to get this soon and see what happens.

[cgibsong002]

finally after all this time I installed the amp today. I've been away for a few weeks and didn't have a chance. This was my first time doing wiring in my car, so it took probably 5 hours at least. I ran into various problems and had to re-do things, but it really wasn't too hard at all once I realized what I had to do.

anyway, I'm blown away by the results. I bought an amp for 39.99 shipped, and my stereo system sounds like a high dollar system all of a sudden. The bass is clear and punchy, and I actually don't even need to put it past the half mark. It overall sounds fantastic now. Not perfect, sure.. but for a 80's model cassette player and 2 Sony speakers, I'm very satisfied. These results, by the way, were had through playing my Led zep II cassette, lol. I'm banking on even better results once I hook up a CD player or mp3 player instead.

As for the wattage... way more than enough. Peabody, I was going to take your advice and crank the receiver than slowly turn up the gain, but with the gain set to minimum, I never got near the cranked mark on the receiver. It was plenty of extra power. So for now I've got this amp set to 1/3 or so and am just adjusting the receiver to taste. I didn't really get a chance to play around and see what's clearest.

[JoeE SP9]

There is a good chance your cassettes will sound better than many MP3 files. If the MP3's were made at lower bit rates the chances of cassettes sounding better are even higher.
In any case I'm glad to hear your Camaro is sounding good. At one time I had a 78 Camaro with a worked big block (427), 12 bolt rear, rock crusher tranny, some other tweaks and a pair of Minimus 7's bolted to the rear deck. It did 11 second quarters with slicks.

[cgibsong002]

There is a good chance your cassettes will sound better than many MP3 files. If the MP3's were made at lower bit rates the chances of cassettes sounding better are even higher.
In any case I'm glad to hear your Camaro is sounding good. At one time I had a 78 Camaro with a worked big block (427), 12 bolt rear, rock crusher tranny, some other tweaks and a pair of Minimus 7's bolted to the rear deck. It did 11 second quarters with slicks.


ha, nice! I hope to rebuild the engine in some years time when I have the money and time. For now I'm actually looking to put in some 3.73's and a posi.

as for the sound system, well I rarely use mp3's. But when I do I never use under 192 at the very minimum. I try to always use 300 or higher. Anyway, my CD player is what I use.

[Mr Peabody]

Glad things worked out for you.

When ripping from CD see if you have in the options a setting called "variable bit rate" this makes better use of the bits and sounds better than a typical mp3 rip.

Yeah, Zepplin!!! :)

[cgibsong002]

Glad things worked out for you.

When ripping from CD see if you have in the options a setting called "variable bit rate" this makes better use of the bits and sounds better than a typical mp3 rip.

Yeah, Zepplin!!! :)

yeah, I do use that when ripping cd's. but I mainly only use my portable cd player and carry around a huge cd case. but a few years back my brother gave me that zeppelin cassette. i always keep that in the console in case of emergency :3: