Emotiva UPA-2 - Pulling Trigger in 24 HRs - Help Me, I'm Scared!

[Ajani]

As I'm sure many of you aware, I'm a cheap @$$hole and am hence always on the lookout for a good deal to get my HiFi back on track... I contacted Emotiva and got a quote to have a UPA-2 delivered to me... I plan to pull the trigger tomorrow...

Any last words of advice or warning from Emotiva users??? (I know their are several of you on this forum)... I figure $300 is a good way to test the Emotiva waters without making a serious investment, so I can always upgrade to something ridiculous from them later on if needs be...

I will be buying a pair of Revel Concerta F12s to mate with the UPA-2 shortly...

My Benchmark DAC1 will serve as DAC and Preamp....

[audio amateur]

Wow, that's pretty cheap. I hope the shipping works out! Keep us posted, and make sure you have some pics to show when you've done setting it all up:)

[Tarheel_]

As I'm sure many of you aware, I'm a cheap @$$hole and am hence always on the lookout for a good deal to get my HiFi back on track... I contacted Emotiva and got a quote to have a UPA-2 delivered to me... I plan to pull the trigger tomorrow...

Any last words of advice or warning from Emotiva users??? (I know their are several of you on this forum)... I figure $300 is a good way to test the Emotiva waters without making a serious investment, so I can always upgrade to something ridiculous from them later on if needs be...

I will be buying a pair of Revel Concerta F12s to mate with the UPA-2 shortly...

My Benchmark DAC1 will serve as DAC and Preamp....

Let us know how the amp works out and how they mate with the Revels....always happy to see a fellow Revel owner around these parts as we are few and far between.

[nightflier]

Ajani,

Do you have any other speakers to compare them to?

[Ajani]

Wow, that's pretty cheap. I hope the shipping works out! Keep us posted, and make sure you have some pics to show when you've done setting it all up:)

LOL.. yeah... I can't wait to have it all setup and take some pics...

I had 2 choices in amplification really: order something online (and pay the heavy duties) or buy from my local dealer... My Local dealer sells Revel, Mark Levinson and Krell... So the cheapest amplification he has is the Krell S300i for $2.5K... So between Emotiva at a approx $400 (shipping included) and probably another $160 in duties versus $2.5K for Krell, i felt the Emotiva would make a very reasonable start...

[GMichael]

I have read only good things about Emotiva amps.

[Ajani]

Ajani,

Do you have any other speakers to compare them to?

Not much available locally... But Revel is one of my favorites from back when I lived in Toronto... My first choice would have been Monitor Audio, but they're not available here and would be way too expensive to order...

Other options from another local dealer (appears we have only 2 in Jamaica) are PSB, Paradigm and Definitive Technology... I have yet to be impressed by Def Tech or PSB and I have never heard Paradigm... Oh yeah, my preferred dealer also has KEF, but I didn't think too much of the KEF IQ90s I heard...

[nightflier]

So between Emotiva at a approx $400 (shipping included) and probably another $160 in duties...

What could possibly convince an audiophile to move to Jamaica? I'm sure the sun and Kingston nightlife are nice, but wasn't the Haiti earthquake and Katrina a little too close to home?

[Ajani]

What could possibly convince an audiophile to move to Jamaica? I'm sure the sun and Kingston nightlife are nice, but wasn't the Haiti earthquake and Katrina a little too close to home?

Luckily neither Katrina nor the Earthquake caused any damage here...

As for the extra price: that's exactly the problem with getting HiFi here.... Shipping and duties are insane... And the stuff priced fairly (local dealers) is extremely limited...

I was initially thinking of ordering a $1450 Naim Nait 5i, but by the time I add shipping and duties it will cost me just a fraction less than a $2500 Krell S300i from my local dealer... So just about anything mid-priced is out, as I might as well just save up for the Krell at those prices...

[nightflier]

Seems a little fishy. How do the local dealers do it?

[Ajani]

Seems a little fishy. How do the local dealers do it?

It's not that fishy... Local Dealers don't buy anywhere near retail and (I believe) get better rates for duties than individuals... So they can sell at near US MSRP...

[Mr Peabody]

Good for you. Looking forward to hearing your experience.

I don't like Reggae.... oh no.... I love it...

[Ajani]

I hope I end up as happy with my purchase as this guy:

http://emotivalounge.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=amps&action=display&thread=9036


Well after reading all of the forum banter, I started wondering if I was missing out on something by not having more expensive amps. So... I took the plunge and ordered a new Krell S300i integrated ($2500) for my 2 channel set up ( 2 Polk LSi9's, an Onkyo AVR as a pre, an Emo UPA-2, a Wadia 170i, and a Marantz SA8003). I received the Krell and hooked up tonight. No bash intended here on Krell, but what a huge disappointment! Compared to my Emo, the bass was totally lost, depth and detail were horrible. I was just shocked. I fiddled around with it for about an hour, yanked it out, hooked my Emo back up and all is well again. The Krell will be returned tomorrow. Please forgive me! I will never doubt again!!

I rather doubt the Emotiva would be the equal of a Krell (I'm hoping it will be up to Rotel Level - it should be based on direct sales) but I would love to be as happy with my purchase as that guy...

[dr bud]

Doen't sound like you gave that krell much of a chance to break in.I will be interested to see how the emo works for those speakers.Revels are nice.Should show short commings in the amp if there are any.Was thinking about getting emo's xpa 3 for my sourrounds.

[kexodusc]

I have a hard time imagining that Emo topping a Krell but maybe that guys ears just don't agree with Krell...Topping the usual basic Rotel/NAD/Parasound stuff, easier to believe...mine was a good step up from my NAD, Rotel,and Adcom amps, and this from a multi-channel amp. Not a massive, revolutionary night and day difference, but worthwhile one.

One thing you might consider - I find mine has a more neutral sound (and while I've only heard 2 other models their presentations were fairly consistent, though one had more bass authority) and is not as bright as my Adcom or even Rotels (which is I sometimes wish wasn't the case) but a bit smoother in the midrange and not as bloated or warm as my NAD amps are - Which isn't to say it's perfectly in the middle because it's not that simple. Hard to describe until you hear for yourself. But if you're a big fan of bright or warm leaning amps, it may not suit your personal preferences. I know one person whose ear I trust that basically admitted the amp was a good product but just not to his personal liking (obviously he, like me doesn't believe they all sound the same). I admit I do wish mine was just a hair livelier, but the improvements in other elements, and the extra gobs of power make it a pleasant compromise. If you're not super fussy you'll probably be quite happy. That's the downside of buying from companies like Emotiva and Outlaw. Gotta buy to try. I lucked out, and actually I think Pixelthis even enjoys his.

