HDMI Problem

[ibclimbn]

I need some help solving an HDMI issue with some equipment that I just purchased.

Short Story: HDMI connection from Marantz 6001 DVD Player to Marantz 8001 receiver. HDMI connection from Marantz 8001 to Pionner 5071 Flat Panel. The Audio and Video shut off after 10-15 seconds. The retail outlet where I bought the equipment indicates that it is a power conditioning issue. I think that it is an HDMI compatibility issue. Any ideas?

Long Story: Cable box via component cables to AV Receiver and then HDMI to the Flat Panel works. DVD Player directly to Flat Panel via HDMI works. I took the DVD player and AV receiver into the store where I bought them and they connected them up with my HDMI cable to another flat panel and it all worked. So the only two items that weren't the same were the AC power and the flat panel. I tried different DVD's I tried a Panamax 5100 power conditioner and neither had any effect. I am stuck and not sure what to try next. I can run component from the DVD to the AV receiver but that is just bypassing the problem.

Thanks

[edtyct]

When you say audio and video shut off after 10-15 seconds, do you mean audio w/ video through HDMI to the flat panel or audio routed to speakers by the receiver?

Whenever HDMI requires a repeater function--that is, the signal to be relayed from a source through an intermediary to a target--transmission becomes more complicated. As you imply, the compatibility issues multiply; some HDMI units aren't properly prepared for such repeating. However, the 10-15 seconds of video (and audio?) that you get would seem to rule out a handshake problem. If the HDMI were getting stuck in the middle of nowhere, you wouldn't get anything. This is not to say that other arcane HDMI obstacles might not be interfering.

Have you tried DVI or HDMI from the cable box through the receiver and into the Pioneer? Cable boxes are notoriously fickle when it comes to repeating functions, but every bit of troubleshooting helps. If the cable box works on a digital platform, something might get clearer. And the Pioneer, as the one meaningful part of the equation that changes from home to store, might not be able to hold sync via HDMI with the receiver. If a digital signal originating in the cable box (presumably at 1080i or 720p) were to work okay along this pathway, it might be suggestive.
I assume that the scaled resolution from the DVD player was the same at home as in the store. Otherwise, I'd wonder if the receiver weren't able to handle 1080p, though I know that the DVD player and plasma can.

[ibclimbn]

What I have tried so far that works:
1) HD Cable Box component to AV RCVR and then HDMI to Flat Panel
2) HD Cable Box component to AV RCVR and then Component to Flat Panel
3) DVD component to AV RCVR and then HDMI to Flat Panel
4) DVD component to AV RCVR and then component to Flat Panel

What doesn't work:
1) DVD HDMI to AV RCVR and then HDMI to Flat Panel
2) DVD HDMI to AV RCVR and then component to Flat Panel

In all cases audio is from the source to the AV RCVR via digital coax and then to the speakers.

After 10-15 seconds the video to the flat panel goes away and simultaneously the audio to the speakers goes silent. The AV RCVR starts to flash "NO DATA".

Regarding your point on the scaled resolution from the DVD player, I didn't change any configuration settings in the AV RCVR but the store used one of their DVDs as compared to the ones that I have so this may have some effect.

I can't think of any additional scenerios to try to isolate the problem. Do you think that it could be noise on the AC line as the local store is indicating?

[edtyct]

First of all, I can't imagine a DVD making any sort of difference, and, second, noise on the AC line makes no sense to me whatsoever. Was that simply a ploy to get you to buy something else? What store was it, surely not an A/V specialty store?

Scenario #2 in WDoesn'tW doesn't surprise me, since what starts out as an HDMI signal cannot become a component signal due to copy-protection issues.

What were the relevant video settings on the receiver and DVD player that didn't change? Assuming that you're using the scaling function of the DVD player (are you?), what happens when you run HDMI from beginning to end but change the resolution to 480p?

I wish that you could try HDMI all the way from cable box to receiver to plasma.

[ibclimbn]

The store that suggested that it was an AC noise problem was a high end AV store. They loaned me a unit to try before I bought it to make sure that it solved the problem so I don't think that they were just trying to sell me something else.

I will try your suggestion of taking the resolutions settings off Auto and go to 480P all of the way thru from the DVD to see if that solves the problem. I am also going to borrow another DVD player with HDMI to see if that fixes it.

Unfortunately my cable box doesn't support HDMI.

