Sherbourn vs Cinema Grand vs 2+3 B&K?

[Roman-dude]

So I have a bit of a dilemma (one might even say a trilemma), where I am looking to upgrade my Carver AV-705x (125w/ch). At present I have three options - Sherbourn 5/1500A, Sunfire Cinema Grand or a set of TX4430 (3 ch) and EX4420 (2 ch) amps. They are all 200w/ch. All have great reviews with the former being cheaper, less known and not THX, and the latter two being roughly in the same price range. I have a set of 5 Sunfire CRM-2, so one consideration I've heard is that it'd be better to pair Sunfire with Sunfire, both using Bob Carver's Sonic Holography. Nonetheless, the questions remain - which one of these to get. Any input is welcome.

PS I really can't borrow either one to audition, except that the Sherbourn did sound better than my Carver.

Thx!

[Roman-dude]

I'm not getting any responses in the amp section, so I decided to try the general area. It's relevant to both..

So I have a bit of a dilemma (one might even say a trilemma), where I am looking to upgrade my Carver AV-705x (125w/ch). At present I have three options - Sherbourn 5/1500A, Sunfire Cinema Grand or a set of TX4430 (3 ch) and EX4420 (2 ch) amps. They are all 200w/ch. All have great reviews with the former being cheaper, less known and not THX, and the latter two being roughly in the same price range. I have a set of 5 Sunfire CRM-2, so one consideration I've heard is that it'd be better to pair Sunfire with Sunfire, both using Bob Carver's Sonic Holography. Nonetheless, the questions remain - which one of these to get. Any input is welcome.

PS I really can't borrow either one to audition, except that the Sherbourn did sound better than my Carver.

Thx!

[RoadRunner6]

May I suggest that you close your duplicate thread in the General Audio section so that we don't have to duplicate our efforts to give you some help.

How would you like to buy a power amp that is at least equal to and probably superior to the Sherbourn for $799? I happen to own this 74 lb brute that puts out 200 watts per channel with all channels driven simultaneously! This is from an American company that designs it own amps and has them assembled in China and sells direct to the end use. Their build quality is superb and customer service is impeccable. Check it out.

http://emotiva.com/xpa5.shtm

http://www.affordableaudio.org/EmotivaXPA-5.pdf

RR6 :biggrin5:

PS: Many also consider the XPA-2/XPA-3 combo.

http://www.audioholics.com/reviews/amplifiers/emotiva-xpa-2

http://www.hometheaterhifi.com/power-amplifiers/496-a-secrets-power-amplifier-review.html

[JoeE SP9]

I think you've already answered your question. If it were me I would buy what I thought sounded better.

PS I really can't borrow either one to audition, except that the Sherbourn did sound better than my Carver.


THX for home use means just about nothing. It's just marketing hype to get the uninformed consumers money. See below.

The THX system is not a recording technology, and it does not specify a sound recording format: all sound formats, whether digital (Dolby Digital (http://forums.audioreview.com/wiki/Dolby_Digital), SDDS (http://forums.audioreview.com/wiki/SDDS)) or analog (Dolby Stereo (http://forums.audioreview.com/wiki/Dolby_Stereo), Ultra-Stereo (http://forums.audioreview.com/wiki/Ultra-Stereo)), can be "shown in THX." THX is mainly a quality assurance (http://forums.audioreview.com/wiki/Quality_assurance)system. THX-certified theaters provide a high-quality, predictable playback environment to ensure that any film (http://forums.audioreview.com/wiki/Film) soundtrackmixed (http://forums.audioreview.com/wiki/Audio_mixing_%28recorded_music%29) in THX will sound as near as possible to the intentions of the mixing engineer. THX also provides certified theaters with a special crossover (http://forums.audioreview.com/wiki/Audio_crossover) circuit (http://forums.audioreview.com/wiki/Electronic_circuit) whose use is part of the standard. Certification of an auditorium entails specific acoustic (http://forums.audioreview.com/wiki/Acoustics) and other technical requirements; architectural requirements include a floating floor (http://forums.audioreview.com/wiki/Floating_floor), baffled (http://forums.audioreview.com/wiki/Sound_baffle) and acoustically treated (http://forums.audioreview.com/w/index.php?title=Acoustical_treatment&action=edit&redlink=1) walls, no parallel walls (to reduce standing waves (http://forums.audioreview.com/wiki/Standing_wave)), a perforated screen (to allow center channel (http://forums.audioreview.com/wiki/Center_channel) continuity (http://forums.audioreview.com/w/index.php?title=Acoustic_continuity&action=edit&redlink=1)), and NC30 rating (http://forums.audioreview.com/w/index.php?title=NC30_rating&action=edit&redlink=1) for background noise (http://forums.audioreview.com/wiki/Background_noise).

[Roman-dude]

[QUOTE=JoeE SP9]I think you've already answered your question. If it were me I would buy what I thought sounded better.

PS I really can't borrow either one to audition, except that the Sherbourn did sound better than my Carver.


Well, yeah, I know they all would sound better than the Carver, it's just that the Sherbourn was the only one I could audition next to my current set up. The appeal of the Cinema Grand is that it supposedly works better with the Sunfire speakers which I have. On the other hand, that notwithstanding, Sherbourn sounds like a similar deal, but is a tad cheaper. B&K on the other hand, would probably cost about the same as the Cinema Grand, but (being older notwithstanding), the set up would be a 2ch + 3ch, which seems to be better than a one 5-ch unit. As for THX, I only mentioned it since it was there, I am well aware that it's more of a gimmick than anything else.

