Blu-Ray for a non-HDMI receiver

[Breezer88888]

Hey,
I'm probably not the only one with a beloved receiver that pre-dates HDMI. I am searching for a Blu-Ray player that will decode the hi-res bits of Dolby and DTS Master (sorry, I'm not up on the exact terminology yet) and output the signal in analog fashion into my receiver. I know the cables will be a bit messy, and I'll lose the 7.1 capability, but I'm just not looking to replace my receiver ... yet. I just recently suffered a lose of my favorite upscaling DVD player, Sony DVP-NS975V. Anyone out there who's had one might understand the pain.
Thanks,
Breezer

[L.J.]

Not any out that can handle both Dolby TrueHD & DTSMA yet but this Panny looks like it's gonna be the first out. Not sure on the price.

http://www.blu-ray.com/players/players.php?id=17&show=specs

Here is a list of current & upcoming players, broken down pretty nicely.

http://www.blu-ray.com/players/

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

Hey,
I'm probably not the only one with a beloved receiver that pre-dates HDMI. I am searching for a Blu-Ray player that will decode the hi-res bits of Dolby and DTS Master (sorry, I'm not up on the exact terminology yet) and output the signal in analog fashion into my receiver. I know the cables will be a bit messy, and I'll lose the 7.1 capability, but I'm just not looking to replace my receiver ... yet. I just recently suffered a lose of my favorite upscaling DVD player, Sony DVP-NS975V. Anyone out there who's had one might understand the pain.
Thanks,
Breezer

I understand your pain man, let us bow our heads for a moment of silence.......okay enough of that!.

There are several players to consider. The Panasonic BMP-BD-50, the Sony BD-S550 which is coming out late summer, and the Marantz BD-8002. All of these players will internally decode everything under the same, and can stream the codecs to a receiver as well. Do know if they are all out yet, but these are what you should be looking for. I also do not know the price, except for the Sony which is going to be $500, and worth every dime because it is a 2.0 profile player.

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

Not any out that can handle both Dolby TrueHD & DTSMA yet but this Panny looks like it's gonna be the first out. Not sure on the price.

http://www.blu-ray.com/players/players.php?id=17&show=specs

Here is a list of current & upcoming players, broken down pretty nicely.

http://www.blu-ray.com/players/

Okay, the display I am assigning you to is now just 18", and you get that with a Bose system to boot for beating me to this.

[Breezer88888]

Great competitive spirit! I've read about the Panasonic and upcoming Sony S550 and will keep researching - cannot wait! The thing for me is in addition to the decoding, the actual output since no HDMI will be going into my receiver. Don't mean to sound dense, but what kind of high resolution audio can I expect from either Toslink or Digital Coax output from any BD player? Or will I be limited to standard Dolby and DTS? By the way, I've always favored DTS. Is DTSMA as great as they say?

[diggity]

Great competitive spirit! I've read about the Panasonic and upcoming Sony S550 and will keep researching - cannot wait! The thing for me is in addition to the decoding, the actual output since no HDMI will be going into my receiver. Don't mean to sound dense, but what kind of high resolution audio can I expect from either Toslink or Digital Coax output from any BD player? Or will I be limited to standard Dolby and DTS? By the way, I've always favored DTS. Is DTSMA as great as they say?

if your amp pre-dates HDMI i would say all you will get through toslink and coaxial is standard dts/dolby. but my uderstanding is that if you get a player that has line level out (one RCA per channel) you will get a better sound quality as this will get you multi channel pcm.

cheers: dazza

[L.J.]

Great competitive spirit! I've read about the Panasonic and upcoming Sony S550 and will keep researching - cannot wait! The thing for me is in addition to the decoding, the actual output since no HDMI will be going into my receiver. Don't mean to sound dense, but what kind of high resolution audio can I expect from either Toslink or Digital Coax output from any BD player? Or will I be limited to standard Dolby and DTS? By the way, I've always favored DTS. Is DTSMA as great as they say?

Using toslink/coax will give you standard DD/DTS but at a higher bitrate than DVD. 640kbps for DD & 1.5mbps for DTS.

I only have 2 BR that support DTSMA but have no way of hearing it......for now. I'm stuck listening to the "core" DTS 1.5mbps track, until the PS3 gets a DTSMA update, but let me tell you that the full bitrate DTS track still sounds sweet. There shouldn't really be any difference between the lossless audio formats.