Looking forward to your review. Wonder how the Benchmark DAC 1 works with it? What was the last amp you owned?

[Ajani]

I have a hard time imagining that Emo topping a Krell but maybe that guys ears just don't agree with Krell...

Yep, my thoughts as well... Likely, he just didn't like the Krell's presentation, also it's clear he didn't give it much of a chance; bought it, hooked it up one night, played it, didn't like it and returned it the next morning...


Topping the usual basic Rotel/NAD/Parasound stuff, easier to believe...mine was a good step up from my NAD, Rotel,and Adcom amps, and this from a multi-channel amp. Not a massive, revolutionary night and day difference, but worthwhile one.

That's what I'm looking for, something better than or at least on the level of those brands..


One thing you might consider - I find mine has a more neutral sound (and while I've only heard 2 other models their presentations were fairly consistent, though one had more bass authority) and is not as bright as my Adcom or even Rotels (which is I sometimes wish wasn't the case) but a bit smoother in the midrange and not as bloated or warm as my NAD amps are - Which isn't to say it's perfectly in the middle because it's not that simple. Hard to describe until you hear for yourself. But if you're a big fan of bright or warm leaning amps, it may not suit your personal preferences. I know one person whose ear I trust that basically admitted the amp was a good product but just not to his personal liking (obviously he, like me doesn't believe they all sound the same). I admit I do wish mine was just a hair livelier, but the improvements in other elements, and the extra gobs of power make it a pleasant compromise. If you're not super fussy you'll probably be quite happy. That's the downside of buying from companies like Emotiva and Outlaw. Gotta buy to try. I lucked out, and actually I think Pixelthis even enjoys his.

I like either neutral or lively presentations, so hopefully the Emo should fit the bill...


Looking forward to your review. Wonder how the Benchmark DAC 1 works with it? What was the last amp you owned?

I had a Rotel RB-1080 (which I really liked) and before that a NAD C352 (which I didn't like)..

[Tarheel_]

My Revel dealer has the Concerta line paired with a nice big Marantz AVR in their demo room. Something with a 8 in the model name.

They really sound nice with that setup. Not sure you need a ton of watts to get good sound from the Revels.

From experience the Rotels mate very well with the Revel sound as i've owned a few. Revels are very revealing speakers so it makes finding a good amp match difficult.

I've used everything from a huge NAD amp to $100 AVRs and each sound totally different with my F30s.

Good luck on your search.

[Ajani]

My Revel dealer has the Concerta line paired with a nice big Marantz AVR in their demo room. Something with a 8 in the model name.

They really sound nice with that setup. Not sure you need a ton of watts to get good sound from the Revels.

From experience the Rotels mate very well with the Revel sound as i've owned a few. Revels are very revealing speakers so it makes finding a good amp match difficult.

I've used everything from a huge NAD amp to $100 AVRs and each sound totally different with my F30s.

Good luck on your search.

I Never got to try Rotel and Revel together... I had Mission Speakers back when I had the Rotels... But I always thought Rotel and Revel would be a good combo (for my tastes)...

The Concertas definitely don't need a lot of power, since they are efficient speakers (90.5db sensitivity), I don't listen at concert level volumes and I have a medium sized room... So I'm sure the 125 watts of the UPA-2 will be far more than I'll ever need.... I'd have gone for a low powered Class A amp (if I had found one for a decent price)...

[Ajani]

The Trigger has been pulled... The UPA-2 should be shipping early next week (so I should receive it by mid to end of next week)...

[Ajani]

Dayuuuum.... A setup this puuurty almost tempts me to toss the Computer Audio and start listening to CDs again:

http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o181/dandondap/IMG_00091-1.jpg

[nightflier]

Hmmm, an interesting comparison would be between Emotiva and Outlaw. I really wonder how the Emotiva UPA-1 would compare to the Outlaw M2200.

[audio amateur]

http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o181/dandondap/IMG_00091-1.jpg
The space ship look of Emotiva gear is one thing I don't like, especially in a 2 channel system (where I much prefer a traditional look). For HT I wouldn't mind...

[Ajani]

Hmmm, an interesting comparison would be between Emotiva and Outlaw. I really wonder how the Emotiva UPA-1 would compare to the Outlaw M2200.

UPA-1 : Look pretty.

M2200 : Look like pancake.

Comparison Done.

[nightflier]

So you're just buying based on looks? I thought better of you, LOL.

[Ajani]

The space ship look of Emotiva gear is one thing I don't like, especially in a 2 channel system (where I much prefer a traditional look). For HT I wouldn't mind...

Europeans! Hmmmph!!!
:ciappa:

[blackraven]

Congrat's! Hope you get years of enjoyment from it.

[blackraven]

The space ship look of Emotiva gear is one thing I don't like, especially in a 2 channel system (where I much prefer a traditional look). For HT I wouldn't mind...

You can always buy some Van Alstine gear and get that 1970 Heath Kit look!

http://www.avahifi.com/

[audio amateur]

Europeans! Hmmmph!!!
:ciappa:
lol, ya think? :smilewinkgrin:

[audio amateur]

You can always buy some Van Alstine gear and get that 1970 Heath Kit look!

http://www.avahifi.com/
I've always found those red power switches on the front plate to look pretty hardcore/unrefined :D

But hey, if you keep on going on about ava gear I may well pull the trigger some day!

[Ajani]

You can always buy some Van Alstine gear and get that 1970 Heath Kit look!

http://www.avahifi.com/

Think I'll pass on the VA looks...

[Ajani]

So you're just buying based on looks? I thought better of you, LOL.

Pretty Sound, Pretty Looks... as long as something is pretty, I'm happy... lol

Seriously though, I won't buy gear just cuz it's pretty, but it would take a lot to get me to buy something ugly (too many decent looking and sounding alternatives on the market)...

[blackraven]

I think if Frank VA made his gear all pretty like Emo that he would sell ton's more, but he's stubborn that way and is keeping costs down.

