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PHiX
06-06-2006, 08:27 AM
Hi guys,

Since I've been asking around about most components already, I will also try to get some info about speakers which I should be buying. The brand I had in mind as a quality brand is B&W, so I was planning to invest in 2 of those for my music listening. However, I read that B&W is mostly targeted at classical music, which is not really my thing. Mostly I listen to energetic heavier rock music or relatively tame metal and hiphop as well... now I'm wondering, would B&W be a good decision for me to begin with? Are there any brands that would be better for me to look into considering my (lack of? :D) musical taste? I really like my music to sound clear and warm, but it should be able to pack some punch as well.

Any advice would be appreciated!

paul_pci
06-06-2006, 09:36 AM
I have B&Ws (601s) and I like them and think they are a great value, and I listen to everything from heavy metal to classical. What you need to do is state you budget and type of speaker you are shopping for: floorstander or bookshelf, and then others can suggest other brands and models for you to check out. And as always, audition before you buy, as speakers are a very subjective component to the system and will have the greatest impact on perceived sound.

Resident Loser
06-06-2006, 09:49 AM
Hi guys,

Since I've been asking around about most components already, I will also try to get some info about speakers which I should be buying. The brand I had in mind as a quality brand is B&W, so I was planning to invest in 2 of those for my music listening. However, I read that B&W is mostly targeted at classical music, which is not really my thing. Mostly I listen to energetic heavier rock music or relatively tame metal and hiphop as well... now I'm wondering, would B&W be a good decision for me to begin with? Are there any brands that would be better for me to look into considering my (lack of? :D) musical taste? I really like my music to sound clear and warm, but it should be able to pack some punch as well.

Any advice would be appreciated!

As paul said, it's your dime and your ears...Chances are, a good piece of classical music will have a dynamic range far exceding that of your heaviest of rock...the B&Ws should be more than OK

Klipsch? Might be another good choice, perhaps a bit more efficient...

jimHJJ(...JBLs...another...)

PHiX
06-06-2006, 09:53 AM
Thanks for the reply, I am searching for bookshelf sized speakers for now while keeping in mind that I might want to move them to the back of a surround set-up in the future... or not, depending on how good they sound.

I don't really have a budget in mind, but 250 euros (about $300) is pretty much the maximum per speaker. At this store I saw a range of B&W speakers, but I don't remember any of the type numbers. One was a fairly small bookshelf, and the other a bit taller priced respectively 200 and 250 euros. I'm not sure, but my bet is that they were B&W 600's and 601's. Maybe 303... but then again I didn't see any taller speakers within that range on the B&W website.

JoeE SP9
06-06-2006, 02:28 PM
If any one or any manufacturer tells you their speaker is designed for a particular type of musi you should take that as a warning not to listen to that person or buy those speakers. Speakers are good or bad. They are not for a specific type of music.:cool:

topspeed
06-06-2006, 04:38 PM
If any one or any manufacturer tells you their speaker is designed for a particular type of musi you should take that as a warning not to listen to that person or buy those speakers. Speakers are good or bad. They are not for a specific type of music.:cool:
While I agree with this for the most part, surely you'd agree that some speakers are better suited than others for certain types of music. For example, I doubt a pair of Maggie 1.6's would handle hip-hop as well as a pair of Paradigm Studio 100's.

BOT:

PhiX,
I have B&W's and they do just fine with rock. They aren't the most bass heavy, so if you like a lot of hip-hop/rap, you might be better off with some Polk's, which aren't as controlled but have a bit of a mid-bass hump that lends itself well to that type of music. Paradigm, Energy, and Wharfedale also make speakers worthy of audition.

Hope this helps.

Woochifer
06-06-2006, 06:21 PM
If any one or any manufacturer tells you their speaker is designed for a particular type of musi you should take that as a warning not to listen to that person or buy those speakers. Speakers are good or bad. They are not for a specific type of music.:cool:

While I agree on principle that speakers should aim towards a more accurate and neutral sound, the reality is that music itself is very often purposed towards a specific type of sound and a specific type of playback chain. Since there's no such thing as a perfect speaker, the choice and preference often comes down to which compromises are tolerable for the type of listening that you will do through those speakers.