Thanks for the help

[edtyct]

My pleasure. No, it doesn't seem like they're trying to sell you a conditioner for the wrong reasons (power line conditioning isn't necessarily a bad idea on many grounds), but a fully dropped HDMI signal from AC line noise is a new one on me, unlike more common sync problems, handshake failure, and signal loss. Speaking of signal loss, how long is the total HDMI run between DVD player and plasma, including receiver? If it's long, or otherwise impaired, and the Marantz receiver is merely a passive switch, you might be losing signal. Long shots, all, so far, but we're trying.

[ibclimbn]

I changed the resolution settings to 480p on the DVD, I couldn't find any way to manually change the setting on the SR8001 AV RCVR. This change didn't resolve the problem. I plan on boxing up the Marantz 6001 DVD player and returning it to get another DVD player. Hopefully this will resolve the HDMI issue.

[edtyct]

I'm not sure that the DVD player is the problem. What makes you think so?

[AVMASTER]

it sounds like the AVR is a switcher and not a repeater? But if it worked in the store with HDMI all the way then we can rule out both components and look at the actual connection/cable; too long -defective- damaged? B-4 you take back the dvd player , lets just switch out the cable-another long shot but humor us anyway

[ibclimbn]

I actually brought in my HDMI cable with me when it worked in the store to minimize variables. Last night I was re-reading the manuals and one item that I thought might be a problem is that I am not adhering to the minimum spacing dimensions around my components and so there may be a thermal issue. When I brought my equipment into the store I had everything powered down and so it was cool. We plugged everything in an it worked right away. Tonight I am going to power everything down and let it come to room temperature and then bring it all up to see if it works before things get hot.

[ibclimbn]

What is the difference between the AVR being a switcher versus a repeater? Would it being a switcher be causing this problem?

[edtyct]

Any format is capable of switching, but the issue of a switcher not being able to repeat a signal, or an originating device refusing to repeat its signal through a switcher, is germane to HDMI only.

As I mentioned earlier, you might have a repeating problem, though the 10 to 15 seconds of audio/video that you get before failure doesn't appear to confirm it. The fatal interruption seems more like a bandwidth problem, or a broken signal, than an HDCP glitch--though with HDMI I wouldn't put any money on it.

[gman086]

BUMP!

I'm having the exact same issues, same receiver, DV7001 DVD player and I have a pretty good idea of what might be happening but want to hear other's experiences as well because Marantz is of NO help!

I definitely think it's an HDMI handshake problem. The signal passes for 15-30 seconds then the handshake is telling the dvd player to shut down the signal pass because of copyright protection (I think the lame repeater in the receiver is tricking the dvd player into thinking it's being recorded, ESPECIALLY if you use a dvr cable box like I am?). I know this because I can play my pirated, non-copyright discs with no problem. What is the solution? Can you believe Marantz told me to get the new 8002 receiver with HDMI 1.3 because that doesn't have these issues? And, of course, they don't have an upgrade program! Part of the issue may be the repeater since the output of the DVD player is HDMI 1.1 and the inputs of the 8001 receiver are 1.2 yet the output from the receiver to the monitor is back to version 1.1! I'm seriously ready to buy a Sony Blu-ray player and call it good - it's HDMI version 1.3 simplay output is supposed to be compatible with ANY HDMI setup!

COMMENTS PLEASE!!!

Thanks,

G

[gman086]

Well let's put this one to bed right now...
With no help whatsoever here nor on three different AV forums, NOR from Marantz the problem was finally pinpointed. I read an article about HDMI that stated 90% of all handshake issues originate at the source player (especially copyright issues like this one). What happens is each component talks to one another and makes certain the HDCP signal is there which prevents copying of DVD's. Well apparently the DVD player wasn't waiting long enough for the signal to come back to it, decides it's being copied, and the picture goes green within 30 seconds. With a direct connection to the TV, this did not happen. Is the receiver at fault too? Partially, Marantz assured me that the new versions with HDMI 1.3 have NOT have this issue but that didn't help me. And I'm really PO'd at Marantz since I specifically purchased BOTH receiver and DVD player to AVOID compatibility issues. They offered me NO upgrade. This is the LAST time I'll do business with Marantz.

The fix - bought Sony's Blu-ray player BDP-S500 with the HDMI ver. 1.3 output. Works perfect. CD sound quality isn't quite as good (some slight background noise and lack of soundstage in comparison with Marantz's DV7001) but Blu-ray is wicked good for video and sound. I am disappointed with Blu-ray's ability to play standard DVD's tho - I'd put it less than your average $250 DVD player's ability to create a clean picture. I had heard conflicting reports about this from dealers but one stated that all the money/research/technology went into the Blu-ray reproduction and the standard DVD playback is just an afterthought for those machines. I was hoping he was wrong, especially with the mid-level model (good thing I didn't pay list price!). But I'd have to say he was right. Blu-rays are awesome but standard DVD's... you're better off waiting until the better manufatcurers move into the game (Marantz is working on one now as is Pioneer Elite) if you ask me.

Hope this can help someone avoid the frustrations I've endured.

Have FUN!

G Man

[hydroman]

All good info as i [hope] to take the plunge one day...

[adrianf]

I just wanted to say that I just purchased a DV7001 and a SR6001 receiver and I'm having the exact same issue as well. I thought I was going crazy at first because the connections are exactly right and I troubleshooted the HDMI inputs and outputs and cables, which all function perfectly. Anyway, it's good to see what the problem is. I haven't communicated with Marantz, but it's pretty ridiculous if they don't offer support for this. I don't think I'll return the player, because I don't have the money for a more expensive model, and based on the reviews I've read and the research I've done, this is the model I want (and I need the SACD/DVD-Audio playback).

What I ended up doing is plugging the HDMI from the DVD player directly to the TV for video, and then using the analog connections on the DVD player (which you have to use anyway for SACD) for audio, going into the receiver, with the receiver in 7.1 audio only mode. This works perfectly, and I figure the picture quality should be even better since that's one less component in the signal chain. The audio sounds great as well. I'm using very short mogami RCA cables, so I doubt that the sound quality is affected all that much in this case.

[f0rge]

wow that's just rediculous, i cant believe marantz cant even QC test their own products for compatibility, then offer no solutions other than to buy something else from them.

marantz wont likely get my money anytime soon

[macgruff69]

Please help me if you can. I just got a refurbished Marantz sr8001 about a week ago. I hooked it all up..everything sounds great. Last night I was watching tv and turned the channel on the hddvr cable box and all of a sudden I had no sound. I have no idea why. I do have sound when I listen to the tuner or when I play dvds and movies so I figured the receiver was not the problem. I checked everything I could (cables were all plugged in and secure) and still no sound. To make sure it was not my tv or cable box I swapped the cords so that the dvd cord was now in the tv input of the receiver and the tv cord now in the dvd input of the receiver. Well the sound works thru the sr8001 for both dvd and tv that way so I know that it isn't the tv input port that is faulty and it isn't the cable box that is faulty. For a temporary fix so I can watch tv - for now I have run the cable box directly into the tv hdmi input on my tv so I have sound when I watch tv but its thru my tv speakers. When I watch a dvd movie I can listen to the sound thru the sr8001. That is how I would normally use it so thats ok but I am bothered that if I wanted to I can not listen to a tv program thru the sr8001 and I could up until last night. I do know that with how I orig set it up ( cable box into the sr 8001 hdmi input dvd into the sr8001 dvd hdmi input and an hdmi cable from the output of the avr to the hdmi input of the tv everything worked and sound did not come over the tv speakers but I expected that, that makes sense. Plus it wasn't like the sound on the tv worked and then stopped working all of a sudden. this has me stumped. Any ideas on what went wrong and how to fix it? It just does not make sense to me that devices all devices work and all ports work but the tv will no longer work in the tv input. Please help. Just to be clear, the setup that will not work now did work for about a week then for no apparent reason it stopped working. I would like to resolve this w/o sending the receiver back for a replacement or to fix it if its something simple. Plus its just a pain to send it back but if its broke ofcourse I will.
Thanks

[pixelthis]

Why not use the coax or optical out on your hddvr? They will work as well as hdmi.
The main advantage for hdmi (at least now) is the picture.
As for why your set changed, welcome to the world of firmware upgrades, my guess, and its only a guess, is that your cable company "upgraded" the software, and copyprotection was increased, my cable company is always upgrading the software on my motorolla.
Also the sound goes off on my MOTOROLLA, I play something off of my dvr and the problem goes away.(usually)
TRY USING THE OPTICAL OR COAX OUT ON YOUR CABLEBOX:1: