Any detective out here ?

[himanshu]

Ok, so here is the case.

Yesterday night I decided to play around with the "Wide Mode" feature that my newish Sony TV (KV-DRC29) has (its a regular 4:3 set). I put in the DVD of "The Fast and the Furious" (gr8 DVD, by the way for audio, best DTS sound track I have ever heard) in my Sony DVP-NS730P player and ran it first in normal mode (i.e. Player set for 4:3 TV and TV set in normal 4:3 mode), it was coming with pretty big black bars at top and bottom (I thought that those were bigger than many other movies, may be this movie is "ultra-wide" i.e. 2.3:1. Can somebody confirm?). I measured the width of those bars.

Now i set the player for 16:9 TV and ran the movie. In this mode the picture was taking more screen space (the black bar were almost half as less than before. I swear ! I measured them with tape again !) and the surprising thing was TV's wide mode had NO impact on picture size in this case i.e. the picture remained the same whether I kept the wide mode ON or OFF. I was very confused by this. The picture looked sharper than earlier run. I wasn't sure if picture looked "squished", which is supposed to happen if u run anamorphic material on 4:3 TV. It looked pretty good to me no matter which mode tha TV was in.

Now some background info- this DVD is not the original one (though it's a damn good copy ). The jacket says "Wide Screen Version" in front and on back "this DVD contain 2 versions, one which maintains original aspect ratio 1.85:1 and another which is enhanced for wide-screen".

I am told that while its common for DVD's to come in above 2 flavors but BOTH cannot fit in one "one-sided" disc so I am not sure that the one which I have, is which version?

So who can solve this riddle and explain as to what is really happening here?? Questions are - Why the bars REDUCE in 16:9 mode and why TV's wide mode has no impact in that scenario? based on the observations here, do I have the anamorphic version or the regular 1.85:1 version of DVD? Which is the best way for me to see this DVD?

Lots of questions and confusion here but I am sure there is somebody who can crack this case?

[Monstrous Mike]

Ok, so here is the case.

Yesterday night I decided to play around with the "Wide Mode" feature that my newish Sony TV (KV-DRC29) has (its a regular 4:3 set). I put in the DVD of "The Fast and the Furious" (gr8 DVD, by the way for audio, best DTS sound track I have ever heard) in my Sony DVP-NS730P player and ran it first in normal mode (i.e. Player set for 4:3 TV and TV set in normal 4:3 mode), it was coming with pretty big black bars at top and bottom (I thought that those were bigger than many other movies, may be this movie is "ultra-wide" i.e. 2.3:1. Can somebody confirm?). I measured the width of those bars.

Now i set the player for 16:9 TV and ran the movie. In this mode the picture was taking more screen space (the black bar were almost half as less than before. I swear ! I measured them with tape again !) and the surprising thing was TV's wide mode had NO impact on picture size in this case i.e. the picture remained the same whether I kept the wide mode ON or OFF. I was very confused by this. The picture looked sharper than earlier run. I wasn't sure if picture looked "squished", which is supposed to happen if u run anamorphic material on 4:3 TV. It looked pretty good to me no matter which mode tha TV was in.

Now some background info- this DVD is not the original one (though it's a damn good copy ). The jacket says "Wide Screen Version" in front and on back "this DVD contain 2 versions, one which maintains original aspect ratio 1.85:1 and another which is enhanced for wide-screen".

I am told that while its common for DVD's to come in above 2 flavors but BOTH cannot fit in one "one-sided" disc so I am not sure that the one which I have, is which version?

So who can solve this riddle and explain as to what is really happening here?? Questions are - Why the bars REDUCE in 16:9 mode and why TV's wide mode has no impact in that scenario? based on the observations here, do I have the anamorphic version or the regular 1.85:1 version of DVD? Which is the best way for me to see this DVD?

Lots of questions and confusion here but I am sure there is somebody who can crack this case?
Well I give some answers I hope.

First, if you set the DVD player to 16:9 and the picture on the screen changed, then the DVD you have is definitely anamorphic. Non-anamorphic DVDs are not affected by the picture size setting on the DVD player.

Second, if you toggled the TV WIDE setting between ON and OFF, and nothing happened, then that feature is not working on your TV for some reason.

If you are watching regular TV and turn WIDE ON, does the picture get the black bars and become squished? If not, then the feature is not working on your TV.

[himanshu]

Well I give some answers I hope.

First, if you set the DVD player to 16:9 and the picture on the screen changed, then the DVD you have is definitely anamorphic. Non-anamorphic DVDs are not affected by the picture size setting on the DVD player.

Second, if you toggled the TV WIDE setting between ON and OFF, and nothing happened, then that feature is not working on your TV for some reason.

If you are watching regular TV and turn WIDE ON, does the picture get the black bars and become squished? If not, then the feature is not working on your TV.

