Is MS Stupid? HDMI 1.2 not 1.3 for Elite!

[Groundbeef]

In a move that some are questioning MS has decided to use HDMI 1.2 vs 1.3 in the new "Elite" 360 package.

As I have no use for HDMI it really doesn't affect me, but in the interest of fairness to the sorry PS3, I will post some controverisal news for the 360.

http://www.xbox360fanboy.com/2007/04/02/oh-the-horror-elite-to-use-hdmi-1-2-not-1-3/

In other more happy news, the HD-DVD drive can now be purchased for as low as $130-140 at Sams Clubs. Thats a good price for a quality HD-DVD drive.

http://www.xbox360fanboy.com/2007/04/03/sams-club-selling-hd-dvd-player-for-130/

[ericl]

Thanks for the Fair & Balanced console coverage GB! ;)

[Woochifer]

I would guess that a firmware upgrade might be possible. The Toshiba HD-DVD players were initially issued with HDMI 1.2, but support for 1.3 was added later on via firmware update.

My main concern for the Xbox 360 Elite/HD-DVD drive combo would be whether they make any kind of provision for lossless audio. You don't need HDMI 1.3 to get lossless audio since 7.1 uncompressed PCM audio support is already part of the HDMI 1.1 spec. If the 360 Elite can transcode the Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD signals to uncompressed PCM, then you can get lossless audio resolution with a compatible HDMI 1.1 and higher receiver. If the 360 Elite still downconverts all the HD-DVD lossless audio tracks to 448k Dolby Digital, then the value of the HDMI connection diminishes somewhat, though version 1.2 still provides some measure of future proofing on the video side.

[PeruvianSkies]

In a move that some are questioning MS has decided to use HDMI 1.2 vs 1.3 in the new "Elite" 360 package.

As I have no use for HDMI it really doesn't affect me, but in the interest of fairness to the sorry PS3, I will post some controverisal news for the 360.

http://www.xbox360fanboy.com/2007/04/02/oh-the-horror-elite-to-use-hdmi-1-2-not-1-3/

In other more happy news, the HD-DVD drive can now be purchased for as low as $130-140 at Sams Clubs. Thats a good price for a quality HD-DVD drive.

http://www.xbox360fanboy.com/2007/04/03/sams-club-selling-hd-dvd-player-for-130/


You know you would think that companies could learn from mistakes instead of taking the easier way out all the time or for that matter the 'lazy' way out. We are in the middle of a huge debacle between various formats, internet, and the future of various mediums, so this is a crucial time for things to be done right. If not, people get frustrated, confused, upset, and draw back from making forward progress. It's insane decisions like this that truly cause the slow move of progress.

[Robert-The-Rambler]

In a move that some are questioning MS has decided to use HDMI 1.2 vs 1.3 in the new "Elite" 360 package.

As I have no use for HDMI it really doesn't affect me, but in the interest of fairness to the sorry PS3, I will post some controverisal news for the 360.

http://www.xbox360fanboy.com/2007/04/02/oh-the-horror-elite-to-use-hdmi-1-2-not-1-3/

In other more happy news, the HD-DVD drive can now be purchased for as low as $130-140 at Sams Clubs. Thats a good price for a quality HD-DVD drive.

http://www.xbox360fanboy.com/2007/04/03/sams-club-selling-hd-dvd-player-for-130/

Here is a brief summary of the differences between the various HDMI versions from audioholics. A link to the entire article on HDMI version 1.3 follows. 1.3 is not necessary in today's market. To take advantage of all the features of HDMI version 1.3 is impossible. I have version 1.1 in both my TV and receiver and will not need anymore.

HDMI 1.0

Released December 2002 - Single-cable digital audio/video connection with a maximum bit rate of 4.9Gbps. Supports up to 165Mpixels/sec video

HDMI 1.1

Released May 2004 - Added support for content protection metadata required for DVD Audio.

HDMI 1.2

Released August 2005 - Added support for One Bit Audio, used on Super Audio CDs, up to 8 channels.

HDMI 1.2a

Released December 2005 - Fully specifies Consumer Electronic Control (CEC) features, command sets, and CEC compliance tests.

HDMI 1.3

Released 22 June 2006 - Increases single-link bandwidth to 340 MHz (10.2 Gbps). This requires a cable designed for these higher bandwidths. All previous versions used the same HDMI cable. HDMI 1.3 and HDMI 1.3a use the same connector as HDMI 1.2a

HDMI 1.3a

Released 10 November 2006.

What does HDMI 1.3 do that previous versions didn’t do?

HDMI 1.3a adds six benefits to the HDMI palette. The most obvious and easiest to understand is higher data transfer speed. The HDMI 1.3a standard increases single-link bandwidth to 340 MHz (10.2 Gbps), which will support demands of future HD display devices incorporating higher resolutions, Deep Color and high frame rates. Keep in mind that previous versions of HDMI are fully capable of 1080p performance. Even more, the FCC has presented no imminent plans for a “higher” high-definition system than 1080p. Because 1080p has just begun to enter the market this increased bandwidth can be considered more a hedge against future applications than something the industry and consumers can benefit from in the near future.

HDMI 1.3a also supports a format known as Deep Color. You may see this referred to as Extended-gamut YCC (xvYCC). Deep Color is a new color space used in video electronics. It can support 1.8 times as many colors as RGB. RGB, as you may know, creates colors through a mixture of Red, Green, and Blue primary colors. Deep Color defines colors by means of an algorithm that can specify any color in nature.

