best headphones

[patrick201009]

Hi everyone,
I consider myself to be an audio enthusiast. I do some sound engineering from time to time and love to listen to music. What is the best pair of headphones for under $400. I have heard good things about Sennheiser, AKG, and Grado...

Thanks,
PC

[poppachubby]

Hi everyone,
I consider myself to be an audio enthusiast. I do some sound engineering from time to time and love to listen to music. What is the best pair of headphones for under $400. I have heard good things about Sennheiser, AKG, and Grado...

Thanks,
PC

You work occasionaly as a sound engineer and you're asking about good headphones UNDER 400? Tell us a bit about what you have used in your work, what you have liked and disliked as a sound engineer. From this I can maybe lead you to something you will enjoy, your question is far too ambiguous, particularily from an engineer.

[Auricauricle]

I'll go one further and ask what sort of music you're working on. Some 'phones sound just great for rock-n-roll and others do well with chamber music. Like speakers, I don't there's a one size fits all category....Tho, spitteth thou, prithee...

[Mr Peabody]

My recommendation is Sennheiser HD-650, I believe they are under $400.00 if you look but if not see if the HD-600 is still around. Best sounding headphones I've yet to hear.

[patrick201009]

Like I said, I do a little sound engineering from time to time, but I'm not an expert. I mainly use Mackie equipment and EV speakers (not the best stuff, but relatively inexpensive)
Anyway, I am into rock music, not classical music. I am not looking for a pair of headphones to monitor sound at live events, really just looking for a nice sounding pair of decent headphones for listening to music...

[Mr Peabody]

You must be referring to Mackie because E-V is not cheap and it sounds very good. Because it's Pro sound it sometimes doesn't play that low but the frequencies covered are mostly great. I've also heard some folded horns that slammed some bass but the box was the size of a double door refrigerator. Their compression horns & drivers are excellent.

Sennheiser HD series are just great headphones that are as at home with Rob Zombie and Led Zepplin as they are with Mozart. They have tight bass with good detail and extended highs. The sound stage is large and open. But they are accurate, so if you are really asking for a pair of colored up cans with exaggerated bass the Senns aren't for you.

I saw a pair of $50.00 Sony's the other day that sounded impressive for the money. They were on a display and the description talked about their design to deliver extra bass. The demo was some Hip Hop song but the bass was deep and surprisingly they did it without covering up too much of the mids and highs. The ear pads look like soft leather pillows. I would have liked to have heard them on some good gear for a real evaluation. Some have been saying Sony had some good cans, I won't be so quick to dismiss next time. I'm sure the demo was to show the best of the cans but what impressed me was how deep and clean the bass was, not just a bloated boom.

[poppachubby]

I agree with Peabody, Senns are great cans. Personally, get yourself a pair of AKG K240S. They are extremely natural and detailed. You can listen for hours with no fatigue or discomfort, designed for long sessions. Bass response is accurate and balanced. They have been discontinued but you can still get a new pair on the grey market. Ebay has them for $100 plus shipping. As an engineer, you will appreciate what these cans will do for your music. Just make sure your source is up to snuff because they will reveal weakness with great ease.

[patrick201009]

what would you recommend between the AKG K240S and the Sennheiser HD600?

[poppachubby]

Tough call, they both really deliver. You could add in things like design and looks, plus hard specs to help decide. I am biased to the AKG but obviously the Senns rock too.

[Geoffcin]

You have to be careful matching the application with Sennheiser, or any other audiophile grade headphone. Most of them are 300 ohm phones, and as such will do MUCH better with a headphone amp. The little op amps in MP3 players will either not have enough gain, or be pushed to stress trying to drive them. If your looking for a good can from Senn that will work with these players then you gotta go with the 595/555 series. Or even lower down the chain a Senn HD-280 pro. If your going to be in a noisy enviroment the go with the 280 as it shuts out the world like nobody's business.