Thanks for your reply. At least some body did !!

The wide feature of TV IS working. I had checked that. I am told by some people that most players have the capability to send a flag to TV when they are running in 16:9 mode. Some TV with Wide-Mode feature are designed to "Lock-on" to Wide-Mode once they get that flag from TV and doesn't allow user to go to 4:3 mode as that will make the picture distorted. It a kind of "fool-proofing" the TV. Aparently my Sony KV-DRC29 has that feature.

As you said the movie in question surely is anamorphic version and it is 2.35:1 and NOT 1.85:1 as written on jacket.

Now the only confusion left is as to how come in 16:9 mode the picture is actually coming taller on screen compared to 4:3 mode !!! I would have expected the picture height to remain constant (to maintain 2.35:1 aspect ratio) with the difference being that in 16:9 mode the resolution would be sharper as TV will squeeze in more lines in the viewable area rather than wasting them on black bars. But what I am observing is that picture does become sharper in 16:9 mode but it also becomes taller (half black bars as compared to 4:3 mode). In fact when I repeated this experiment with a 1.85:1 disc (rather than 2.35:1) the black bars DISAPPEARED in 16:9 mode !!!!

[Monstrous Mike]

Let me recap and add some new info.

The DVD is 2.35:1 aspect ratio and is anamorphic. It should have large black bars on it when viewed on a 4:3 TV set. When viewed in the anamorphic mode and with the TV's WIDE mode on, the black bars should be the exact same height. That's a fact.

The reason for this is that the CRT guns in the TV will not fire from top to bottom of the screen but will only fire in a 16:9 aspect ration. Thus, you get the same number of scan lines but in a smaller area, thereby increasing resolution. If this is not happening, then from some reason your TV is not adjusting its CRT guns to the 16:9 ratio.

This would be very obvious if you rented an anamorphic DVD which is in the 1.85:1 aspect ratio rather than the 2.35:1 ratio. If you turn the TV WIDE mode on and play this type of DVD and see the picture fill the entire screen, then you have conclusive proof that the CRT guns did not squeeze the picture and for some reason the WIDE mode is not coming on.

You may be right about the flag. Some TVs have an auto WIDE setting that relies on the DVD player outputting this flag. And further, on some TVs this only works with component video. See if you can force WIDE on the TV.

[himanshu]

The DVD is 2.35:1 aspect ratio and is anamorphic. It should have large black bars on it when viewed on a 4:3 TV set. When viewed in the anamorphic mode and with the TV's WIDE mode on, the black bars should be the exact same height. That's a fact.

The reason for this is that the CRT guns in the TV will not fire from top to bottom of the screen but will only fire in a 16:9 aspect ration. Thus, you get the same number of scan lines but in a smaller area, thereby increasing resolution. If this is not happening, then from some reason your TV is not adjusting its CRT guns to the 16:9 ratio.

This would be very obvious if you rented an anamorphic DVD which is in the 1.85:1 aspect ratio rather than the 2.35:1 ratio. If you turn the TV WIDE mode on and play this type of DVD and see the picture fill the entire screen, then you have conclusive proof that the CRT guns did not squeeze the picture and for some reason the WIDE mode is not coming on.



Thanks a lot for your reply. U have nailed the issue when u said that "When viewed in the anamorphic mode and with the TV's WIDE mode on, the black bars should be the exact same height". Its NOT happening in my case, simple as that. I get very wide bars in 4:3 mode and half as less bars in 16:9 mode.

I have been posting this on some other forums and everybody keeps telling me that I DON'T understand Anamorphic concept. See this for a very compelling argument telling me that whatever is happening in my case is ACTUALLY corect-

http://www.agoraquest.com/viewtopic.php?topic=13550&forum=50

In fact the test that u said, I already did and the 1.85:1 movie "Two Weeks Notice" which comes with black bars in 4:3 mode comes WITHOUT any black bars in WIDE mode !!!!

I am now totally lost here. The TV's wide mode is surely working in regular TV broadcast and while playing anamorphic DVD's in 16:9 mode, the picture is decidedly sharper (more lines) but for some goddamn reason taller than 4:3 mode. :-(

What's going on here. The plot thickens !!!

[Monstrous Mike]

Do you use the same TV input for DVD and regular television. Perhaps the WIDE mode needs to be set separately for each input into the TV.

As well, maybe the 16:9 AUTO is not working because it is not picking up the flag. Try setting 16:9 to ON instead of AUTO.

[himanshu]

Do you use the same TV input for DVD and regular television. Perhaps the WIDE mode needs to be set separately for each input into the TV.

As well, maybe the 16:9 AUTO is not working because it is not picking up the flag. Try setting 16:9 to ON instead of AUTO.

I called up SONY support and they said that they will send some one over to have a look. Will keep u posted.