Lastly, I just looked at Emotiva, and found a couple of glowing reviews, which, being so glowing left me feeling a bit uneasy. Also, I am wondering if the expression that if something is too good to be true it probably is is appropriate here......

[RoadRunner6]

I can guarantee you it doesn't apply here. If you have any knowledge of product distribution you will quickly catch on. Guess at the price of an amp sitting in the factory warehouse ready to be shipped directly to the end user. Now guess at the price of the same amp sitting at the cash register of a high end audio/HT dealer getting ready to be rung up by the commisiomed sales person. The first amp has very low overhead and no expensive adds in magazines, etc. That $799 amp soon becomes a $2000-$3000 amp.

All owner's get a little excited with their own toys but here below are some serious audio/HT enthusiast's thoughts. Many of them initially had some misgivings like I did when they first heard about Emotiva. I had previous experience with other online direct companies (Axiom, Outlaw, HSU, SVS, etc.) so was not too surprised.

I am a born sceptic and can sniff out a scam at 50 paces. I spent many, many hours investigating Emotiva and their products before finally pulling the trigger. I am so impressed that I plan to buy their soon to be released XMC-1 pre/pro. I also am on the waitimg list for the OPPO DMP-83 Blu-Ray player. As an Emotiva, Axiom and Outlaw owner I am a firm believer in the price/perfomance advantage of the online direct to buyer companies.

http://emotivalounge.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=ampreviews

[Roman-dude]

ok, I subscribe to most of what you are saying, selling direct clearly is cheaper. However, that alone does not explain (IMHO) the entire price differential. For instance, think Dell vs HP or any other PC maker - none are twice + the price of the former. Also, much needs to be said for the know-how that goes in it, which is something that usually comes with experience. Not always, but often. Anyway, I am sure that Emotiva is a solid amp, I am just not certain how well it stacks up relative to the other manufacturers.

[RoadRunner6]

Call Emotiva and talk directly to Dan Laufman, the man who designed these amps. I'm serious, if he is not in China, he will be happy to talk to you. He has many years experience prior to Emotiva. When you call for customer service of any kind you talk to only one a handful of people, not someone in India or the Philipines.

Have you seen the size of the Dell company? Have you seen the size of their advertising budget? Try calling to talk to Michael Dell. In comparing Dell to Emotiva, I don't think you get the point here about the size of Emotiva. It is a small specialty company that manufactures only a few very selective products. For example, they are right now releasing their new high end ERC-1 CD player for the amazing price of $399. There is a waiting list to buy and they will probably sell their first shipment in a relatively short time.

I won't try any further to convince you. In my 40 years in this hobby I have never had a purchase that I was so pleased with both for performance and value. I only hope others reading this thread might check out Emotiva as I did. If I were you and buying from the local high end shop and not considering Emotiva or perhaps Outlaw I would strongly consider NAD and perhaps Parasound IMO versus Sunfire, B&W or Sherbourn.

Didn't mean to hog your thread. Hopefully others will give their opinions. Good luck on your choice.

RR6

[Roman-dude]

We're getting carried away. I could counter your points, but really don't see how that would help anyone. You're happy with your equipment and that's all that matters. lets just hope that I'm wrong. And thanks for the input!

Oh, and I'm going with Sherbourn, B&K pretty much took itself out of the race by being outside of my budget....

[RoadRunner6]

Looks like you already had your mind made up before you posted. Too bad you're not open to other options. The Emotiva is also out of your budget!

[Roman-dude]

Looks like you already had your mind made up before you posted. Too bad you're not open to other options. The Emotiva is also out of your budget!
hmm I was torn btn the three options listed above. based on what I found online after your suggestion, i clearly was not sold on Emotiva. i also don't see how it was out of my budget..

[RoadRunner6]

That was a joke! Out of your budget, way below it, get it?

Actually I didn't think that model Sherbourn was even still available unless you bought it used. Anyway, it was tested by HT Magazine and produced only 183 watts per ch/8 ohms with 2 channels driven at 0.1% distortion, not the 200 watts per channel with all 5 channels driven with much less distortion as specified by Sherbourn. Some pretty hefty exageration on Sherboun's part. Maybe as far as Sherbourn is cincerned the expression that if something is too good to be true it probably is is appropriate here......

RR6 :hand:

[Roman-dude]

yeah, used. i fail to see a point of spending several times the $ for this type of a thing. maybe i'm wrong, who knows. i know abt the lower wattage, but i was going by the relative reviews, where power was but one of the considerations.

[RoadRunner6]

It is nice when you start a thread here if you let people know you are talking about used equipment. I now must presume you had already bought it used and just came here to confirm that you made a good decision. You now must feel rather foolish knowing you could have bought a better amp, brand new, with a 5 year warranty for $799.

[Roman-dude]

It is nice when you start a thread here if you let people know you are talking about used equipment. I now must presume you had already bought it used and just came here to confirm that you made a good decision. You now must feel rather foolish knowing you could have bought a better amp, brand new, with a 5 year warranty for $799.

just saw this.. so, in retrospect I, in fact, could have mentioned that all of the ones I was considering were used. On the other hand, I asked questions pertaining to the quality of these amps, not their prices. On to your second point - your presumption was incorrect - I did not buy anything at the time I posted, it would be wise to read posts for what they are instead of trying to make them out to be something they are not. But that's your call. And, finally, in the end I did end up going with Sherbourn. I don't at all feel foolish, but rather satisfied. But since we're talking psychology here, it begs the question why is it that you were so persistently trying to sway me towards Emotivas? Was it because you bought these yourself and want an additional confirmation that you made the right decision by seeing other ppl follow in your footsteps? I don't know, but it sounds plausible to me.. anyway, thanks for your advice.