I really don't care for the VA look either. The Emo's look great!

[Ajani]

I think if Frank VA made his gear all pretty like Emo that he would sell ton's more, but he's stubborn that way and is keeping costs down.

I really don't care for the VA look either. The Emo's look great!

I wish he would update the looks too... I'd love to try one of his tube Pre-Amps eventually, but the look is just... :(

[audio amateur]

I think if Frank VA made his gear all pretty like Emo that he would sell ton's more, but he's stubborn that way and is keeping costs down.


Yeah, it looks like his gear offers a lot of bang for the buck. I hope he chooses to keep his prices down in the future.

[Ajani]

Yeah, it looks like his gear offers a lot of bang for the buck. I hope he chooses to keep his prices down in the future.

That's something I don't really accept. A product does not need to be ugly to keep costs down... A plain faceplate with a volume knob and a decent coat of paint will look nice to most persons... No need to go for even the pretty blue lights (which don't add much to the cost btw) or silver trim on the edges like Emotiva...

VA products could do with a simple makeover that would make them at least moderately attractive, without jacking up the prices...

[blackraven]

That's something I don't really accept. A product does not need to be ugly to keep costs down... A plain faceplate with a volume knob and a decent coat of paint will look nice to most persons... No need to go for even the pretty blue lights (which don't add much to the cost btw) or silver trim on the edges like Emotiva...

VA products could do with a simple makeover that would make them at least moderately attractive, without jacking up the prices...

Anjani, your way off base here. Those beautiful aluminum chassis' cost a lot. VA is a boutique business and does not have the high volume that other audio comapnies have that buy in bulk and keep costs down. VA builds each piece as the order comes in. It takes about 2 weeks to build a piece. I've talked to Frank about this. He know's that he could sell more with a fancier case but he is comfortable with his volume of sales and is not looking to get rich. He already has a huge following and does a lot of repeat business. Most of his customers are older and the bling is not important to them. Just read the audio circles forum. He states that he makes a comfortable living. I've been to his house and it's nothing fancy and a modest home where he build's his gear in his basement and things get shipped form there. FYI, he will be offering and new gold anodized face plate and chassis.

[Ajani]

Anjani, your way off base here. Those beautiful aluminum chassis' cost a lot. VA is a boutique business and does not have the high volume that other audio comapnies have that buy in bulk and keep costs down. VA builds each piece as the order comes in. It takes about 2 weeks to build a piece. I've talked to Frank about this. He know's that he could sell more with a fancier case but he is comfortable with his volume of sales and is not looking to get rich. He already has a huge following and does a lot of repeat business. Most of his customers are older and the bling is not important to them. Just read the aduio circles forum. He states that he makes a comfortable living. I've been to his house and it's nothing fancy and a modest home where he build's his gear in his basement and things get shipped form there. FYI, he will be offering and new gold anodized face plate and chassis.

I'm not talking about him going for an expensive Chassis... The existing chassis is fine... A simple change like a nicer coat of paint, removing the bright red industrial looking switches, and probably repositioning the knobs would make his gear look decent... He Doesn't need to make any major changes, just some minor cosmetic work....

The way his gear looks now is more about his own humble sense of style, than cost savings...

[blackraven]

I'm not talking about him going for an expensive Chassis... The existing chassis is fine... A simple change like a nicer coat of paint, removing the bright red industrial looking switches, and probably repositioning the knobs would make his gear look decent... He Doesn't need to make any major changes, just some minor cosmetic work....

The way his gear looks now is more about his own humble sense of style, than cost savings...


Agreed! His chassis' by the way are black anodized, no paint. Volume controls are motorized.

[frenchmon]

As I'm sure many of you aware, I'm a cheap @$$hole and am hence always on the lookout for a good deal to get my HiFi back on track... I contacted Emotiva and got a quote to have a UPA-2 delivered to me... I plan to pull the trigger tomorrow...

Any last words of advice or warning from Emotiva users??? (I know their are several of you on this forum)... I figure $300 is a good way to test the Emotiva waters without making a serious investment, so I can always upgrade to something ridiculous from them later on if needs be...

I will be buying a pair of Revel Concerta F12s to mate with the UPA-2 shortly...

My Benchmark DAC1 will serve as DAC and Preamp....


Wow...congrats....I very interested in your review Ajani....I wanting to know if the Emotiva has a soft side, and if not, how much the Benchmark is needed. I listened to Concerto 12's When I lived in North Carolina and they where connected to Marantz Reference...great combination.

frenchmon

[frenchmon]

Not much available locally... But Revel is one of my favorites from back when I lived in Toronto... My first choice would have been Monitor Audio, but they're not available here and would be way too expensive to order...

Other options from another local dealer (appears we have only 2 in Jamaica) are PSB, Paradigm and Definitive Technology... I have yet to be impressed by Def Tech or PSB and I have never heard Paradigm... Oh yeah, my preferred dealer also has KEF, but I didn't think too much of the KEF IQ90s I heard...


I think you would like Paradigm Studio or Signature series if you like Monitor Audio.


frenchie

[frenchmon]

I hope I end up as happy with my purchase as this guy:

http://emotivalounge.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=amps&action=display&thread=9036



I rather doubt the Emotiva would be the equal of a Krell (I'm hoping it will be up to Rotel Level - it should be based on direct sales) but I would love to be as happy with my purchase as that guy...

Well lets just hope the Emotiva has some emotion and tonal abilities....if not then the Benchmark may do the job.

frenchmon

[frenchmon]

My Revel dealer has the Concerta line paired with a nice big Marantz AVR in their demo room. Something with a 8 in the model name.

They really sound nice with that setup. Not sure you need a ton of watts to get good sound from the Revels.

From experience the Rotels mate very well with the Revel sound as i've owned a few. Revels are very revealing speakers so it makes finding a good amp match difficult.

I've used everything from a huge NAD amp to $100 AVRs and each sound totally different with my F30s.

Good luck on your search.


Is your dealer over in Cary at Advanced Audio? When I Lived in Durham/Raleigh/Cary I use to visit Advance Audio. That's where I listened to the Revels pared with Marantz Reference. I also use to love to go over to Audio Advice....man they had some stuff....I loved the Wilson Watt Puppies. And then there was Audio Design and Expert Audio off of Glennwood who had all the Krell, Dali, and Cary Audio you could handle...Don't remember any Hi Fi shops down in Chapel Hill, besides, that's where you went to go girl looking over at UNC....oh how I miss North Carolina.

frenchmon

[frenchmon]

Dayuuuum.... A setup this puuurty almost tempts me to toss the Computer Audio and start listening to CDs again:

http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o181/dandondap/IMG_00091-1.jpg


How about this one?

http://img37.imageshack.us/img37/2782/glow3031420.jpg (http://img37.imageshack.us/i/glow3031420.jpg/)

And using Usher B-718 Tiny dancers.

http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/6475/newpaint13653855.jpg (http://img6.imageshack.us/i/newpaint13653855.jpg/)

I betcha those Dancers got the sound nice and warm.

[Ajani]

How about this one?

http://img37.imageshack.us/img37/2782/glow3031420.jpg (http://img37.imageshack.us/i/glow3031420.jpg/)

And using Usher B-718 Tiny dancers.

http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/6475/newpaint13653855.jpg (http://img6.imageshack.us/i/newpaint13653855.jpg/)

I betcha those Dancers got the sound nice and warm.

Why do I suspect that the most expensive component in that setup is the electronics stand?

Looks Sweet though!!!

[frenchmon]

Why do I suspect that the most expensive component in the setup is the stand?

Looks Sweet though!!!

Close but I think its the Dancers...then the stand.


frenchmon

[winston]

Ajani" I think the UPA-2 maybe out of stock until late this march" which could be April??!!
so there is some waiting

[Ajani]

Ajani" I think the UPA-2 maybe out of stock until late this march" which could be April??!!
so there is some waiting

Yeah, that's what's on the site, but the Emotiva rep I placed my order with (via e-mail) says they'll be back in stock and shipping early next week... So hopefully I won't have too long a wait...

[Ajani]

I think you would like Paradigm Studio or Signature series if you like Monitor Audio.


frenchie

I always imagined I might (the descriptions of their sound seems like what I'd like)... But since I can get one of my 2 favorite brands here, I'd rather play it safe than risk ordering the Paradigms and not being happy with the sound (we generally don't get the same wonderful return policies here as in the US - especially if I special order items)...

Besides, the Concerta F12s will be the best choice for my listening room (even if they are the least stylish looking) and I worry that pairing potentially bright Paradigms with potentially bright Emotiva might be too much...

[Ajani]

Well lets just hope the Emotiva has some emotion and tonal abilities....if not then the Benchmark may do the job.

frenchmon

Hopefully it does, if not I may go back to what I was initially thinking of ordering:

http://grantfidelity.com/site/Grant_Fidelity_B283_MKII_tube_processor_buffer

A Grant Fidelity Tube Buffer... I actually got a quote for shipping (3 KG) on that one yesterday (sadly their express shipping fees are higher than the ones for the 40LB Emotiva Amp - they really should switch to FedEx)

[dr bud]

That looks awsome!I don't know how emotiva stuff sounds but i personally love the blue lights!Don't know why so many people don't like the looks.

[poppachubby]

Did you contact Grant personally? I'm sure they would try and find a cheaper rate if one exists.

[Ajani]

Did you contact Grant personally? I'm sure they would try and find a cheaper rate if one exists.

Yep, I contacted them by e-mail, which is how I got the quote... They have a much cheaper option (which is what they initially offered me) but that one has no tracking... I'd never order an item without a tracking number....

[poppachubby]

No, I agree. If you have a cheaper method, call Ian or Racheal and let them know.


BTW, havee you givenanyy thought to analoogg forr you new system?? I really eenjoy my comps TT, what bbrands aareee avaiable lcallyy? Sorry, keyyboaard isssuess.

[Ajani]

No, I agree. If you have a cheaper method, call Ian or Racheal and let them know.


BTW, havee you givenanyy thought to analoogg forr you new system?? I really eenjoy my comps TT, what bbrands aareee avaiable lcallyy? Sorry, keyyboaard isssuess.

I'm not considering analog.... For practical considerations and not sound quality . Though, I'd be interested to see how a comparable priced TT rig compares to my Benchmark, I'm not willing to deal with the inconvenience involved in Vinyl (it's hard to go from playlists and my entire music library accessible by remote, to getting up and changing records or individual tracks).... + I don't own any LPs (which I don't think they sell locally anymore).... So lots of cost and hassle involved...

[poppachubby]

Well, no LP's available for purchase is a big hassle. I was referring to inputting the TT preamp into the Benchmark, and integrating it into your system. It's not 100% true analog to a purist, but it's indeed analog. Much more convenient than my main system in terms of changing sides or LP's. I literally sit next to it. Check it out...

[Ajani]

Well, no LP's available for purchase is a big hassle. I was referring to inputting the TT preamp into the Benchmark, and integrating it into your system. It's not 100% true analog to a purist, but it's indeed analog. Much more convenient than my main system in terms of changing sides or LP's. I literally sit next to it. Check it out...

Nice setup!!! That's actually the best use of a TT for a lazy person (like myself)... I never thought of hooking one up next to my computer.... I wouldn't get up from my listening chair to flip albums, but if they were within arm's reach... hmmm...

Sadly, the lack of LPs for sale would still be the killer (in addition to having to spend more money for a TT)...

[frenchmon]

I always imagined I might (the descriptions of their sound seems like what I'd like)... But since I can get one of my 2 favorite brands here, I'd rather play it safe than risk ordering the Paradigms and not being happy with the sound (we generally don't get the same wonderful return policies here as in the US - especially if I special order items)...

Besides, the Concerta F12s will be the best choice for my listening room (even if they are the least stylish looking) and I worry that pairing potentially bright Paradigms with potentially bright Emotiva might be too much...

I've listened to both Paradigm and Revel and the Paradigms are a more lively speaker( not saying the Revels are boring...just not as much sparkle as the Paradigms...the signatures as witnessed by myself and MrP have an outstanding mid section sound that gives off some of the best imaging you will hear in a speaker in that price class..at least to my thinking...I've heard others say the Studios are not that far off of the Signatures but I don't know if they can match the imaging in the mids of the Sigs.) ...so If Emotiva is a very etched amp they might not pair well with the Digms and may be more suited for the Revels which have a very balanced, clear sound but more subdued with a little less intensity in the mids than the Digms but a more natural robust bottom end than the Digms. The Revels are a very musical speaker. I betcha that Benchmark is going to do the trick with the Emotiva and the Revels...should be a very nice and interesting combination. Let us all know asap what its like.

frenchmon

[frenchmon]

That looks awsome!I don't know how emotiva stuff sounds but i personally love the blue lights!Don't know why so many people don't like the looks.

Actually, I've seen MrP's Emotiva and I can tell you the pictures don't do it much justice....they dont look bad at all in person.

[Ajani]

I've listened to both Paradigm and Revel and the Paradigms are a more lively speaker( not saying the Revels are boring...just not as much sparkle as the Paradigms...the signatures as witnessed by myself and MrP have an outstanding mid section sound that gives off some of the best imaging you will hear in a speaker in that price class..at least to my thinking...I've heard others say the Studios are not that far off of the Signatures but I don't know if they can match the imaging in the mids of the Sigs.) ...so If Emotiva is a very etched amp they might not pair well with the Digms and may be more suited for the Revels which have a very balanced, clear sound but more subdued with a little less intensity in the mids than the Digms but a more natural robust bottom end than the Digms. The Revels are a very musical speaker. I betcha that Benchmark is going to do the trick with the Emotiva and the Revels...should be a very nice and interesting combination. Let us all know asap what its like.

frenchmon

Yep your Revel/Paradigm comparison sounds exactly like how I'd expect the 2 to compare, based on my experience with Revel and the descriptions of Paradigm...

With the Revel I know that I won't need as careful matching of electronics and I can more easily change the sound by switching amp and/or pre.... Plus I really want the full range extension of the Revels... My Active monitors are very nice (especially when used on my computer desk), but I want much 'bigger' sound for my listening room... I want variety between my headphones, active speakers and main system....

[Ajani]

Actually, I've seen MrP's Emotiva and I can tell you the pictures don't do it much justice....they dont look bad at all in person.

Mr P, needs to pull the trigger on an Emotiva amp!!!! I'd love to see how he thinks it compares to his Krell and Conrad Johnson gear... I certainly wouldn't expect him to toss the Krell and CJ as a result, but it would be interesting to see how close the Emotiva comes to genuine high end gear...

[errol van]

I read the review about these items and and at about $1300 delivered I will replace my twenty something year old receiver for two channel music listening. EMOTIVA seems to be a good company and I look forward to the change!

[frenchmon]

Ajani...looks like you got some Revels in you avatar?

frenchmon

[Ajani]

Ajani...looks like you got some Revels in you avatar?

frenchmon

Looks is the right word... I haven't ordered mine yet... But I'm going to get the black versions like in my avatar...

[Tarheel_]

Yep your Revel/Paradigm comparison sounds exactly like how I'd expect the 2 to compare, based on my experience with Revel and the descriptions of Paradigm...

With the Revel I know that I won't need as careful matching of electronics and I can more easily change the sound by switching amp and/or pre.... Plus I really want the full range extension of the Revels... My Active monitors are very nice (especially when used on my computer desk), but I want much 'bigger' sound for my listening room... I want variety between my headphones, active speakers and main system....


Revels spit out what they receive...i think that is a good thing , but others don't. They will give you the upper/ mid/ low range as they are feed, but they are not forgiving...meaning once you chance a piece of the puzzle, they change with it. The right combo is tough because you upgrade a DVD player or even Directv receiver (analog vs digital) they sound different.
Once you find something they play nicely with, your in heaven, but if your buying online stuff it can be frustrating. I know as I tend to buy used. It's taken me close to 6 years to find the right combo for my HT room.
The good part is...it doesn't take expensive equipment (what reviewer say) to find the right pieces.

[Ajani]

Revels spit out what they receive...i think that is a good thing , but others don't. They will give you the upper/ mid/ low range as they are feed, but they are not forgiving...meaning once you chance a piece of the puzzle, they change with it. The right combo is tough because you upgrade a DVD player or even Directv receiver (analog vs digital) they sound different.
Once you find something they play nicely with, your in heaven, but if your buying online stuff it can be frustrating. I know as I tend to buy used. It's taken me close to 6 years to find the right combo for my HT room.
The good part is...it doesn't take expensive equipment (what reviewer say) to find the right pieces.

I agree... That's part of why Revel is one of my favourite brands... In addition to the Emotiva for (Hopefully) good affordable SS sound, I eventually want to add a low powered Tube/Class A Integrated (with headphone out) that I can alternate as headphone amp or for use with the Revels...

The Concerta F12s have 2 advantages over the Performa and Ultima lines:

1) Much cheaper - I think that requires no explanation :)

2) Higher sensitivity - so I can hook up some 5 watt sets and still get some volume out of them...

I can't wait to join the Revel owners' club... :biggrin5:

[Ajani]

Got an e-mail from Emotiva, looks like I won't get the UPA-2 before next week... (no big deal, since I haven't bought speakers yet)...

Got to admit that when I see the equipment some persons have paired their Emotiva gear with, it really makes me anxious to know how good Emotiva really is...

One I saw today had a USP-1 Pre / UPA-2 Amp with a Marantz Reference SACD Player and Focal Electra 1000Be Speakers... That's some quality gear being used with very inexpensive amplification...

[manlystanley]

If the Emotiva is a bright amp and the Revel's are revealing speakers, wouldn't that be a bad match? Is your room well dampened with carpet, curtains, etc??

Best Regards,
Stan

[Ajani]

If the Emotiva is a bright amp and the Revel's are revealing speakers, wouldn't that be a bad match? Is your room well dampened with carpet, curtains, etc??

Best Regards,
Stan

Even if the Emotiva leans towards the bright side, that won't be an issue... As I like neutral to bright sounding gear (not excessively bright)... I generally don't like warm or rolled off gear...

[rob_a]

Even if the Emotiva leans towards the bright side, that won't be an issue... As I like neutral to bright sounding gear (not excessively bright)... I generally don't like warm or rolled off gear...

I am using the UPA-2 with PSB image T5's. The sound I get is very neutral and not bright at all. good luck with your new amp.

[Ajani]

I am using the UPA-2 with PSB image T5's. The sound I get is very neutral and not bright at all. good luck with your new amp.

Thanks Rob, that's good to hear...

[nightflier]

Well you could get adventuresome and move the VA innards into your own emotiva-like box and change out the red LEDs for blue ones.

Come to think of it, if VA would outsource that....

[Ajani]

Well you could get adventuresome and move the VA innards into your own emotiva-like box and change out the red LEDs for blue ones.

Come to think of it, if VA would outsource that....

Interesting point: Since the chassis is often the most expensive portion of a component, why don't more manufacturers just outsource that part to China? Do all the design and assembly of the internal components locally, but let the Chinese build a beautiful luxury chassis for less than it would cost to produce some handmade ugly chassis locally...

[rob_a]

Don't forget to pick up some Oracle MA-X Speaker Cables for your new amp. :3:

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

Interesting point: Since the chassis is often the most expensive portion of a component, why don't more manufacturers just outsource that part to China? Do all the design and assembly of the internal components locally, but let the Chinese build a beautiful luxury chassis for less than it would cost to produce some handmade ugly chassis locally...

This my friend is a brilliant idea!

[Ajani]

Shipping is a funny thing, it doesn't cost "too much more" in shipping costs to upgrade my order from a UPA-2 to an XPA-2... So with payday around the corner and that in mind, I upgraded my order. So late next week an XPA-2, should be responsible for giving me a bad back...

Anway, I figured if I'm going to buy a solid state amp I might as well go big or go home... So far the only amps I've really liked are either low powered tube hybrids or really balls out, powerful SS...

(Maybe I'll add a low powered SET amp later as an alternative - who knows?)

[Mr Peabody]

That should rock, looking forward to hearing your impressions.

[audio amateur]

Cool dude! What's the ETA? and when are you buying the Revel's?

With that combo, I reckon you could play somes tunes at serious party levels!

[rob_a]

The XPA-2 is a great amp. You should not have any problems! :thumbsup:

[nightflier]

This my friend is a brilliant idea!

...for acknowledging the source.

[Ajani]

Cool dude! What's the ETA? and when are you buying the Revel's?

With that combo, I reckon you could play somes tunes at serious party levels!

ETA is around next Friday (since apparently neither the UPA-2 nor the XPA-2 are in stock until Tuesday).

The Revels won't be purchased for at least 2 months (since I want to pay cash and not on credit + the decision to upgrade from the UPA-2 to XPA-2 meant using some of the Revel cash)... So I'll have to use some 'other' speakers I have (that I won't mention out of audiophile shame) with the XPA-2 until I get the Revels...

EDIT: Of course this assumes Revel won't release a replacement for the F12 in the next 2 months (which is quite possible since they are 5 years old now)....

I should be able to thoroughly p!ss off all my neighbors with that combo... :devil:

[frenchmon]

ETA is around next Friday (since apparently neither the UPA-2 nor the XPA-2 are in stock until Tuesday).

The Revels won't be purchased for at least 2 months (since I want to pay cash and not on credit + the decision to upgrade from the UPA-2 to XPA-2 meant using some of the Revel cash)... So I'll have to use some 'other' speakers I have (that I won't mention out of audiophile shame) with the XPA-2 until I get the Revels...

EDIT: Of course this assumes Revel won't release a replacement for the F12 in the next 2 months (which is quite possible since they are 5 years old now)....

I should be able to thoroughly p!ss off all my neighbors with that combo... :devil:


Ahhhh Come on Ajani....what speakers are they? It cant be to bad....I'll tell you what...I heard some of the best speakers today that I have ever heard in my life, and you wont believe what they where....I still cant believe what they where....they where some Klipsh speakers..they where the Klipschorn...each speaker had three amps driving them....the bass was driven by a 350 watt mono Jeff Rowland amp, the mids by a 250 watt Jeff Rowland amp and the tweets by a 100 watt Jeff Rowland amp...the electic was on its own dedicated line, going into some power distributor in his rack ....two mono Esoteric DACs, a $6500.00 Esoteric CDP some fancy Accuphase thingy that had all kinds of knobs and a few other pieces of gear that I could not even began to tell you what they where, maybe MrPeabody could tell you...and all the while the guy had his two key boards intergrated into his rig so that he could play along with the music...I mean he interjected himself in the CD that was playing in the CD player....and all that was integrated with his computer....oh and he also integrated all that with his second system up stairs in his family room that had two Marantz Reference mono block amps ($15,000 pair) and preamp driving some 8feet tall Dynaudios.($8,000) the guy had over $100.000 worth of audio gear. My little system is a mere toy compared to what MrPeabody and I saw today...so don't be ashamed of what you have.


frenchmon

[Mr Peabody]

I would say Ajani is a closet Bose guy but I'm sure they are too warm for him :)

[Ajani]

Oh my back! My back!!!!

EDIT: I picked up my XPA-2 today...

Pics to come soon... after I get back from the chiropractor... :devil:

[Mr Peabody]

You haven't plugged it in to anything yet?

[Ajani]

You haven't plugged it in to anything yet?

I've hooked it up to the Benchmark DAC 1 and a pair of speakers more shameful than Bose... Normally I think these speakers sound awful, especially the bass which is boomy, indistinct and just plain nasty... I almost had to pinch myself when I heard the Bass on these speakers with the XPA-2, the description a reviewer for the XPA-2 gave, came to mind immediately: "tighter than a g-string on a fat girl"... If the DAC1/XPA-2 can make unlistenable speakers sound almost acceptable, I can't wait to hook it up to some good speakers and see what it can do!!!

[Ajani]

Ok, I still haven't gotten batteries for my camera yet ... i'll try to remember to do so tommorrow and take some pics... This amp looks a lot sweeter in person (I wonder if that is the right word?) than in the pics I've seen of it online....

A couple of points:

1) This is the first time these unmentionable speakers have ever sounded decent...

2) High volume is clean to levels I'm unwilling to listen at (for more than a few seconds to test the amp's capabilities)...

3) Low volume is equally sweet (which is not something I generally associate with ultra powerful amps)... As much as enjoyed my Rotel RB-1080, I must admit that it sounded worlds better when you cranked the volume....

4) Assuming the specifications on my speakers are correct, then the amp can easily drive difficult speakers... my speakers are rated at 3 ohms (and while I don't trust the brand to give honest specifications, I can't see why they'd claim that their speakers are difficult to drive)....

[Mr Peabody]

The XPA-2 looks like a beast on paper with 24 output devices and it's transformer. It's on my list to try if I get a purpose for one. The XPA-1 looks like basically a bridged XPA-2, each 1 has it's own 24 output devices and if memory serves the power supply is even larger.

Ajani when your gear gets broken in I'm interested to see if the highs are harsh or fatigueing. Although the ERC-1 is a great player and not harsh, in some set ups it can be a bit brash but it's more a upper midrange thing. The ERC has settled in and sounds pretty good linked to my Krell integrated though, better than any CDP that price should.

[frenchmon]

Ajani...PM me with the name of those speakers....The suspense is just killer!

frenchmon

[kexodusc]

I think he should just blurt it out...how bad it could it be? I never make fun of anyone's speakers. I'm always impressed when people can get mileage out of otherwise unwanted gear.

I'm gonna guess vintage 1980's Pioneer or Sony...the kind with the tone controls on the front baffle!

[Ajani]

I think he should just blurt it out...how bad it could it be? I never make fun of anyone's speakers. I'm always impressed when people can get mileage out of otherwise unwanted gear.

I'm gonna guess vintage 1980's Pioneer or Sony...the kind with the tone controls on the front baffle!

Good guess, but not quite there...

The initial plan was to resurrect my late 90s Technics SBLX70 Speakers (3 way with 12" woofers)... but I couldn't deal with the hassle of moving them from my parents' house on the other side of the island.... So I'm using the next best thing: Panasonic Mini system speakers... I rent a furnished house, and included was the mini system - so I just hooked them up to see that the Emotiva was working....

And I know this will kill any audiophile credibility (that I imagine that I had) but I'll be damned if $2,100 worth of electronics hasn't made the Pany speakers sound decent... hooked up to the mini-system they sound boomy, with no midrange and piercing highs... but with the Benchmark/Emotiva combo I can honestly say that they sound like a cheap entry level pair of audiophile speakers... Which I thought would be impossible.... I've actually listened to the setup all day and enjoyed it... (maybe it's time I quit hanging around HiFi sites and see a therapist).... The bass actually sounds clean and no longer has the one note boom like a car sub... I can even hear some detail in the mids... and the highs don't irritate the hell out of my ears....

[Mr Peabody]

Well I hate to tarnish an otherwise fairly smooth running thread but I have mentioned on AR a few times the importance of source components and if the signal isn't retrieved and maintained throughout the chain nothing you will do at the end will allow you to hear that lost part of the signal. I believe you may have found this out and reinforced my position. Yes, there is a tremendous difference between speakers, as I have been sitting and playing Klipsch in place of my Dyn's I certainly understand that. But those in search of sincere quality audio need to understand the importance of beginning with a good source. I do have to commend a few here at AR who have improved their front ends since I've been hear. Something about that last sentence just doesn't sound right :) oh well.

I had a similar experience as yours Ajani many years ago. I was sitting and talking to the guys in the service shop who used an old pair of Kenwood speakers on the test bench. I heard them many times and never much to speak of. One of them brought in a Mac tube amp and hooked it up to those speakers and I was in amazement. Not only was it some of the best sound I've heard up to that point but it was coming from those cheap speakers.

[Ajani]

Well I hate to tarnish an otherwise fairly smooth running thread but I have mentioned on AR a few times the importance of source components and if the signal isn't retrieved and maintained throughout the chain nothing you will do at the end will allow you to hear that lost part of the signal. I believe you may have found this out and reinforced my position. Yes, there is a tremendous difference between speakers, as I have been sitting and playing Klipsch in place of my Dyn's I certainly understand that. But those in search of sincere quality audio need to understand the importance of beginning with a good source. I do have to commend a few here at AR who have improved their front ends since I've been hear. Something about that last sentence just doesn't sound right :) oh well.

I had a similar experience as yours Ajani many years ago. I was sitting and talking to the guys in the service shop who used an old pair of Kenwood speakers on the test bench. I heard them many times and never much to speak of. One of them brought in a Mac tube amp and hooked it up to those speakers and I was in amazement. Not only was it some of the best sound I've heard up to that point but it was coming from those cheap speakers.

Years of listening to you preach about the importance of a good source is what led me to start with the DAC1 when I began rebuiling my setup .... And this experience has cemented that point about the importance of the signal chain.... While I've certainly heard good results pairing quality speakers/headphones with cheaper electronics, this experience has been a real eye opener about the kind of results quality electronics can bring to even cheap speakers...

I honestly never imagined a pair or mini system speakers could sound in anyway decent... The traditional HiFi logic is to ditch the mini system speakers first and replace them with a PSB Alpha or Paradigm Atom.... Not to replace the mini system with a decent amp and source, before changing the speakers...

[blackraven]

Congrat's on your new amp Ajani. I'm sure it will be a killer with that Benchmark DAC/pre and the Revels your planning on buying. I'm looking forward to your review.

I'm thinking about a UPA-2 and one of those cheap chinese tube Pre/DAC from Grant or Pacific Valve to run with my MMG's in my basement system.

[manlystanley]

I had a similar experience as yours Ajani many years ago. I was sitting and talking to the guys in the service shop who used an old pair of Kenwood speakers on the test bench. I heard them many times and never much to speak of. One of them brought in a Mac tube amp and hooked it up to those speakers and I was in amazement. Not only was it some of the best sound I've heard up to that point but it was coming from those cheap speakers.

Great story! I'll need to keep that in mind.


Best Regards,
Stan

[Ajani]

Congrat's on your new amp Ajani. I'm sure it will be a killer with that Benchmark DAC/pre and the Revels your planning on buying. I'm looking forward to your review.

I'm thinking about a UPA-2 and one of those cheap chinese tube Pre/DAC from Grant or Pacific Valve to run with my MMG's in my basement system.

A UPA-2/Tube Pre sounds like an intriguing combo for a second system... Of course I'd prefer for you to use an XPA-2 in the second system so you could compare it to the Halo A21 (I'd love to know how close the XPA-2 comes to the A21) :p

[bfalls]

Ajani...PM me with the name of those speakers....The suspense is just killer!

frenchmon

It may not be what they are that's embarrassing, but where he got them. Maybe he's been hanging out in parking lots. I hear you can get good deals on speakers there at a fraction of the cost

[bfalls]

I borrowed a pair of Kenwood bookshelf speakers from my brother-in-law several years ago. I was impressed how good they sounded, especially from a company not known for their speakers. I've been very impressed with the power from my XPA-5 and have no complaints. Enjoy.

