Confused and need your help !!!

[perla4u]

Hello Friends,

A newbie here. Though a regular reader, never actively participated in the discussion. Learnt a great deal about things here though. I have been thinkin' about getting a decent HT system for my home and going with the NORM, a good speaker for music is a good one for HT, I have auditioned the following:

Paradigm - Studio 20v3, 100 v3 series & Performance series
B&W - DM602s v3, DM604
And few others (can't recollect)

Initially was considering Bookshelf speakers but after listining to the full range 100's & 604's, I loved the full range sound and the sound stage of these guys and wanted to go for floor standers now. Also, WAF is for floor standers.

When I audiioned B&W's, 602v3 vs. 604, I liked the sound coming from 604's. When I strat reading about the expert reviews and all, most of them praised 602's. Is it true 602's are better than 604s?

But I am really confused as to what to get. Guys at Paradigm told me that B&W's are colored in sound and cannot produce the real music compared to Paradigms. Also, budget is a constraint. Paradigms are lil cheaper compared to B&W's at this range.

Is it true, if I get a Book shelf and go for a SUB, that would make up for the lost bass?

I know I have asked Zillion quetsions but I would really really appreciate if you guys can answer these questions. Also, suggest any changes to my approach.

I live in NW suburbs of Chicago. Do suggest me some good places to audition and Reps to talk to.

THANKS A LOT !!!
-Perla

[Jimmy C]

Hello Friends,

A newbie here. Though a regular reader, never actively participated in the discussion. Learnt a great deal about things here though. I have been thinkin' about getting a decent HT system for my home and going with the NORM, a good speaker for music is a good one for HT, I have auditioned the following:

Paradigm - Studio 20v3, 100 v3 series & Performance series
B&W - DM602s v3, DM604
And few others (can't recollect)

Initially was considering Bookshelf speakers but after listining to the full range 100's & 604's, I loved the full range sound and the sound stage of these guys and wanted to go for floor standers now. Also, WAF is for floor standers.

When I audiioned B&W's, 602v3 vs. 604, I liked the sound coming from 604's. When I strat reading about the expert reviews and all, most of them praised 602's. Is it true 602's are better than 604s?

But I am really confused as to what to get. Guys at Paradigm told me that B&W's are colored in sound and cannot produce the real music compared to Paradigms. Also, budget is a constraint. Paradigms are lil cheaper compared to B&W's at this range.

Is it true, if I get a Book shelf and go for a SUB, that would make up for the lost bass?

I know I have asked Zillion quetsions but I would really really appreciate if you guys can answer these questions. Also, suggest any changes to my approach.

I live in NW suburbs of Chicago. Do suggest me some good places to audition and Reps to talk to.

THANKS A LOT !!!
-Perla

...are colored, you must decide which "coloring" suits you best.

Believe me - the Paradigms have their own sonic signature - not the most neutral transducer on the planet. I have a pair of Studio 60s, and probably should have saved a bit and went with the 40s.

And yeah, the B&Ws are voiced a certain way as well. I don't personally think either is inherently better with all music, but again, that's up to you.

A GOOD sub can indeed set-up a musical foundation that most stand-mounts (and even some floorstanders) won't be able to swing... the "thing" is being able to integrate the three pieces (and your listening room) properly. I have stand-mounts and a REL "sub bass system" which I feel works very well. No, I'm not gonna scare away the 2K watt, 18" woofer Rap car crowd, but overall sounds pretty "right" to me.

Another sub note... REL feels that a true subwoofer should come up from w-a-y below, and simply meet the satellites. In other words, only use the sub for the lowest frequencies that the mains simply can not do. IMO, once one gets into higher x-overs, the results are less desireable.

Sorry - can't recommend any audio dealers... a few good ones shouldn't be too hard to find in the "Windy City". I just did a cursory check in the back of S'Phile - you have essentialaudio.com that looks interesting! I'm sure you can find more.

Wow... it has already been almost 30 years since I've been to Naperville... close?

Listen to all gear that you can, get an idea whatcha like. Then, unfortunately, do what the checkbook says you like.

[Jim Clark]

Man you've got to have a zillion or something audio dealers in the Chicago area. I've got 6 in the KC area and I've got to think that Chicago can easily trump that.