[poppachubby]

You have to be careful matching the application with Sennheiser, or any other audiophile grade headphone. Most of them are 300 ohm phones, and as such will do MUCH better with a headphone amp. The little op amps in MP3 players will either not have enough gain, or be pushed to stress trying to drive them. If your looking for a good can from Senn that will work with these players then you gotta go with the 595/555 series. Or even lower down the chain a Senn HD-280 pro. If your going to be in a noisy enviroment the go with the 280 as it shuts out the world like nobody's business.


Great point Geoffcin. Patrick, if you go with the AKG watch for the "S" in the model. AKG K240S are the "studio" version at 55ohms. Still difficult for a typical portable to drive, but I'm assuming you're looking for a pair to go with your system. AKG K240M, that's right, "M", are the monitor version and as Geoffcin said, are actually 600 ohms. These are typically used by professionals, as you know they run gear in series and such.
I own both, I have a headphone amp that I use at home and with my portable, however the 240's stay at home.

[Geoffcin]

Great point Geoffcin. Patrick, if you go with the AKG watch for the "S" in the model. AKG K240S are the "studio" version at 55ohms. Still difficult for a typical portable to drive, but I'm assuming you're looking for a pair to go with your system. AKG K240M, that's right, "M", are the monitor version and as Geoffcin said, are actually 600 ohms. These are typically used by professionals, as you know they run gear in series and such.
I own both, I have a headphone amp that I use at home and with my portable, however the 240's stay at home.


600 Ohms?....Yikes! You ain't driving that with no Ipod!

The 55 ohm studio should do fine as my 50 ohm Senn's play just fine with my Sansa view.

Also if your going to spend some big $$$, I would audition the cans for a day or more. I was almost sold on the 650's but a day with them left me feeling they were too laid back for my tastes. My 595's are much more lively, (some 'phile types would say agressive), but I like them that way! The 280's are a bit more laid back, but much preferable if your in a uncontrolled noise enviorment.

[poppachubby]

Actually yes, my pick for Sennheiser would be the HD-280. Great set. I'm surprised you are content with 50 ohms from your source Geoff. I drive everything up to and including 32 ohms with a source, after this the amp comes out. Even some 32's get the amp treatment. The pair I can't get away from right now for portable use are my AKG K-66. Particularily for rock, they never fail to impress me. I drive these with the amp for ultimate rock supremacy. Damn it, AKG -66?!?!? Headbang time y'all!!!!

[Geoffcin]

Actually yes, my pick for Sennheiser would be the HD-280. Great set. I'm surprised you are content with 50 ohms from your source Geoff. I drive everything up to and including 32 ohms with a source, after this the amp comes out. Even some 32's get the amp treatment. The pair I can't get away from right now for portable use are my AKG K-66. Particularily for rock, they never fail to impress me. I drive these with the amp for ultimate rock supremacy. Damn it, AKG -66?!?!? Headbang time y'all!!!!

It's better this way. 50ohms limits the SPL somewhat, and the 595's are capable of enormous SPL. Although I like them a lot, phones are really not my forte so I don't even have a headphone amp. I'm actually as we speak in the market for a decent DAC to run my HD-Radio source through, so I was thinking to get one that had a decent 'phone amp in it too. Any suggestions?

[poppachubby]

It's better this way. 50ohms limits the SPL somewhat, and the 595's are capable of enormous SPL. Although I like them a lot, phones are really not my forte so I don't even have a headphone amp. I'm actually as we speak in the market for a decent DAC to run my HD-Radio source through, so I was thinking to get one that had a decent 'phone amp in it too. Any suggestions?

What in/out requirements do you have for the DAC? I am not familiar at all with HD-Radio. I noticed your thread but haven't bothered to look, I'll check it out. I think I have something in mind for you, a nice little hand built unit by an exacting Canadian audio nut. He sells direct through Ebay, however, let me know what you need from the DAC...