For example, vintage JBLs have a very specific sound signature and are not especially accurate. However, a very large cross-section of pop/rock music from the 70s was mixed and monitored using JBL studio monitors. It's no coincidence that a lot of that music sounds great when played through vintage JBLs (or similarly bombastic speakers from other manufacturers during that era) and less-than-stellar when played on a more neutral sounding speaker. Conversely, other music that might sound optimal when played through a more neutral sounding speaker can sound horrible when played on the JBLs.

More recently, a lot of music has been mixed and monitored using studio monitors such as the Yamaha NS-10 that do not exhibit a neutral sound, but do a great job at emulating how a track will sound when played through car audio, mini system, sub/sat, or small desktop speakers. Given that the general market has moved towards those types of systems rather than for example the big squatty floorstanders of yesteryear, the recording engineer is simply optimizing the sound around the systems that the music will likeliest be played through.

When evaluating higher performance speakers, it's important to note how they handle material that was not optimized for higher resolution system to begin with, if those types of recordings represent a large chunk of your listening. I'll agree that there are good speakers and bad speakers, but not every "good" speaker will be at its best with all types of music/recordings.

superpanavision70mm
06-06-2006, 06:52 PM
The PSB Alpha T is about $329 and I have heard from those that like Hip-Hop that they produce great results...of course it also depends on the other components being used, but you might want to give them a try while you are searching.

JoeE SP9
06-06-2006, 07:20 PM
Woochifer and topspeed I suppose you both have a point but It would seem to me that the most neutral speaker would sound the best on the widest variety of music. I realize that this means that sometimes things won't sound as good as on a specific colored speaker but neutral should sound better on the widest possible variety of music.:cool:

musicman1999
06-06-2006, 07:29 PM
B&W make decent sounding well made speakers that should be fine for your type of music.Bookshelves wont have much bass however,so you may want to invest in a sub.I auditioned some 602v3's when i was buying speakers 3 years ago,they were not what i was looking for,but they sounded good.

bill

wgriel
06-07-2006, 09:50 AM
Hey PHiX,

I think you'll do fine with B&W's. I own a couple of models in the 600 series (600 S3 & 603 S3 floorstanders) and they will do justice to just about any music style.

Having said that, I did notice that for rock music, I preferred Paradigm Studios by a slight margin while the B&Ws did more for me with jazz and blues, which is what I listen to 90% of the time. But I do put on some rock from time to time (mostly older blues inspired classic rock like Led Zeppelin or Cream) and they are fine for this, maybe not quite as "punchy" as the Paradigms, but still enjoyable to listen to.

Bill

BillyB
06-25-2006, 06:06 PM
Hi Phix.At your price point the entry level B&W's should be a good fit for your needs.B&W's higher end speakers are very revealing and not always the best choice when playing rock which typically isn't always recorded and mastered all that well.My B&W 703's have this problem and I'm replacing them for this reason.They would be much better suited for classical or Jazz listening.The rougher sounding rock and pop CD's I listen too only sound worse on the 703's especially the vocals which tend to be too out front and edgy.My mistake and a costly one.Fortunately at your price range it's a much lower degree of risk but I certainly understand you doing your homework to avoid a bad choice.Good luck with your speaker hunting.

RGA
06-26-2006, 05:36 AM
Hi guys,

Since I've been asking around about most components already, I will also try to get some info about speakers which I should be buying. The brand I had in mind as a quality brand is B&W, so I was planning to invest in 2 of those for my music listening. However, I read that B&W is mostly targeted at classical music, which is not really my thing. Mostly I listen to energetic heavier rock music or relatively tame metal and hiphop as well... now I'm wondering, would B&W be a good decision for me to begin with? Are there any brands that would be better for me to look into considering my (lack of? :D) musical taste? I really like my music to sound clear and warm, but it should be able to pack some punch as well.

Any advice would be appreciated!