I am not going to tell you that I'm any sort of expert but there are a couple of things to consider. If you're going to be using these speakers for music and movies odds are very good that you'll be using a sub for movies, or at least you should. Whether or not that will influence your decision only you can decide. I have my system set so that I only use the sub for movies and still use full range speakers for music. I too like the full range speaker.

I actually kind of like the Paradigms. I don't want them, but I do respect them. B&W has never been a favorite of mine going back to my first audition. I had this sneaking suspicion that I should like them if I had any aspirations of becoming an audiophile. 13 years later I still don't like them. Millions do however.

If you were to focus on floorstanders I'd suggest you listen to everything you can but strongly suggest you find a way to listen to:

Von Schweikert VR-2's
Dynaudio 72's or Focus 220
Revel F-30
And just for fun and to make everyone happy, a speaker like the Magneplan 1.2. Who knows you might like them over all other more traditional designs.

Those are just my tastes though. It would be interesting for you to trudge through Chicago and report back with your findings and tell us what you finally decided. I do hope though that you expand your search and find something memorable enough to at least remember the model.

Regards,
jc

[perla4u]

Actually...I did hear Ravel floor standers at the same place I auditioned Paradigms. For me Ravels sounded too boomy.

[topspeed]

When I audiioned B&W's, 602v3 vs. 604, I liked the sound coming from 604's. When I strat reading about the expert reviews and all, most of them praised 602's. Is it true 602's are better than 604s?Of course not. Whatever you think is far more important than some unknown reviewer. If the 602 was undeniably better than the 604, B&W wouldn't make the 604, would they? Take them both home and see which sounds best in your room. If you're a lurker, you know we talk about room interaction quite a bit here. Bottom line, the only opinion that matters is your own.


Guys at Paradigm told me that B&W's are colored in sound and cannot produce the real music compared to Paradigms. Also, budget is a constraint. Paradigms are lil cheaper compared to B&W's at this range. Umm, that's called "marketing" my friend. Like Jimmy said, every speaker is colored or, more appropriately "voiced," to that manufacturer's specific ideas of what a speaker should sound like. Your job is to find the one that best fits your ideas of reality. Speakers are the most subjective part of the audio chain. After all, if we all heard the same, we'd all buy Bose ;).

As for the price difference, don't forget that the Studio's are vinyl wrapped while the B&W's are solid wood veneers. If this doesn't matter to you or your wife, don't worry about it. I can say though that B&W's woodwork is furniture grade and it's one of the primary reasons their speakers enjoy some of the highest residuals in audio.


Is it true, if I get a Book shelf and go for a SUB, that would make up for the lost bass?Sorta. Like others noted, you can't just buy a sub and plop it down in the room. Integrating it into the system is the key. A fair amount of care, understanding, and probably an equalizer will go a long way to properly integrating a sub. Do a search here for Richard Greene and read his thread on standing waves and room nodes/modes. Mandatory reading for anyone considering a sub.

Now then, for HT a sub is mandatory so you'd better plan on getting one anyway. However, like JC even though we both use subs (for HT at any rate), I too prefer full range speakers for my mains because I like as much of my music to come from the same source point as possible. Your tastes and budget will determine what's best for you.

I think you're doing a great job getting started. My advice is to audition as many speakers as possible until you find the one that you think is best. Bring along you own music or better still, find a dealer that allows in-home auditions. This is ideal because you'll have an opportunity to see which ones interact with your room the best. You may find that what sounds great at the dealer may sound horrid in your room, and vice versa. If you'd like some more recommendations, do a search here for my Best Bang for The Buck thread where we all listed our favorite speakers for under $2K/pair. You'll find a veritable cornucopia of choices.

Hope this helps.

[pkats]

perla, I realize this is a pretty old thread but was wondering if you found your speakers. I have been searching and auditioning in the Chicago area for a while now and have a long list of audio and HT stores. If you (or anyone else in the area) would like info just let me know, there are quite a few.

[Rock789]

old thread...
but found these places doing a search for Focal JM Lab

High Fidelity A/V (Perfect Sound)

19S. Wabash Ave 5th Floor (1 kms)
Chicago, IL

60603

tel: &nbsp312-201-0403

Integrated Control Experts Inc

872 N. Franklin St. (2 kms)
Chicago, IL

60610

tel: &nbsp312-229-1280

www.icx-inc.com

Sound Specialists

1661 N. Elston Ave. (4 kms)
Chicago, IL

60622

tel: &nbsp773-278-1650

http://www.soundspecialists.com