This improvement in color performance is significant only in specifications. Current HDTV broadcasts (and the current HDMI standard) uses 8-bit color depth. The new HDMI 1.3a standard with Deep Color capability expands the number of colors viewable on an HDTV from millions to billions, while eliminating color banding and subtle gradations between colors through the use of 10-bit, 12-bit, and 16-bit color depths. It is vitally important to understand that every movie ever transferred to DVD or any other digital format has been done using 8-bit color depth. While the new Deep Color format could provide an improvement in picture quality, there currently is no content (no movies, TV shows or archived material) available that can be easily trans-coded into the new system. With the existing issues of Digital Rights Management (DRM) and High-bandwidth Digital Content Protection (HDCP) just beginning to be worked out it is highly unlikely that Hollywood and the entertainment industry will rush to provide software that is a clone of the original movie quality. The first place Deep Color is likely to be used is in advanced gaming systems, but even that milestone seems beyond the immediate future.

HDMI 1.3a incorporates automatic audio syncing (lip sync) capability. This is a system that will automatically adjust for the difference in electronic latency between the processing circuits of the sound and image. This discrepancy sometimes manifests itself as a slight delay in the sound compared to the image.

HDMI 1.3a supports output of Dolby TrueHD and DTS-HD Master Audio streams for external decoding by AV receivers. TrueHD and DTS-HD are lossless audio codec formats used on HD DVDs and Blu-ray Discs. If the disc player can decode these streams into uncompressed audio, then HDMI 1.3 is not necessary, as all versions of HDMI can transport uncompressed audio.

HDMI 1.3a provides for a new mini connector for devices such as camcorders.

http://www.audioholics.com/education/display-formats-technology/understanding-hdmi-ver-1.3

[kexodusc]

Yeah, I don't really see this as a big deal for MS. They're not selling loads of those things anyway, and I doubt the HD-DVD add on is ever really going to take off to a point where something like this will matter enough to potential buyers. And if it ever did, I'm sure they'd revise it by then anyway. It's still a good budget HD-DVD drive option for some people I guess.

Man, good read on the HDMI stuff there. I don't use mine yet. I think it's a great idea that's been poorly implemented so far. I suppose when I finally buy and HD-DVD player or XBOX 360 (or BluRay player) I'll need to get a new receiver and re-evaluate things then.

[Groundbeef]

Yeah, I don't really see this as a big deal for MS. They're not selling loads of those things anyway, and I doubt the HD-DVD add on is ever really going to take off to a point where something like this will matter enough to potential buyers. And if it ever did, I'm sure they'd revise it by then anyway. It's still a good budget HD-DVD drive option for some people I guess.

Man, good read on the HDMI stuff there. I don't use mine yet. I think it's a great idea that's been poorly implemented so far. I suppose when I finally buy and HD-DVD player or XBOX 360 (or BluRay player) I'll need to get a new receiver and re-evaluate things then.

Why not pick one up at Sams for $130? It'll do upconversion of regular DVD's and PLAY HD-DVD? Even if the sound is not 'lossless' it sure does sound good over my Pioneer reciever. Enjoy it now, and upgrade when you get around to it.

[emorphien]

I haven't seen a TV showing or supporting the "Deep Color" of 1.3. I personally wonder how much it matters with most discs and most TVs right now as far as whether they can capture and reliably reproduce everything HDMI 1.3 claims to transmit. Aside from that color is one of the less critical things they can do to improve the perceived quality, psychovisually the best color comes behind sharpness and other things.

[kexodusc]

Why not pick one up at Sams for $130? It'll do upconversion of regular DVD's and PLAY HD-DVD? Even if the sound is not 'lossless' it sure does sound good over my Pioneer reciever. Enjoy it now, and upgrade when you get around to it.

'spose I could...except I'd probably have to buy one of those overpriced XBOX 360 machines too?
I'll wait for a console to hit a price point low enough to grab my attention, then buy it...If HD-DVD has enough releases I'm interested in at that point in time then I'll consider it. If PS3 is still being sold by vendors and doesn't require a mortgage, maybe I'll use that for my BluRay needs. After Laserdisc and Minidisc, I'm done with being an early adopter.

Think I'll just put that $130 in the bank and get in at a better time. I keep hearing reports of price drops for both BluRay and HD-DVD players later this year.

[Groundbeef]

'spose I could...except I'd probably have to buy one of those overpriced XBOX 360 machines too?
I'll wait for a console to hit a price point low enough to grab my attention, then buy it...If HD-DVD has enough releases I'm interested in at that point in time then I'll consider it. If PS3 is still being sold by vendors and doesn't require a mortgage, maybe I'll use that for my BluRay needs. After Laserdisc and Minidisc, I'm done with being an early adopter.

Think I'll just put that $130 in the bank and get in at a better time. I keep hearing reports of price drops for both BluRay and HD-DVD players later this year.

My mistake. I misread your earlier post and thought you were holding off on buying the HD-DVD, and that you HAD a 360 already.

[kexodusc]

My mistake. I misread your earlier post and thought you were holding off on buying the HD-DVD, and that you HAD a 360 already.
Damn, I was hoping you were gonna give me some work around to hook the drive up to my TV without the 360 :(