Don't go by brand or what they claim to be geared to. Certainly I agree with Topspeed and Woochifer. While I agree that speakers should play well all music it is presented and great systems will pull the, albeit incredibly subjective, musicallity out of any recording good or bad, it really does come down to the fact that you have to consider what it is being used for. Some speakers simply do sound better with certain music -- I like all music of all genres -- hell I hated Rap but after listening to some Tupac he was really beginning to grow on me.

What you need to try and do is be patient on all of this -- the advertising on the side of a bus B&W's of the world do offer quality stuff - been there done that. You need to spend a considerable amount of time listening to all kinds of different approaches -- take the JBL that Woochifer noted -- there is a HUGE following of such vintage speakers -- High efficiency forums where people rave about old Altecs and Klipsch -- planar forums, etc. It;s one thing to be on the hunt for accuracy and it is another to be on the hunt for omething that actually makes you excited to listen to it. They can converge but not necessarily. Owning something that others deem accurate is one thing -- but is that more important that owning something that you actually want to listen to your music on. I could go out tomorrow very easily with my credit cards and Drop $20,000.00+US on speakers alone that engineers would deem as "highly accurate" but having heard many such set-ups the question is would I like to listen to music on them?

Do you want B&W speakers because well they are B&W speakers and their is a mystique about it all -- or do you want them because they truly impressed you to your soul with the way they reproduced music?

I can offer suggestions on Rock that would start with Klipsch -- not because they're the best things necessarily for rock -- but horns like them typically have a superior dynamic presentation -- some people find many horns insufferably bright -- but not all are like that and many just love the impact they offer up. SO not necessarily Klipshc but the high efficiency dynamic speakers that are not all that common anymore may be up your ally.

Try and ignore the magazines and the names -- try and find an "honest" dealer who actually does like what he says he likes. They may be able to steer you to a something you'll like better than B&W, something cheaper than B&W, but something that is probably less of a looker and less of an "impress your friends with the name brand" gear. Then again you may absolutely be blown away by the B&W's. The mor eyou listen to the more you will be able to get a sense of what is truly getting it right for you. This is why there is no one company and no one design belief.:5:

Florian
06-26-2006, 05:49 AM
If any one or any manufacturer tells you their speaker is designed for a particular type of musi you should take that as a warning not to listen to that person or buy those speakers. Speakers are good or bad. They are not for a specific type of music.:cool:
So true, the ultimate music system has no character and no sonic signature of its own. And if recordings are made to sound good on only B&W speakers or only Paradigm speakers then the music is not "True" enough to be played on my system. And a "orchestra" and classiscal music needs dynamic power, unlimited resolution under the most powerfull dynamic contrasts, with no different driver signature, the same large wave launches as the real instruments and no restriction on the radiation pattern in my opinion.

-Flo

RGA
06-26-2006, 06:24 AM
So true, the ultimate music system has no character and no sonic signature of its own. And if recordings are made to sound good on only B&W speakers or only Paradigm speakers then the music is not "True" enough to be played on my system. And a "orchestra" and classiscal music needs dynamic power, unlimited resolution under the most powerfull dynamic contrasts, with no different driver signature, the same large wave launches as the real instruments and no restriction on the radiation pattern in my opinion.

-Flo


I understand where you're going with that but umm just rememebr that 99.999999999% of all recordings in the history of music reproduction and recording were all done on BOXED loudspeakers -- terms like speakers having "no sonic character" are purely theoretical beliefs which hold no basis of fact in the real world of music reproduction.

JoeE SP9
06-26-2006, 07:00 AM
I understand where you're going with that but umm just rememebr that 99.999999999% of all recordings in the history of music reproduction and recording were all done on BOXED loudspeakers -- terms like speakers having "no sonic character" are purely theoretical beliefs which hold no basis of fact in the real world of music reproduction.
None of what you say changes the fact that the most neutral system (speakers and electronics) will sound the best on the widest variety of music. I fully realize that this means a certain amount of recordings will not sound all that good. The more neutral the system the more recordings that will sound good. In any case it all comes down to personal taste. That's why I always say "The ears decide".:cool:

Florian
06-26-2006, 11:13 AM
None of what you say changes the fact that the most neutral system (speakers and electronics) will sound the best on the widest variety of music. I fully realize that this means a certain amount of recordings will not sound all that good. The more neutral the system the more recordings that will sound good. In any case it all comes down to personal taste. That's why I always say "The ears decide".:cool:

Exactly! And thats why E-Stat, Joe, PatPong and myself will stick to our spanish doors :-)

JoeE SP9
06-26-2006, 12:11 PM
Exactly! And thats why E-Stat, Joe, PatPong and myself will stick to our spanish doors :-)
That's why I've already got four of those "spanish" doors and I'm looking for two more.:ihih:

Florian
06-26-2006, 12:20 PM
That's why I've already got four of those "spanish" doors and I'm looking for two more.:ihih:

Are we counting moving air area ;-) Hehe, Its awsome to move from my DIVA room to go upstairs and to hear the Caliper and small Maggies in my brothers room.

:-)

PHiX
06-28-2006, 05:28 AM
Thanks guys, now I also have my eye on KEF iQ3 and Dali Concept 2 (which a dealer recommended). I'll go listen to them some day with my own music and compare them to the BW speakers. I also saw some wharfedale diamond 9.2's, but I'm a bit sceptic since they for sale at a typical retailer which sells everything with a power chord and they let me hear them in a huge area with tv's playing in the background. :s

JoeE SP9
06-28-2006, 08:12 AM
Are we counting moving air area ;-) Hehe, Its awsome to move from my DIVA room to go upstairs and to hear the Caliper and small Maggies in my brothers room.

:-)

Is he using all four in a surround system?:cool:

Florian
06-28-2006, 10:02 AM
Is he using all four in a surround system?:cool:

Whats Surround?

JoeE SP9
06-28-2006, 12:31 PM
Whats Surround?

I duno! What's surround you?:ihih:

Florian
06-28-2006, 03:55 PM
I duno! What's surround you?:ihih:

The inner believe that 95% of the human population doesnt have good ears. :yikes:

:15:

JoeE SP9
06-28-2006, 06:02 PM
The inner believe that 95% of the human population doesnt have good ears. :yikes:

:15:

Panel people are the other 5%!:smilewinkgrin:

Florian
06-28-2006, 06:49 PM
Panel people are the other 5%!:smilewinkgrin:

How can you read my mind?

JoeE SP9
06-28-2006, 07:41 PM
How can you read my mind?

It's a panel thing!:lol:

Florian
06-28-2006, 07:47 PM
It's a panel thing!:lol:

:cornut: Now thats a thing! Jedis can read minds too, i think we are the "Panel Jedis" fighting to free the music and to let their spirits soar openly without restrictions.

JoeE SP9
06-29-2006, 07:55 AM
:cornut: Now thats a thing! Jedis can read minds too, i think we are the "Panel Jedis" fighting to free the music and to let their spirits soar openly without restrictions.

Just be careful of the box side. Use the panel Flo, use the panel!:3:

basite
07-01-2006, 10:24 AM
I (my dad) have b&w speakers (dm604 s3 and dm601 s3 + asw600 sub) and they sound really good, only thing is that the 6 series from B&W is quite thin and haves small subs in them (compared to other b&w speakers, and bass is something you'll have to care about in rock music, i'm absolutely not saying that they don't give bass (they give quite alot of it) but it's different bass then in my advents with 12" subs in them (modified, old subs broke).
B&W is really a good choice, but you shlould start with floorstanders and then build the rest of the surround systeml round you, because if you start with stereo bookshelve speakers, you might be a bit dissapointed (because there smaller, and usually don't really have a woofer)

bacchanal
07-10-2006, 08:25 AM
:cornut: Now thats a thing! Jedis can read minds too, i think we are the "Panel Jedis" fighting to free the music and to let their spirits soar openly without restrictions.

Yeah, just don't stand up...unless your panels are 8ft tall :ihih: