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John Beresford
11-24-2003, 10:05 AM
For those of us who have adopted DVD as a collecting hobby and embraced it as a favorite new format as we buy new titles and replace old VHS ones, are we in danger from this NEW format known as D-VHS and D-Theater? DIGITAL VIDEO TAPE is said to deliver a TREMENDOUSLY better picture than DVD, but the players are like $3000 now and the rare titles are $35-$40 each, I believe...I read a review for "U-571" on D-VHS, which is one of my favorite titles in my DVD collection, and they absolutely raved about the picture and sound quality of the film in D-VHS form..."blowing DVD out of the water" or so I am told...

Do we need to now run out and dump our DVD players for D-VHS decks (which require rewinding of the films, just like VHS---and degredation of quality just like VHS) and begin relacing the DVDs with D-VHS titles??? I havent even SCRATCHED THE SURFACE of replacing my VHS titles with DVD yet, and now they want me to buy into D-VHS? I thought DVD was gonna be the definitive word on video at least for a long while...anyone else gonna buy into D-VHS/D-Theater?

JazzHead
11-24-2003, 11:31 AM
D-VHS is not really new - it's been around for a couple of years and has not gotten any traction.

Next big thing will be HD-DVD - DVD in 1080i. Currently two camps battling over the technical specs of the format - one, I believe, will be backward-compatible with DVD and the other will not.

Yes, HD pictures blow DVD out of the water. I haven't seen D-VHS, but if it's anything like b'cast or cable HD, it's like night and day. Whether that means one has to go out and replace a perfectly good collection of movies is an individual choice, of course.

peace,
jh.

John Beresford
11-24-2003, 11:47 AM
D-VHS is not really new - it's been around for a couple of years and has not gotten any traction.

Next big thing will be HD-DVD - DVD in 1080i. Currently two camps battling over the technical specs of the format - one, I believe, will be backward-compatible with DVD and the other will not.

Yes, HD pictures blow DVD out of the water. I haven't seen D-VHS, but if it's anything like b'cast or cable HD, it's like night and day. Whether that means one has to go out and replace a perfectly good collection of movies is an individual choice, of course.

peace,
jh.

Interesting. And I have heard that HD DVD will be the next big wave. So, are you saying we may be able to keep our current DVD collections and simply upgrade our player when the time comes so we may beging buying HD DVDs when they are out, players which will allow us to view standard DVDs as well? Or there may be one that will, and one that wont, as you say, right? Will these HD players, do you think, make our current DVDs look better, as SACD and DVD-Audio players claim to with standard stereo CDs? And, more frightening, does this mean we need to replace the DVDs we are CURRENTLY purchasing? Which leads me to...

I can see how perhaps HD pictures blow DVD visuals out of the water, but to buy into a format that requires rewinding of tape and degredation of material -- just as audio cassette and VHS -- seems a bit loopy to me...but for results that are "night and day" differences, perhaps the investment would be wise...this is where the consumer and above-average home theater enthusiast (like me) becomes confused...as I said, I haven't yet even NICKED the surface of making a dent in my DVD collection's want list -- replacing my favorites on VHS seemed to be first in order, so I have been doing mainly that, with, of course, buying newer releases that I really wanted (like Daredevil, U571, Gladiator, Spider Man, Episode II, etc). Now, Im being promised that THOSE excellent-looking DVDs will look MUCH, MUCH BETTER on Digital Video Cassette...what does one do? Replace all the gear in our systems and begin buying the $40 D-VHS titles? And then what?

Keith from Canada
11-24-2003, 12:04 PM
I have seen D-VHS and it does blow DVD out of the water. 1080i HDTV is far superior to 480p DVD.

That being said, tape-based technology has had its day and will forever remain in the day of the dinasour. It may take some extra time but a) HD-DVD and b) recordable DVD will be the next revolution in HT.

John Beresford
11-24-2003, 12:21 PM
I have seen D-VHS and it does blow DVD out of the water. 1080i HDTV is far superior to 480p DVD.

That being said, tape-based technology has had its day and will forever remain in the day of the dinasour. It may take some extra time but a) HD-DVD and b) recordable DVD will be the next revolution in HT.

Keith,

While I have not seen it, I cannot justify any comments with hard proof, I have just always wondered, after watching a really, really good mastered DVD, how much better a picture can get to the human eye. But so many people use the term "blows DVD out of the water," so something must be happening here.

And the fact that D-VHS is tape-based leaves a bad taste in my mouth....I just finished getting over the bulky dinosaurs that were VHS for these little CD-like discs, and now, they're coming back as better than DVDs!!?? I would be very seduced by much better audio and video quality, but the fact that I would be manipulating a VIDEO CASSETTE once again in my hands totally turns me off to D-VHS; Im just concerned with going out and needing to replace all our DVDs once again, all over again.

Would the best thing right now be to wait until HD DVD, and keep our current DVD collections, and just start buying HD DVD when the titles begin coming out -- in other words, begin the HD DVD collecting process starting with titles that may be out when the technology comes out?

Keith from Canada
11-24-2003, 12:28 PM
Perhaps the term "HDTV blows DVD out of the water" is somewhat of an exageration. Both formats offer clean prints of a film with few faults and both are leaps and bounds better than what came before them. The difference between the two comes in the level of 'crispness' that the picture has...colours are a little bit stronger and three dimensional in HD(they tend to 'jump off the screen' more) and details are a little more noticable (you can see a feckle on DVD but it has more detail in HD). If you weren't comparing the two directly, it's unlikely that you would notice too much of a difference.

In short, I wouldn't bother slowing down your DVD purchases just yet. It's going to take a while for HD-DVD to arrive and even when it does, regular DVD's will still have their place.

John Beresford
11-24-2003, 12:32 PM
Perhaps the term "HDTV blows DVD out of the water" is somewhat of an exageration. Both formats offer clean prints of a film with few faults and both are leaps and bounds better than what came before them. The difference between the two comes in the level of 'crispness' that the picture has...colours are a little bit stronger and three dimensional in HD(they tend to 'jump off the screen' more) and details are a little more noticable (you can see a feckle on DVD but it has more detail in HD). If you weren't comparing the two directly, it's unlikely that you would notice too much of a difference.

In short, I wouldn't bother slowing down your DVD purchases just yet. It's going to take a while for HD-DVD to arrive and even when it does, regular DVD's will still have their place.

Do you think the HD DVD players that hit the market will make standard DVDs look perhaps a bit better, as DVD-Audio and Super Audio CD players claim they do with making standard stereo CDs sound better?

Enmei
12-24-2003, 09:33 AM
SInce I haven't seen it in person, I can't say anything about the quality of picture.
But one thing for sure for me, DVD is still far superior than VHS.
We don't have to rewind the tape, We can just jump to any scene that we want, Fast forward / rewind with no long term effect on the tape and
cost less too. dvd won't wear out like tapes ( I already replaced my Godfather 2 tape 2 times , before I bought the dvd version)

Also the extra, like deleted scenes and the occasional commentary during a particular scenes ( very rarely, I only did it once), website links to the movies.



dvd rocks, vhs .... enjoy your retirement party

John Beresford
12-24-2003, 09:37 AM
SInce I haven't seen it in person, I can't say anything about the quality of picture.
But one thing for sure for me, DVD is still far superior than VHS.
We don't have to rewind the tape, We can just jump to any scene that we want, Fast forward / rewind with no long term effect on the tape and
cost less too. dvd won't wear out like tapes ( I already replaced my Godfather 2 tape 2 times , before I bought the dvd version)

Also the extra, like deleted scenes and the occasional commentary during a particular scenes ( very rarely, I only did it once), website links to the movies.



dvd rocks, vhs .... enjoy your retirement party

Enmei,

Thank you for the commentary; and ALL your observations are worthy and correct----DVD is superior for all those reasons, I agree. What worries me, though, is that experts are claiming D-VHS (digital videotape) is NIGHT AND DAY better than DVD----you can supposedly REALLY see a massive difference; if this is the case....why am I spending all this money on what I thought was the definitive format of DVD? Are we going to have to re-buy our entire collections yet AGAIN? I am nowhere NEAR replacing all my VHS movies on DVD yet, and I have already spent an obscene amount of money doing so....now, will DVD become obsolete after all this? I would be so mad....

kelsci
12-24-2003, 09:23 PM
John; At least from tidbits that I have read on the news section of widescreenreview.com, it is a matter of time before this so called DVD consortium agrees on a system for high definition DVD. That system is going to have to be backwards compatible for our current DVDs that we own. The new players and player/recorders that will eventually come out will proabably have a DVi output. HD monitors will have a DVI input which is supposed give the best video performance I believe by skipping a "conversion" step that video currently goes thru in current systems deployed in these monitors. Perhaps these new players will feature what a particular $300 Samsung model has that upconverts the picture and has a DVI output. I imagine down the road that it is possible that popular selling dvds in the current standard will be resold in a HD version. If I had a dvd recorder right now which does record in the current standard, I would transfer the video and audio of vhs tapes onto DVD -/+ R standard. If you like a particular film, and down the road it never gets issued in HD., you at least have it on DVD converted from tape. You may also find your interest in certain films may change over the years as you are influenced by newer films and of course getting older. I think people like optical discs in the current category. Their not too big to store and their not to small to loose. I like the idea of optical pickup which I consider the first technology of the 21 century when laserdisc was tested in the 70s. We finally had a virtually frictonless no contact means of recorded info unlike vinyl and tape which is subject to wear. It is possible technology may someday store a 4 hour movie on a chip with 10 channel sound, but why worry about that now. D-VHS is really an experiment because the tape capacity has the room to capture and show the potential of high definition. D/VHS is now going to include the 1509 kbps rate of DTS as well. There will be room for that on HD-DVD, in fact most likely 6 channels of 96/24 movie sound on HD/DVD when it comes. Enjoy what you have now. Kelsci

Geoffcin
12-25-2003, 12:37 PM
D-VHS is not really new - it's been around for a couple of years and has not gotten any traction.

Next big thing will be HD-DVD - DVD in 1080i. Currently two camps battling over the technical specs of the format - one, I believe, will be backward-compatible with DVD and the other will not.

Yes, HD pictures blow DVD out of the water. I haven't seen D-VHS, but if it's anything like b'cast or cable HD, it's like night and day. Whether that means one has to go out and replace a perfectly good collection of movies is an individual choice, of course.

peace,
jh.

HD is a great picture. I have a digital cable box hooked up to my 36" Panasonic Tau and the quality is phenominal. That being said, the quality of a GOOD DVD player in 480p is also great on my set. In no way is is "blown out of the water" by the HD quality. It may have to do with the fact the the Panasonic has a great line doubler in it, or that we are back about 12' from the image plane.

In my view, 1080 performance will be most noticable when you have a very large set, and/or are within 2X of the image plane. I'm in the middle of building an A/V room with a front projector that has a planned 100" screen. After that is completed I'll give another comment on HD vs. 480p.

recoveryone
12-27-2003, 06:14 PM
HD is a great picture. I have a digital cable box hooked up to my 36" Panasonic Tau and the quality is phenominal. That being said, the quality of a GOOD DVD player in 480p is also great on my set. In no way is is "blown out of the water" by the HD quality. It may have to do with the fact the the Panasonic has a great line doubler in it, or that we are back about 12' from the image plane.

In my view, 1080 performance will be most noticable when you have a very large set, and/or are within 2X of the image plane. I'm in the middle of building an A/V room with a front projector that has a planned 100" screen. After that is completed I'll give another comment on HD vs. 480p.

Geoffcin is the cable box digital cable or HD Cable, Their is a big difference, I just became a Beta Test for Adelphia cable in my area for the new HD signal and the 3 channels (NBC, ABC & PBS) I get are heads & shouders above the rest off the digital channels I have. Also the sound (stereo surround & 5.1) quality of HD programming.

Compared to DVD's you will not notice on smaller TV's (single CRT's), but on larger sets you can see a small difference in clarity. Just as All DVD's are not equal, I would have you use BlackHawk Down (HD Transfer) and see how it looks then put in another DVD (regular tranfer) and see the difference.

Getting back to the main question, I would say that D-VHS will find its niche with a few high end people out there, just to say I have one. But DVD is the format to stay for awhile. All of the video game market is DVD format now and that is the biggest money maker and trend setting arena around. We read more and more everyday people asking on this board about using their PS2 & XBOX as their main DVD player (they are making them better each year). I'm sure there will be a SCAD/DVD-A PS2 & XBOX coming out soon!