[Geoffcin]

What in/out requirements do you have for the DAC? I am not familiar at all with HD-Radio. I noticed your thread but haven't bothered to look, I'll check it out. I think I have something in mind for you, a nice little hand built unit by an exacting Canadian audio nut. He sells direct through Ebay, however, let me know what you need from the DAC...

I need USB, Optical, and RCA inputs. I was looking at this device on Ebay;

http://cgi.ebay.com/HLLY-HIGH-END-DMK-IV-DAC-USB-Headphone-AMP-Pre-AMP_W0QQitemZ260497063313QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Aud ioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_Amplifiers?hash=item 3ca6d5bd91

It's got all I need, except I would prefer two Toslink inputs.

[poppachubby]

I need USB, Optical, and RCA inputs. I was looking at this device on Ebay;

http://cgi.ebay.com/HLLY-HIGH-END-DMK-IV-DAC-USB-Headphone-AMP-Pre-AMP_W0QQitemZ260497063313QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_Aud ioTVElectronics_HomeAudioHiFi_Amplifiers?hash=item 3ca6d5bd91

It's got all I need, except I would prefer two Toslink inputs.

Geoffcin, this is the unit I will be getting shortly. I haven't decided if I want it from grant, or to roll the dice on a Chinese re-badge. Some advice to this point would be appreciated. The price point on this thing can't be beat. Tube and op's are changeable and it can function as a full-on pre-amp with a simple adjustment.

Grant Fidelity: http://grantfidelity.com/site/Grant_Fidelity_Tube_DAC-09

E-Bay Chinese Re-Badge: http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230389974020&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT


Check this guys stuff out Geoffcin. This is that Canadian cat I was telling you about. Don't be fooled by price or appearance. These things perform. There are several different units. Throw on some vinyl, relax and browse. I've heard the Ultra Smoothie and the Thunderbolt. I thought of the Ultra Smoothie for you. My buddy swears by this stuff, I borrowed both and as a "headphone guy" was most impressed. Again, the price point is amazing. The guy who makes them is DEAD serious about his audio.

Personal Audio: http://stores.shop.ebay.ca/Personal-Audio__W0QQ_armrsZ1

"Ultra-Smoothie": http://cgi.ebay.ca/ULTRA-SMOOTHIE-S-PDIF-DAC-HEADPHONE-AMPLIFIER-AMP_W0QQitemZ280395756045QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_Def aultDomain_0?hash=item4148e3b20d

[poppachubby]

Hey Geoff, any thoughts? I know the Smoothie doesn't have all the features you want, but it's a killer headphone amp. Thought maybe it could be something different for you to consider outside of a traditional dac.

[Mr Peabody]

I know there's a big price difference between HD600's and the K-240's but the HD-600's are far more open. AKG sounds compressed in comparison. I personally feel the HD-600's are superior in overall frequency response and fidelity as well. AKG is what my HD-600's replaced. I also have a pair of 580's. I've driven the 580's with a receiver and even a tabletop HD radio with no problem. My friends I-pod seemed to do alright but my smaller mp3 players can't drive them like they can be driven.

I believe Trends has a DAC/head amp available. I believe Benchmark also has all the features you want.

[Geoffcin]

Hey Geoff, any thoughts? I know the Smoothie doesn't have all the features you want, but it's a killer headphone amp. Thought maybe it could be something different for you to consider outside of a traditional dac.

Thanks for the suggestions. None, but the one your getting has what I need so right now I'm keeping my options open. Right now I really only use my phones with the laptop and MP3 player and it works fine with both.

[poppachubby]

Thanks for the suggestions. None, but the one your getting has what I need so right now I'm keeping my options open. Right now I really only use my phones with the laptop and MP3 player and it works fine with both.

Try the thunderbolt, you'll wonder how "fine" was ever good enough.

[winston]

[QUOTE=Mr Peabody]I know there's a big price difference between HD600's and the K-240's but the HD-600's are far more open. AKG sounds compressed in comparison. I personally feel the HD-600's are superior in overall frequency response and fidelity as well. AKG is what my HD-600's replaced. I also have a pair of 580's. I've driven the 580's with a receiver and even a tabletop HD radio with no problem. My friends I-pod seemed to do alright but my smaller mp3 players can't drive them like they can be driven.


Patrick" save yourself the headache and frustration and give the HD-600 line a try out.
to be honest" I am not the guy who like to recommend expensive AUDIO GEAR but from my experiences of trying to find THE BEST set of CAN'S FOR ME!! I have come to the conclusion that headphones are different animals"(so in short) let me say this..
my impressions are done with the HD-650 and i have to thank Mr. Peabody" for that.:0: also I now owned a set of the HD-600 the way i got these is a real Blessing.

[patrick201009]

Thanks for the insight everyone...
I guess I eliminated AKG from my choices, but how about within the Sennheiser HD series lineup. I do not have a headphone amp and will mostly be playing music from an iPod or a computer. Does it still make sense to go for the 600s even without a headphone amp?

[poppachubby]

Patrick" save yourself the headache and frustration and give the HD-600 line a try out.

C'mon winston, I know you want to bring Patrick around to your suggestions, but do you think this might be a bit of overkill?

"Headache and frustration" would be the last problems with a pair of AKG. Do you really feel that strongly against it? If anything, it could be a nice segway to something more high end. A means to appreciate and develop tastes.

Anyhow, no sour grapes here. Patrick, Sennheiser have alot of great sets. You should firstly figure out which models fit your budget. Then, of those, which have specs that will fit the bill for your Ipod. With no amp, 32 ohms or less would be ideal. Keep in mind circum vs supra aural and comfort in general. I would most certainly suggest an amp, you won't get the full benefit of a full size set without one.

Keep us posted.

[Mr Peabody]

C'mon winston, I know you want to bring Patrick around to your suggestions, but do you think this might be a bit of overkill?

* I do. Did he say before this he would be using an Ipod/computer and I missed it?

"Headache and frustration" would be the last problems with a pair of AKG. Do you really feel that strongly against it? If anything, it could be a nice segway to something more high end. A means to appreciate and develop tastes.

* My AKG would be even more difficult to drive than my HD-600's. You've used them more recent than I, would even AKG be a good suggestion?

Anyhow, no sour grapes here. Patrick, Sennheiser have alot of great sets. You should firstly figure out which models fit your budget. Then, of those, which have specs that will fit the bill for your Ipod. With no amp, 32 ohms or less would be ideal. Keep in mind circum vs supra aural and comfort in general. I would most certainly suggest an amp, you won't get the full benefit of a full size set without one.

Keep us posted.

for modest use like with Ipod or computer I'd seriously look at the Sony for over the ear and maybe something from Shure for earbud style. I have portable Sennheiser but for $50.00 to $60.00 I think better can be found. I actually have some AKG earbuds I use with my mp3 player. They are pretty good. They have a big bass sound which probably appeal to most. I typically prefer a flatter response. I believe Shure is generally the pick for high quality earbud though.

I'm surprised no Grado fan boys have arrived yet. I'm not a fan of the Grado sound but they are popular and I'd be remiss in not mentioning the SR-60's, I think a new model SR-60i is out now, which are over the ear and run about $70.00. Many feel these are a very good value for the money.

I obviously am a Sennheiser fan but I wouldn't spend $400.00 to listen to an Ipod or computer. Although some of those Shure get up there.

[poppachubby]

for modest use like with Ipod or computer I'd seriously look at the Sony for over the ear and maybe something from Shure for earbud style. I have portable Sennheiser but for $50.00 to $60.00 I think better can be found. I actually have some AKG earbuds I use with my mp3 player. They are pretty good. They have a big bass sound which probably appeal to most. I typically prefer a flatter response. I believe Shure is generally the pick for high quality earbud though.

I'm surprised no Grado fan boys have arrived yet. I'm not a fan of the Grado sound but they are popular and I'd be remiss in not mentioning the SR-60's, I think a new model SR-60i is out now, which are over the ear and run about $70.00. Many feel these are a very good value for the money.

I obviously am a Sennheiser fan but I wouldn't spend $400.00 to listen to an Ipod or computer. Although some of those Shure get up there.

Well Peabody, why does it appear that winstons replies to me are in your post?

Either way, winston, when I said overkill I wasn't referring to your suggestion. I was referring to the whole "headache and frustration" bit. Just seemed a little much for the purpose of making your point.

[Geoffcin]

Thanks for the insight everyone...
I guess I eliminated AKG from my choices, but how about within the Sennheiser HD series lineup. I do not have a headphone amp and will mostly be playing music from an iPod or a computer. Does it still make sense to go for the 600s even without a headphone amp?

I would say no. The Senn 600 or 650's 300 ohms is just too much for an ipod or computer. You might be able to use it with a receiver, but unless you get a headphone amp I would forget about using it with anything else. This was one of the reasons I chose the 595. It is a 50ohm set and works well with any MP3 player and especially well with my laptop.

[Mr Peabody]

Well, Chubbs, if you look back through the post I was the first to suggest HD-600's and I didn't realize even though you addressed Winston directly you intended to make it a personal issue between the two of you. For some one who said no sour grapes you sure do have your panties in a bunch. To be quite honest I wonder if you've actually heard HD-600's as the difference between them and K-240's are vast.

[Geoffcin]

Hey guys, keep it on topic OK?

[poppachubby]

Well, Chubbs, if you look back through the post I was the first to suggest HD-600's and I didn't realize even though you addressed Winston directly you intended to make it a personal issue between the two of you. For some one who said no sour grapes you sure do have your panties in a bunch. To be quite honest I wonder if you've actually heard HD-600's as the difference between them and K-240's are vast.

Personal? No.

No sour grapes, as in, I think Senns are great.

I just think using terms like "headache" and "frustration" when addressing a guy with no idea is a little excessive. AKG is not exactly on a Wal-Mart shelf. That's all. Not looking for a fight or argument. Actually, I thought your last post was a great example of "objectiveness" if you must know. Lot's of different options.

Unbunching panties, topic dropped Geoff.

[patrick201009]

I want to stay away from earbuds in general (I have the $99 Bose model), and as for Grado's I own a pair of SR-60's now. The design is cheap, and I am not that impressed with sound quality.

[Mr Peabody]

Patrick, sounds like we may be on the same page. I'm not familiar with the 595's but if they are easier to drive they might be the way to go. You can look here and some of the retail sites for user reviews.

[winston]

Poppachubby@quote" C'mon winston, I know you want to bring Patrick around to your suggestions, but do you think this might be a bit of overkill.

No Pop!! not really...Patrick indicates he has <> $400 to spend and if he shops HARD he maybe able to walk off with HD-600 for about $320 or less no tax no shipping

I'll admit that I've become a Fan Boy of the 600 & 650...but there's a lot of misconceptions about the 600 series Sennheiser's, it all depends on who you talk with and who's reviews you like best. 90% of the Reviewers gives you that Frantic LINE...you need LOTS OF POWWAAAAA and that's so not true!! that been said... The 600 series has the ability & Capacity to react to any good Amplifier that you used to drive Drive them will result in some of these Audiophile Words

Airy,Ambiance,analytical,articulate,attack

[Geoffcin]

Poppahubby@quote" C'mon winston, I know you want to bring Patrick around to your suggestions, but do you think this might be a bit of overkill.

No Pop!! not really...Patrick indicates he has <> $400 to spend and if he shops HARD he maybe able to walk off with HD-600 for about $320 or less no tax no shipping

I'll admit that I've become a Fan Boy of the 600 & 650...but there's a lot of misconceptions about the 600 series Sennheiser's, it all depends on who you talk with and who's reviews you like best. 90% of the Reviewers gives you that Frantic LINE...you need LOTS OF POWWAAAAA and that's so not true!! that been said... The 600 series has the ability & Capacity to react to any good Amplifier that you used to drive Drive them will result in some of these Audiophile Words

Airy,Ambiance,analytical,articulate,attack

Perhaps I'm not understanding what your saying. Are you saying the 600/650 doesn't need a headphone amp? Because if you've read the OP remarks he said he wants to use the cans specifically with his MP3 player and laptop. I don't think there's any misconception if you think that doing that is NOT going to give you what the headphones are capable of. The UN-DENIABLE truth is that 300 ohm or greater headphones need a real amp to sound correct. At minimum a receiver or integrated amp, but best with a dedicated headphone amp.

[Mr Peabody]

http://www.stereophile.com/headphones/408/

[winston]

Hi everyone,
I consider myself to be an audio enthusiast. I do some sound engineering from time to time and love to listen to music. What is the best pair of headphones for under $400. I have heard good things about Sennheiser, AKG, and Grado...

Thanks,
PC
Geoffcin" above is Patrick201009" first Post....that's is the part of the Thread I replied to in my first post" laptop & MP3 were mentioned later.

In my second post i reply to (Poppachubby)

[poppachubby]

winston, it's cool man. Obviously the 600 is a fine set, and yes, I certainly have heard it. I'm not for one second denying you anything regarding the 600, even though power IS an issue in my opinion. It's all good.

I just thought you were over reaching to make your point about the AKG. The 240 and HD 600 are not in the same class, no. I just think that it would be reasonable to think that both could provide our man Patrick with listening pleasure. I have owned many sets and can't imagine where I would be if at the beginning, I didn't try a variety.

You're right though, his needs did an about face half way through the thread. I hope you weren't sensing hostility from my posts, was never intended that way winston.

[poppachubby]

http://www.stereophile.com/headphones/408/

Nice link Peabody, great review. Stereophile never miss...

[patrick201009]

I think I am finally understanding this. Basically, in order to get the full sound out the HD-595 or 600, I need to have a headphone amp. Staying within the $350-$400 budget, could I get a good pair of headphones and a headphone amp?
I appreciate all of your help guys...

[poppachubby]

I think I am finally understanding this. Basically, in order to get the full sound out the HD-595 or 600, I need to have a headphone amp. Staying within the $350-$400 budget, could I get a good pair of headphones and a headphone amp?
I appreciate all of your help guys...

Patrick, sorry about the drama. Back to biz, yes. Firstly, if you're willing to go used you can hit your price point no problem with the 600/650 and an amp. Keep in mind, alot of manufacturers won't honour waranties if you haven't bought from a dealer.

[Geoffcin]

I think I am finally understanding this. Basically, in order to get the full sound out the HD-595 or 600, I need to have a headphone amp. Staying within the $350-$400 budget, could I get a good pair of headphones and a headphone amp?
I appreciate all of your help guys...

Close Patrick, if you get the 600/650 you will need an amp. The 595 does not need one.

[poppachubby]

Patrick, I just want to add something. About the K240S, no they are not as sonically great as the HD 600 series. However, what they are is fun. What's this you ask? Fun, what the hell is he talking about.

I have tried a ton of headphones. It's the only area of audio I'm super confident in. I had to do alot of listening to learn what "fun" in a headphone meant. Basically Patrick, it has everything to do with how the 'phones present the music to your ears.

Rather than blab a bunch of tech talk I will leave you with this. The HD 600 series is equivelant to attending an orchestra performance. You will be getting top notch musicianship from the best "musicians". The K240S is more like attending a rock show, they aren't the best musicians necessarily, but will entertain you to no end.