[pixelthis]

I understand your pain man, let us bow our heads for a moment of silence.......okay enough of that!.

There are several players to consider. The Panasonic BMP-BD-50, the Sony BD-S550 which is coming out late summer, and the Marantz BD-8002. All of these players will internally decode everything under the same, and can stream the codecs to a receiver as well. Do know if they are all out yet, but these are what you should be looking for. I also do not know the price, except for the Sony which is going to be $500, and worth every dime because it is a 2.0 profile player.

So theres NO reason to buy a Blu until then.
Thanks, glad to see you're finally good for something:ihih:

[L.J.]

So theres NO reason to buy a Blu until then.
Thanks, glad to see you're finally good for something:ihih:

I don't know 'bout that. I've been enjoying "Blu" perfectly fine for over a year now.

[Breezer88888]

Thanks all. So it sounds like I will have (and hopefully hear) some benefit from my toslink connection. As for finding a player that gives a line level output for each channel, I would have preferred that, but they are not easy to find. Maybe they're more prevalent at higher price points.

The player that I picked up today is the Toshiba HD-A3. I felt compelled to do it because of the $100 price and the rebate which gives me a total of 7 HD DVDs happens to end today. I actually just got left Circuit City as they were locking up. I really appreciate you guys chiming in on this thread. Very exciting stuff indeed.

[L.J.]

Well....you should be able to pick up a bunch of titles for under $10 really soon.

[Breezer88888]

Latest report - the Toshiba HD A3 might be going back to the store. I'm researching, but the sound sucks! Picture for Transformers HD version is very good, and I have the SD version as well so I know the movie (especially the Megan Fox scenes). The thing is, with my recently deceased Sony player, the sound was awesome! I was using a Digital Coax, rather than Toslink. But I think the fault is with Toshiba as my Denon receiver says that it is receiving Dolby Pro Logic (not Dolby Digital) and just sounds quite flat. I knew it was too easy, but I will research and post when I figure this out.

[L.J.]

You got something setup wrong. Your AVR should be receiving a DD 5.1 signal. It seems to be getting a 2 channel signal and this is making Pro Logic kick in.

Im curious, why did you decide to go with HD DVD?

[Breezer88888]

Whew, thanks LJ! Yep, I should have had the player set to output Bitstream rather than PCM. Simple mistake on my part and everything came alive after correcting that.

So to answer your very valid question as to why did I choose HD DVD:

1) Overall cost, $100 player with 7 HD DVDs
2) My Sony RPTV is 1080i, and this player goes up to that level.
3) My receiver is non-HDMI so I can't take full advantage of high resolution audio formats. With this last limitation, I could not rationalize spending $500 on the other players mentioned and coming up later this year. Selecting one of those Blu-Ray players would have given me some future-proofing, but it would have also tempted me into buying a new receiver. And that would match nicely with my speaker set-up which is 7.1

Given the headlines on the economy, and no pay raise for me this year, I had quite a bit of inner turmoil over to spend and not be so short-sighted, or to not spend and keep the bills low. I do worry about the lack of HD DVD titles going forward, but the player does an ok job of upscaling SD DVDs. So there you have it. Thanks again!

[diggity]

hey man i totally agree. i now sell hd-dvd players purely as an upscaling dvd player, and now they are selling more than ever. what is even funnier i haven't even needed to lower the price!

cheers: dazza

[pixelthis]

Whew, thanks LJ! Yep, I should have had the player set to output Bitstream rather than PCM. Simple mistake on my part and everything came alive after correcting that.

So to answer your very valid question as to why did I choose HD DVD:

1) Overall cost, $100 player with 7 HD DVDs
2) My Sony RPTV is 1080i, and this player goes up to that level.
3) My receiver is non-HDMI so I can't take full advantage of high resolution audio formats. With this last limitation, I could not rationalize spending $500 on the other players mentioned and coming up later this year. Selecting one of those Blu-Ray players would have given me some future-proofing, but it would have also tempted me into buying a new receiver. And that would match nicely with my speaker set-up which is 7.1

Given the headlines on the economy, and no pay raise for me this year, I had quite a bit of inner turmoil over to spend and not be so short-sighted, or to not spend and keep the bills low. I do worry about the lack of HD DVD titles going forward, but the player does an ok job of upscaling SD DVDs. So there you have it. Thanks again!

Hope you like it, but you basically paid 100$ for a doorstop.
When you buy a player you arent just buying a "player" you are buying into a format.
You wont be able to get discs for this "player" in six months to a year.
AND TRUST ME, after watching HD for awhile a strange happens to your DVD's,
even upconverted ones.
Their picture is sucky.
IN OTHER WORDS YOU WASTED 100 BUCKS, but thats okay , its your hundred bucks:1:

[zepman1]

"3) My receiver is non-HDMI so I can't take full advantage of high resolution audio formats"

I do not think this is the case. You can play the new lossless audio formats through the 7.1 analog output from the BR/HD player. The decoding does not have to be done by the receiver...

[Breezer88888]

You're right Zepman, but finding a player with analog outputs would have had a significant increase in cost for me. Not just because of the unit itself, which would not be the entry-level model since those usually take the minimalist approach to outputs. But also because of the number of interconnects needed. I'm not saying that I would use very pricey cables, but hey, it does add up quickly.

The decision will eventually come that I will choose a Blu-Ray player and that's where I will get more serious about finding the right player for me. No doubt about that. But the tougher one will always linger, do I keep my receiver, or pay up for a current model...

[Breezer88888]

Didn't forget about you Pixel. Your comments are understandable and totally agree about discriminating against any non-HD disc. But c'mon, there's got to be a stop-gap for all the money we feel compelled to spend on technology. I still have my first pre-progressive scan DVD player which works fine with my CRT TV.

So here's the thing, my best DVD player in the house died so I needed something. Buy a door stop, maybe. But it will hold me over until Blu-rays start dropping in price - which may not be until next year. And as long as Blockbuster doesn't bail out on HD DVDs thru the mail, I should be ok for a while. Sometimes its about the choices and what we decide to chase ...

[zepman1]

You're right Zepman, but finding a player with analog outputs would have had a significant increase in cost for me. Not just because of the unit itself, which would not be the entry-level model since those usually take the minimalist approach to outputs. But also because of the number of interconnects needed. I'm not saying that I would use very pricey cables, but hey, it does add up quickly.
...

I don't think analog outs will cost you anything. If you look at Worst Buy, the cheapest Bluray they sell is $399. The Sharp and the Sony both have 5.1 analog outs. It appears the Samsung does not.

Interconnects can cost a lot of money, but you can pick up some decent quality analog interconnects for 5.1 audio for $10 or so all over the internet.

No big deal, just want to make sure you are aware of all this, and that I am clear on my thinking as well. I am in the process of upgrading some HT equipment and the whole HDMI and lossless audio thing has me somewhat confused.

[Breezer88888]

Thanks for the posts! I'll wait until this year's Black Friday sales to see what's out there. Good luck with your upgrades.

[pixelthis]

Didn't forget about you Pixel. Your comments are understandable and totally agree about discriminating against any non-HD disc. But c'mon, there's got to be a stop-gap for all the money we feel compelled to spend on technology. I still have my first pre-progressive scan DVD player which works fine with my CRT TV.

So here's the thing, my best DVD player in the house died so I needed something. Buy a door stop, maybe. But it will hold me over until Blu-rays start dropping in price - which may not be until next year. And as long as Blockbuster doesn't bail out on HD DVDs thru the mail, I should be ok for a while. Sometimes its about the choices and what we decide to chase ...


Think of it as a graph.
You see the graph as a gentle slope, with HDDVD gradually being phased out.
I see it as a cliff.
Once enthropy sets in things will accelerate rapidly.
Rentals will cease first, and fast, there wont be ANY new ones.
And no new HD titles that arent in the pipeline.
Laser was an established format, around more than a decade, died in less than a year,
went up like rice paper.
"disco vision", a cheap RCA videodisc died even faster. it got ugly FAST.
"UPCONVERTING" IS A CON, REALLY, has some but not much improvement.
And that is all that your player will be good for really.
A DEDICATED DVD WILL LOAD FASTER, probably last longer.
Trust me, this is a hugh embarassment for tosh, as soon as they get the body buried
in the back yard THE BETTER:1: