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Smokey
09-12-2009, 07:56 PM
Looks like Sony joined the rank of Toshiba, outsourcing its LCD TV from a Taiwan company. Wonder if Sony still can remain a top dog [in picture quality] after the sale, or like Toshiba be ranked somewhere in the middle.

TOKYO-Due to losing over a billion dollars last fiscal year, and forecasting an even worse ($1.3 billion) loss for the fiscal year through March 2010, Sony has agreed to sell its main television factory in North America to a Taiwanese company as it struggles to cut costs.

Sony said it would sell 90 percent of its stake in Sony Baja California, which is located in Tijuana, Mexico, to Hon Hai Precision Industry. The company said in a news release that the move is part of continuing efforts to cut costs by outsourcing manufacturing. The deal is expected to be finalized by March.

Sony makes most of the LCD TVs it sells in North America at the plant, and will continue to do so on an outsourcing basis after the sale.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090901/ap_on_bi_ge/as_japan_sony;_ylt=A0LEapbgzJxKWA8A6jWs0NUE;_ylu=X 3oDMTFmZ3M3bmswBHBvcwMxMDUEc2VjA2FjY29yZGlvbl9idXN pbmVzcwRzbGsDc29ueXRvc2VsbGFt

Sir Terrence the Terrible
09-13-2009, 09:39 AM
Thank goodness they are still going to manufacture their own pro line of XBR televisions. As long as Sony continues to spend money on R&D to drive the performance of LCD's upward, they will be okay. Toshiba spent far too much money on HD-DVD, and not enough on LCD R&D and now they are suffering for it.

Ed_in_Tx
09-13-2009, 01:45 PM
From this news article, looks like Sony will still have a future at my house. No mention of outsourcing the manufacturing.

http://www.twice.com/article/340356-Sony_Debuts_Video_Line_At_CEDIA.php

Smokey
09-13-2009, 07:26 PM
As long as Sony continues to spend money on R&D to drive the performance of LCD's upward, they will be okay.

But wouldn't quality of their product go down a bit if outsourcing firm use cheapers parts and methods to build Sony TVs?


No mention of outsourcing the manufacturing.

Why advertise. This is a case of..."You don't know! And you don't want to know" :D

Mr Peabody
09-14-2009, 06:07 AM
The factory is still in the same location, I have to wonder what the Taiwanese would do differently than Sony to save money?

atomicAdam
09-14-2009, 07:10 AM
i thought the whole point of outsourcing was to save on labor cost, not reduce product quality. The reduction of quality comes as the contracting company tries to make more money for itself in a limited budget. This problem happens when the outsourcing company just figure everything will be 'ok' and walks away. Outsourcing out to Taiwan, which isn't China mind you, doesn't equate to lower quality. It would behoove Sony, or any other company, to keep a close eye on production and materials and not just sit complacently as the job gets processed.

Sir Terrence the Terrible
09-14-2009, 08:02 AM
But wouldn't quality of their product go down a bit if outsourcing firm use cheapers parts and methods to build Sony TVs?


Sony has already learned their lesson about outsourcing and not paying attention to QC. When they first started outsourcing their recievers manufacture to China, the recievers had quality control issues up the ying yang. Amp channels not working, overheating, chips burning up, you name it, they had problems with it. They sent their engineers to China and got things under control when sales started to tank because of these issues. You can bet you best pair of shoes they will not let this happen again.

From what I understand the new firm will have to use parts chosen by Sony, they cannot cut corners here. The design and specifications will be done by Sony.

kexodusc
09-14-2009, 09:20 AM
i thought the whole point of outsourcing was to save on labor cost, not reduce product quality. The reduction of quality comes as the contracting company tries to make more money for itself in a limited budget. This problem happens when the outsourcing company just figure everything will be 'ok' and walks away. Outsourcing out to Taiwan, which isn't China mind you, doesn't equate to lower quality. It would behoove Sony, or any other company, to keep a close eye on production and materials and not just sit complacently as the job gets processed.

Hard to say what's going on here. I think the "cut cost" statement might be over simplifying things. A lot of outsourcing takes place with no labor/production cost cutting in mind, but instead with the goal of refinancing operations (which if done right can reduce finance cost). I think that might be what's going on here.

If Sony's sets are still coming from the same plant, then it's likely that quality and cost aren't going to deviate materially in the short term (and not necessarily long-term either), but the money they free up by selling their stake might be used to pay down higher cost debt, or invest in a higher margin factory or opportunity elsewhere. It could just be a question of effectively allocating resources. If the unit costs and margins on LCD's are unaffected by the sale (they should be unaffected, especially with Sony retaining 10% of its stake), then liquidating the plant and using that money to do something else at the same time could lead to cost savings elsewhere. That's my guess.

pixelthis
09-14-2009, 12:52 PM
Whats "going on here" is that people and companies are starting to flee California,
and who can blame them?
Toyota is also closing their plant in CALIFORNIA, as that state continues to melt down.
AS FOR QUALITY, some can build in Taiwan(Sanjean, etc) and some can't(Toshiba).
Be interesting to see what happens.
Meanwhile, will the last persont out of Cali turn out the light?:1:

Sir Terrence the Terrible
09-14-2009, 03:11 PM
Whats "going on here" is that people and companies are starting to flee California,
and who can blame them?

I can see you are still taking stupid pills. This factory is not in California, it is in Mexico ding bat.



Toyota is also closing their plant in CALIFORNIA, as that state continues to melt down.

The plant was called NUMI, and it is a joint venture with GM. California's budget woes have not one damn thing to do with that closing. It was the fact that GM walked away from the venture, and overall ALL car companies are selling fewer cars which means fewer manufacturing plants.


AS FOR QUALITY, some can build in Taiwan(Sanjean, etc) and some can't(Toshiba).
Be interesting to see what happens.
Meanwhile, will the last persont out of Cali turn out the light?:1:

California is no worse off than Michigan and 43 other states. If we took your lame advice, America would be a pretty empty place.

Mr Peabody
09-14-2009, 03:38 PM
Interesting combination LCD's and cars.

pixelthis
09-15-2009, 01:53 PM
Interesting combination LCD's and cars.

And BOTH are getting the heck outta California.
Toyota "partnered" with GM but it was still their plant.
CALIFORNIANS, blind to reality to the end, refuse to admit that their state is sinking into the ocean, financially if not physically, another socialistic experiment down the tubes.
Which just goes to show, with the DEMOCRAT "HEALTH PLAN", that they will never
learn.:1:

atomicAdam
09-15-2009, 02:19 PM
And BOTH are getting the heck outta California.
Toyota "partnered" with GM but it was still their plant.
CALIFORNIANS, blind to reality to the end, refuse to admit that their state is sinking into the ocean, financially if not physically, another socialistic experiment down the tubes.
Which just goes to show, with the DEMOCRAT "HEALTH PLAN", that they will never
learn.:1:


WOW - Just WOW

California is not failing because of socialism. California is failing because our constitution has, and voter initiatives have, created a system of dispersed power. A pluralism of rulers so to speak. Each one has limited power, none with enough power to effect real change. Each camp works to further it's own causes, never dealing with the state, and remember, it is a large and diverse state, as a whole. Not to mention the super majority issues that are written into the constitution. The voter initiatives have further tied down the hands of change in California. First crippling our tax base then with mandatory school funding.

Further you should remember that California is a canary in the coal mine of America's ass. What happens here will and does happen for the country as a whole.

Btw - I hope when you grow old you refuse your medicare and social security on principles.

Woochifer
09-18-2009, 10:53 AM
This plant in Mexico is merely the point of final assembly. The LCD panels themselves are made thru their joint venture with Samsung, and most of the other high value components are also made elsewhere.

Sounds more like Sony absolving themselves from having to manage the supply chain in order to focus more on the R&D and marketing than it does outsourcing. Companies do this all the time -- turn the management of a facility completely over to an outside service provider. T's example of Sony shifting their receiver production over to China is a better example, since that involved wholesale product redesign and shifting production over to an entirely different plant. Product quality would be affected only if this changeover brings about big changes to the product and the production.

pixelthis
09-18-2009, 02:04 PM
WOW - Just WOW

California is not failing because of socialism. California is failing because our constitution has, and voter initiatives have, created a system of dispersed power. A pluralism of rulers so to speak. Each one has limited power, none with enough power to effect real change. Each camp works to further it's own causes, never dealing with the state, and remember, it is a large and diverse state, as a whole. Not to mention the super majority issues that are written into the constitution. The voter initiatives have further tied down the hands of change in California. First crippling our tax base then with mandatory school funding.

Further you should remember that California is a canary in the coal mine of America's ass. What happens here will and does happen for the country as a whole.

Btw - I hope when you grow old you refuse your medicare and social security on principles.

Thats funny.
I am forced to pay over 60,000 into social insecurity, against my will, and if I TRY TO GET ANY OF IT BACK I am "unprincipled".
AND when I lost my job a few months back I could have went on medicare, instead I pay 102 a month on corbra.
The voter initiatives were intended to stem the runaway spending that the socialists
running the state were involved in, the socialists havent budged in spite of the state going broke.
And yes a lot of other states are in trouble, so are cities, counties, etc.
And eventually the entire country, Cali is just the first off the cliff.
Which will not make them any less destitute.:1:

Woochifer
09-18-2009, 03:16 PM
The voter initiatives were intended to stem the runaway spending that the socialists
running the state were involved in, the socialists havent budged in spite of the state going broke.

Oh please. Stick to talking about Bama football or whatever. You obviously don't know much about Cali's convoluted initiative process, which has basically been taken over by corporate-funded astroturf groups, or how the state budget is done.

It only takes a simple majority vote on a ballot initiative to handcuff the state budget with a laundry list of set-asides and mandatory funding requirements, yet it takes a 2/3 vote to actually pay for anything. The legislature has limited leeway to make spending cuts because so much of the budget is tied to mandates imposed by ballot initiatives. These schizophrenic 2/3 majority rules were imposed by Prop 13, which itself didn't pass by a 2/3 majority.

bobsticks
09-18-2009, 04:09 PM
I think it's great that Sony is divesting itself of profit-leaching subdivisions...say what you will, it's hard to argue against them having always been leaders in R & D...assuming they maintain a stranglehold on quality control erething should be a-okay...

Mr Peabody
09-18-2009, 04:54 PM
Hey! It's the long lost Wooch :)

Cali is in definite trouble, if the terminator hasn't set things straight yet, there's no hope :)

pixelthis
09-20-2009, 01:08 AM
Oh please. Stick to talking about Bama football or whatever. You obviously don't know much about Cali's convoluted initiative process, which has basically been taken over by corporate-funded astroturf groups, or how the state budget is done.

It only takes a simple majority vote on a ballot initiative to handcuff the state budget with a laundry list of set-asides and mandatory funding requirements, yet it takes a 2/3 vote to actually pay for anything. The legislature has limited leeway to make spending cuts because so much of the budget is tied to mandates imposed by ballot initiatives. These schizophrenic 2/3 majority rules were imposed by Prop 13, which itself didn't pass by a 2/3 majority.


So spending needs to be cut, which the state refuses to do, because they would have to cut their precious programs, which was the original imtent of prop 13.
This is what happens when you try to fix something with a legislature instead of the more proven method of civil war.:1:

pixelthis
09-20-2009, 01:15 AM
I think it's great that Sony is divesting itself of profit-leaching subdivisions...say what you will, it's hard to argue against them having always been leaders in R & D...assuming they maintain a stranglehold on quality control erething should be a-okay...

QC costs mucho deniro.
Companies always say they strive for quality, but in reality its always how much quality they can afford while meeting their price point.
Sony is trying to meet a lower price point that the market demands while keeping quality
at a decent level.
Remains to be seen if they can do it.
The Japanese are in real trouble, their airlines is broke, and their largest consumer
lender is also, and their automotive sector has lost billions, like everybody else.
Sony lost billions in their last fiscal year, this is just a symptom.
The bigger question is, since most already have a TV and 10 to 15 % are outta work,
just who is going to be buying new sets?
AND when you can get a 42" for under 700 bucks, whos' going to pay over a grand just for a "Sony"?
And its only going to get worse.:1:

atomicAdam
09-20-2009, 05:19 PM
This is what happens when you try to fix something with a legislature instead of the more proven method of civil war.:1:


Seriously, you seriously prefer civil war than the legislative way, or are you just trying to be shockingly inflammatory?

poppachubby
09-20-2009, 05:41 PM
This thread is retarded, I thought it was about television production. www.politicalreview.com

02audionoob
09-20-2009, 06:01 PM
This thread is retarded, I thought it was about television production. www.politicalreview.com (http://www.politicalreview.com)

Somehow it went from a plant in Baja California (Mexico) to an argument about California (USA). It reminds me of Emily Litella on Saturday Night Live.

atomicAdam
09-20-2009, 07:48 PM
Well I didn't mean to help pix derail the thread... but it was hard to resist correcting.

But in a way, the topic of out sourcing is as much political as it is anything else. But I concede, in this case, the political reasons as to why California is SOL is a rather gross tangent of Sony out sourcing TV production.

pixelthis
09-21-2009, 02:48 AM
:9:
Seriously, you seriously prefer civil war than the legislative way, or are you just trying to be shockingly inflammatory?

Just kidding.
However, having some experience in how state legislature works I know its a wonder
that anything gets done.
You can get back to Sony's desperate (and ultimately fruitless) efforts to save their corporate butt, but I am just saying, with the wackness level of the average Californian
its no surprize that the state govt, being representative, is as screwed up as it is,
indeed its no wonder its not more wackey than it already is.:1: