Need Help Choosing a Receiver

[Palmz]

I'm quite a newb to Home Theater so bare with me.

I've just bought a Panasonic plasma TV, and inherited 2 Mission 780, and 2 Mission M71 bookshelf speakers. Eventually I plan on using all four of these as my rear array, but for now the 780's will work the front until I can afford some quality floorstanders.

I think I can find a decent center and sub, but I'm really debating over the receiver. I'm considering the Denon AVR-787, the Pioneer VSX-1016, and the Onkyo TX-SR604. Is there a clear winner hear? Some have told me that Denon by far has the best processing of the three, but it doesn't support HDMI. The Pioneer has THXSelect2 certification, but will that matter if it's not as good as the Denon anyway? And the Onkyo appears to be slightly more cost effective than the others. Yet a few others have suggested I switch to Yamaha all together.

Any thoughts?

[Robert-The-Rambler]

I'm quite a newb to Home Theater so bare with me.

I've just bought a Panasonic plasma TV, and inherited 2 Mission 780, and 2 Mission M71 bookshelf speakers. Eventually I plan on using all four of these as my rear array, but for now the 780's will work the front until I can afford some quality floorstanders.

I think I can find a decent center and sub, but I'm really debating over the receiver. I'm considering the Denon AVR-787, the Pioneer VSX-1016, and the Onkyo TX-SR604. Is there a clear winner hear? Some have told me that Denon by far has the best processing of the three, but it doesn't support HDMI. The Pioneer has THXSelect2 certification, but will that matter if it's not as good as the Denon anyway? And the Onkyo appears to be slightly more cost effective than the others. Yet a few others have suggested I switch to Yamaha all together.

Any thoughts?

Let me say THX IS a good thing to have. THX Select2 Cinema Mode is an awesome surround mode for either DTS or Dolby Digital content. It is just more immersive than regular DTS and DD. The other DSPs like Dolby Pro Logic IIx mode are awesome. I am literally cranking some Ozzy Osborne in a really cool matrix processed 7.1 format. It is just bliss for music with the lights out. The HDMI is useless in the 1016 because it is for video only. It is just video passthrough. That is a real bummer but the 7.1 inputs and outputs make up for it. I don't use its internal amps so I can't comment on those but it is an excellent unit for digital processing. I wish it had HDMI audio!!!!! I can't complain for $400 at Circuit City.

The Yammy HTR-5960 would be a great choice in the same price range. I almost bought it and since you plan on using the internal amp then the Yamaha would probably be a great choice if you don't care about not having HDMI. Yamaha amps are very good.

P.S In my experience just dealing with HDMI video it is truly a pain in the ass sometimes. I like component video better frankly because you never get errors and if a cable falls out somehow you don't have to start the whole movie over!!!! On the audio side you can just connect 7.1 inputs or 5.1 and get awesome analog sound anyway.

[Palmz]

That's good to know. The Panasonic Plasma I have will only do 1080i anyway so the HDMI isn't completely essential, but I could see myself getting a 1080p capable TV in the next four years for sure. Does component do 1080p as well?

So what you are saying regarding the HDMI on the 1016 is that I'll need an optical or coaxial input from my DVD player anyway...is that correct? I suppose that's not so bad.

I know nothing about the other receivers except that they are in the same price range and that Denon is a promanent name in AV electronics. The THX symbol on the front of the Pioneer is very seductive though. Is it possible that a non-THX certified receiver could actually have better quality sound than one that is certified?...in the same price range? I only ask this because I was nearly sold on the 1016 when a guy at Best Buy said "don't go with Pioneer, stick to Denon or Yamaha."

[Robert-The-Rambler]

That's good to know. The Panasonic Plasma I have will only do 1080i anyway so the HDMI isn't completely essential, but I could see myself getting a 1080p capable TV in the next four years for sure. Does component do 1080p as well?

So what you are saying regarding the HDMI on the 1016 is that I'll need an optical or coaxial input from my DVD player anyway...is that correct? I suppose that's not so bad.

I know nothing about the other receivers except that they are in the same price range and that Denon is a promanent name in AV electronics. The THX symbol on the front of the Pioneer is very seductive though. Is it possible that a non-THX certified receiver could actually have better quality sound than one that is certified?...in the same price range? I only ask this because I was nearly sold on the 1016 when a guy at Best Buy said "don't go with Pioneer, stick to Denon or Yamaha."

1. For digital sound yes you will need coax or optical cable. For HD-DVD, DVD-Audio, or any other multi channel audio not decoded by your receiver you will use the the 7.1 inputs.

2. I would get the one that costs the least and if the price were the same I would get the Yamaha since it should have the best amp. I don't know much about the Denon either. If it doesn't have 7.1 inputs then don't even bother.

Here is a link to the 5960 specs.

http://www.yamaha.com/yec/products/productdetail.html?CNTID=200502

3. When you get a 1080p TV just bypass the receiver altogether and connect directly to your TV with HDMI. I'm not sure about component handling 1080p. It probably should.

4. Yes it is possible that a non THX certified product can sound better but THX certified amps will sound great you can be sure of that. The Yamaha will also sound great. You can't lose with either. Don't necessarily listen to the guys at Best Buy. If the price is lower for the Pioneer than go with it. If the price is the same go with Yamaha.

5. Price update. At Bestbuy.com the Pioneer is selling for $425 and the Yamaha is selling for $500. For me the choice would be clear. I hope this helps. Enjoy.

http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=7963251&type=product&productCategoryId=cat03031&id=1153337017859

[Palmz]

I'm definitly leaning towards the 1016, I just play devil's advocate with myself to make sure I get the right one in the end.

[evil__betty]

I upgraded my receiver from a midrange Yamaha RXV amp to the Pioneer 1015 (last years model) and noticed a HUGE improvement. Even my wife who really doesn't care about audio/video said "wow I didn't think that it would make this much of difference". Now thats saying something. The MCACC from Pioneer is probably the best out there. Onkyo, HK, Yamaha, etc can't really come close with the auto calibration features of the Pioneer.

Regarding HDMI, I wouldn't worry about having a 1080p TV as HDMI will make a picture quality improvement on any HDTV. Having an up converting HDMI receiver will also make hooking up your gear easier - one cable from the amp to your set. It saves you switching inputs on the TV and lets your amp do the work. The Onkyo is a little bit better unit, but I would go with the Pioneer at that price point. If you're looking at dropping some more money into the purchase, I would look at a couple other models like the Onkyo 804.

Happy hunting!

[Palmz]

Thanks e'_b'. I've seen the 804 and I like it. To be honest I'm the kind of guy who would just MAKE room for what I want in my budget, but my wife is too smart for that kind of stuff (she keeps me realistic). The 7xx and 8xx series Onkyos are all THX Select and the 804 is HDMI with upconversion. Of course I'd love all of those features but just can't justify the extra costs considering other priorities at the moment. The Onkyo 674 actually upconverts as well, but upconversion isn't as important to me as simply having HDMI video in/out.

Question: will and HDMI upconverting reciever make regular S-Video signals also improve? or only component inputs?

Also, this MCACC feature, is that auto-calibration? From what I've heard (I really don't know anything though) manual set-up is still better than an auto calibration anyway.