Properly powered, the K240S will rock you!! Just my take on it bro...

[winston]

Poppachubby@quote
(I hope you weren't sensing hostility from my posts, was never intended that way winston.).....HOSTILITY!!! no way man" POP". It's all good.....................................

For the record AKG's ARE ALSO EXCELLENT HEADPHONES.

MORE POWER TO Y'ALL!!! Mr P', POP', Geoffcin', and i hope Patrick201009 get some help from this thread.

[poppachubby]

Poppachubby@quote
(I hope you weren't sensing hostility from my posts, was never intended that way winston.).....HOSTILITY!!! no way man" POP". It's all good.....................................

For the record AKG's ARE ALSO EXCELLENT HEADPHONES.

MORE POWER TO Y'ALL!!! Mr P', POP', Geoffcin', and i hope Patrick201009 get some help from this thread.

Hahaha, right on!

[patrick201009]

Thanks guys,
I will either go with the Sennheiser 595's or the AKG 240's.
But will a headphone amp make both of these cans sound a lot better?

[Geoffcin]

If you have a receiver, integrated amp, or preamp with a 1/4" phones output then you HAVE a headphone amp already!

[Geoffcin]

I would say it depends on the amp. I'm in the market now for a DAC/Headphone amp combo. I would guarantee you that the output of even a modest unit would smoke the phone output of my table top HD Radio. I'm not so sure it would do the same against my computer rig with it's dedicated sound card. However I'm sure it could output more current, which is what you would need to drive a >300ohm phone.

[patrick201009]

poppachubby- will i need a headphone amp if I got the AKG K240 And what's the difference between the monitor version, and studio version?

[Mr Peabody]

The amp most recommended for the HD-600 is the Musical Fidelity X-can. I have an older version that ran just under $400.00 new. Personally for that money I think it's over rated but if you can find one used it does sound pretty good. I haven't used much else in a dediccated head amp. My second choice would have been the Creek in a reasonably priced area. I also would have liked to hear an Antique Sound Lab (ASL) to see if more of a tube presence could be had. This is an area that's grown. You might even be able to find a used preamp from the likes of Adcom for under $200.00 that could run your headphones and offer some additional options or even a good vintage receiver. Down side those options would be for those with plenty of space to spare.

[patrick201009]

I hate to say it, but I think I may go with the HD595's simply because I don't really have the money for a headphone amp. Also, I hear that this a good pair of cans for a new audiophile. I have heard some people say that you have to let the headphones be broken in, is this true?

[Mr Peabody]

If brand new out of the box it's absolutely true for Sennheiser. Every pair I've owned has sounded better with about 24 hours of play. I usually put them on just to hear them then hook them up to something and just let them play a day or so. You'll notice right out of the box the highs won't sound right and the bass will be very tight but after some hours of play you will hear them coming into their own.

[poppachubby]

Patrick, check out this site to learn about burn in. Also, download the generator, it's the same one I use.

http://www.burninwave.com/


As far as an amp goes, the bottom line is this. Any set that's over 32 ohms can stand to benefit from an amp. Up to around 55 ohms you don't always NEED one. Depends on the source. Home equipment should be fine, but I still plug mine in occasionally. If you're serious about headphones, you should at least look at getting one in the near future.

The AKG's will sound 10 times better when powered correctly. The Senn's are a nice choice too man. Either way, you win.

[poppachubby]

I would say it depends on the amp. I'm in the market now for a DAC/Headphone amp combo. I would guarantee you that the output of even a modest unit would smoke the phone output of my table top HD Radio. I'm not so sure it would do the same against my computer rig with it's dedicated sound card. However I'm sure it could output more current, which is what you would need to drive a >300ohm phone.

Funny thing Geoff, I love my soundcard to bits but it's headphone output is its weakest link by far. Wouldn't even consider it without an amp.

"Love it to bits" hahaha I just got that, man I'm a funny guy...

[Mr Peabody]

OK, I will admit I've never paid attention to impedance of headphones before. So help me out here, is it the lower the impedance the easier they are to drive? HD-600's are 300 ohm, so at what point would a headphone be considered sensitive or a easy load?

[Mr Peabody]

I just checked the specs on my Sennheiser PX-100 and they are 32 ohm so I guess there is a pretty wide gap there between portable use and home use. Sensitivity is 114dB compared to the 600's, well I found 97dB and 102dB not sure which is accurate.

[poppachubby]

OK, I will admit I've never paid attention to impedance of headphones before. So help me out here, is it the lower the impedance the easier they are to drive? HD-600's are 300 ohm, so at what point would a headphone be considered sensitive or a easy load?


Wow! Sorry Peabody, I just figured a gent of your stature on here would have known this.

I have to admit, secretly, deep down inside, it brings me joy to know that this is probably the only thing I will ever have known about audio before you. Petty? Yep!! LOL.

As I already wrote, 32 ohms is about the cut-off point for most portable devices. That doesn't mean that an amp won't benefit a 32 ohm set. The other consideration is that most portables will have to work extremely hard to power a 32ohm set, decreasing battery life noticably fast.

I use my amp for my AKG K-66, 32 ohm and it brings out the best in them, while extending my battery life by almost double.

And yes, the lower the ohmage, the easier they are to drive. In an earlier post, I was warning Patrick against the K240M as they are 600 ohms, very difficult to power in a domestic scenario. Even some amps will have trouble with these as most amps have a top out of around 300.

I would say that 24 ohms or lower would be considered easy to drive.

[Mr Peabody]

Thanks. I wonder why AKG would make a set 600 ohm.

I was using headphones since back in the day when my mom used to yell, "turn that **** down!" "How can you listen to that noise?" I just never paid any attention to the specs, nor did it come up in an involved conversation before. As you say though I should know and that's why I asked. It's such a burden being expected to know everything :)

[Geoffcin]

Funny thing Geoff, I love my soundcard to bits but it's headphone output is its weakest link by far. Wouldn't even consider it without an amp.

"Love it to bits" hahaha I just got that, man I'm a funny guy...

I think it all has to do with what the output was designed for. My laptop was designed for dual headphone output, so perhaps the "headroom" [pun] afforded by this allows it to better drive the one can? In any case I absolutely agree that a headphone amp is the best way to power a headphone.

[poppachubby]

I wonder why AKG would make a set 600 ohm.



For studio applications. Professional use basically.

[patrick201009]

I am not interested in Bose headphones, but what do you audiophiles have to say about Bose headphones in general? Just curious...

[Mr Peabody]

I've been curious to hear a pair. If they sound like their speakers I wouldn't care for them. Especially, at the price Bose are at. For what it's worth a friend of mine heard several Bose at the Bose store in the mall and he feels the HD-600 are far superior. It's not exactly apple to apples though because the Bose were probably on some display with who knows what for a source where my HD-600's were hooked into my X-can and a very good CD player. I personally seriously doubt the Bose would come close to the clarity and fidelity of a comparatively priced Sennheiser. What has me curious is Bose has traditionally used small drivers and could potentially make a decent headphone. Who ever designs their speakers though seems to like a warm diffuse sound that lacks high and low extremity response. If this is the tactic used on the headphones they would leave me with a lot to be desired.

[poppachubby]

I am not interested in Bose headphones, but what do you audiophiles have to say about Bose headphones in general? Just curious...

Overpriced, if you could somehow get a set for really cheap they are average at best. Really crumby build quality. Not particularily the greatest sounding either, I found the bass of the Triport bloated and un-natural. Overall lacking warmth or depth.

These things are really hyped up, not quite sure how Bose does it. My hat's off to them though, they have alot of people believing that they are the saviours of audio. Good marketing for sure.