[frenchmon]

Ajani...this guy had some custom wood work done to replace the aluminum ones on his gear...what do you think? I think it looks good.

http://img718.imageshack.us/img718/9969/0162879467.jpg (http://img718.imageshack.us/i/0162879467.jpg/)

http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/5096/002113043725.jpg (http://img59.imageshack.us/i/002113043725.jpg/)

frenchmon

[Ajani]

Ajani...this guy had some custom wood work done to replace the aluminum ones on his gear...what do you think? I think it looks good.

http://img718.imageshack.us/img718/9969/0162879467.jpg (http://img718.imageshack.us/i/0162879467.jpg/)

http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/5096/002113043725.jpg (http://img59.imageshack.us/i/002113043725.jpg/)

frenchmon

Definitely not something I'd do, but it does match his equipment rack....

Seems strange to save money by buying Emotiva and then going all out on Racks and custom wood trim... but to each his own, I suppose...

[TheHills44060]

wow that's the single worst allocation of audio funds i have ever seen period.

[audio101]

How's that saying go ? oh yea " now that's putting the cart before the horse" all jokes aside it looks nice!

[frenchmon]

You got a point there Ajani....I never gave that a thought. But you make perfect sense. Why go budget on gear only to spend good money on accessories like that? That rack cost a lots of money...more or about even with his gear combined. He even has expensive speakers the Usher Be-719's that cost $2700 a pair. It does not make sense to me. Buying the budget gear but going all out on speakers....I think he has expensive cables as well. I might just stir the pot and ask the guy why go budget on gear but go flat out on everything else.

frenchmon

[Ajani]

You got a point there Ajani....I never gave that a thought. But you make perfect sense. Why go budget on gear only to spend good money on accessories like that? That rack cost a lots of money...more or about even with his gear combined. He even has expensive speakers the Usher Be-719's that cost $2700 a pair. It does not make sense to me. Buying the budget gear but going all out on speakers....I think he has expensive cables as well. I might just stir the pot and ask the guy why go budget on gear but go flat out on everything else.

frenchmon

The expensive speakers I can at least understand to some extent, as a lot of persons seem to be combining Emotiva/Odyssey Audio/Van Alstine/etc gear with expensive speakers and getting good results... But to spend that kind of money on accessories, IMO, just kills the advantage of saving money on the Electronics....

[poppachubby]

Have you guys seen the new racks/tables that Grant Fidelity have? They are made by Nobility. They use magnets to "float" the shelves. They call it magnetic levitation. Pretty cool. They were trying to get a group order together at AK.

http://grantfidelity.com/site/files/WMP-1A%20MKII%20front.jpg

[Mr Peabody]

But if he was spending the money any way on accessories why not save a bit on gear? Maybe he thinks highly of the Emo performance.

I wonder if the unit on the floating shelf is totally shielded from the magnetic effect. You may eliminate one bad effect to interject another one, maybe a worse one. But it would have a cool factor for sure.

[Ajani]

But if he was spending the money any way on accessories why not save a bit on gear? Maybe he thinks highly of the Emo performance.

But why would someone have decided on accessories before selecting gear?


I wonder if the unit on the floating shelf is totally shielded from the magnetic effect. You may eliminate one bad effect to interject another one, maybe a worse one. But it would have a cool factor for sure.

I wondered the same thing myself...

[blackraven]

I can understand people spending hundreds or thousands of dollars in stereo cabinets or tv cabinets and less on the equipment. To some people, design and and appearance is just as improtant if not more than the sound. That guy is probably very happy with the sound of his emotiva system. A few months ago, we spent $1700 on a solid cherry wood tv stand and cabinet for our 52" LCD TV from Room and Board. The TV cost us $2k on sale. My wife wanted the cabinet to go with the decor.

[Ajani]

I can understand people spending hundreds or thousands of dollars in stereo cabinets or tv cabinets and less on the equipment. To some people, design and and appearance is just as improtant if not more than the sound. That guy is probably very happy with the sound of his emotiva system. A few months ago, we spent $1700 on a solid cherry wood tv stand and cabinet for our 52" LCD TV from Room and Board. The TV cost us $2k on sale. My wife wanted the cabinet to go with the decor.

I think you're probably right about that... It's quite possible that he bought the stand because it looks awesome and matched his decor.... I totally forgot that stands are often as much (or more) about decor as they are about actually supporting the equipment...

[nightflier]

Maybe it's an Emotiva promo photo?

[Ajani]

So I was in Kingston for the weekend and picked up my old Technics 3 way floorstanders... I have them hooked up now and am currently listening to a 'Hip Hop Mix"....

I was not aware that these speakers were capable of sounding this good... So the Emotiva amp is 2 out of 2 for making lowfi speakers sound good....

Now don't get me wrong, the Technics were excellent value for money considering their sub $200 price back in the late 90s, but with the Emotiva, the performance is taken to a whole other level... everything from Bass to Treble is now well controlled... Detail levels are quite respectable... I'm even noticing a bit of HiFi BS like imaging and soundstage (just a little - but considering I've never heard any of that with the Technics previously, it is quite an accomplishment)....

This combo is tempting me to spend longer saving and get some Performa F32s (or whatever their replacement is) instead of the Concerta F12s....

[blackraven]

Go for the F32's and don't look back! You will be kicking yourself in the ass if you don't. I had an opportunity to buy the Magnepan 3.6's and didn't and now my ass is sore.

[eisforelectronic]

I am very curious how the Emotiva sounds with decent speakers because I happen to be looking to add some amplification to my system. I'm reasonably sure I'll be able to pick up a used BAT amp from a friend possibly next year, but I want something to hold me over. How does Emotiva compare to Nuforce?

[Ajani]

Go for the F32's and don't look back! You will be kicking yourself in the ass if you don't. I had an opportunity to buy the Magnepan 3.6's and didn't and now my ass is sore.

:mad5: So not what my wallet wants to hear....

I'll see how long my patience can last; hopefully untill I can get the F32s....

But in the meantime, damn, these old Technics sound sweet with the DAC1/XPA-2 Combo...