DLP HD Projectors less than $2k???????? [Archive] - Audio & Video Forums

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robert393
01-12-2006, 05:56 PM
Here is an excerpt. You can read the entire artilcle here (http://www.projectorcentral.com/ces_2006.htm)
Sharp gave a great demonstration of their new Z20000 1080p model. They showed it with three different sources--a pristine 1080p source, Blu-ray 1080i DVD, and conventional 480i component video. Three distinct levels of image quality were obvious. The 1080p source was exquisite, and showed the true potential of the projector. Blu-ray DVD looked very good, but it was clearly a step down. It is definitely better than standard DVD, but it falls short of the best possible high resolution sources. The image quality with Blu-ray on this particular 1080p projector was not much different than that which is available on the better 720p projectors on the market today.

It will be interesting to see how consumers respond to what is shaping up to be an enormous price gap between 720p and 1080p. For example, the newly announced Optoma HD72 (1280x768), is a DLP projector rated a 1300 ANSI lumens and 5000:1 contrast. It features the new BrilliantColor technology from TI, and it will sell at street prices of just $2,000 this spring. Will typical broadcast HDTV look noticeably more "high-def" on a $20,000 1080p projector than it will on this $2,000 unit? Probably not. In fact it is possible that the HDTV 720p broadcasts from ABC, Fox, and ESPN (which constitute the vast majority of HD sports programming) will look a bit clearer and sharper on the HD72 due to display of the signal in native format. Certainly standard television and current DVD formats will not look much better on 1080p displays than they already do on 720p.

This is very exciting news for those wanting to enter the age of HD! Imagine an pristine HD image of 100" for less than $2k!

Robert

GMichael
01-12-2006, 07:31 PM
Here is an excerpt. You can read the entire artilcle here (http://www.projectorcentral.com/ces_2006.htm)
Sharp gave a great demonstration of their new Z20000 1080p model. They showed it with three different sources--a pristine 1080p source, Blu-ray 1080i DVD, and conventional 480i component video. Three distinct levels of image quality were obvious. The 1080p source was exquisite, and showed the true potential of the projector. Blu-ray DVD looked very good, but it was clearly a step down. It is definitely better than standard DVD, but it falls short of the best possible high resolution sources. The image quality with Blu-ray on this particular 1080p projector was not much different than that which is available on the better 720p projectors on the market today.

It will be interesting to see how consumers respond to what is shaping up to be an enormous price gap between 720p and 1080p. For example, the newly announced Optoma HD72 (1280x768), is a DLP projector rated a 1300 ANSI lumens and 5000:1 contrast. It features the new BrilliantColor technology from TI, and it will sell at street prices of just $2,000 this spring. Will typical broadcast HDTV look noticeably more "high-def" on a $20,000 1080p projector than it will on this $2,000 unit? Probably not. In fact it is possible that the HDTV 720p broadcasts from ABC, Fox, and ESPN (which constitute the vast majority of HD sports programming) will look a bit clearer and sharper on the HD72 due to display of the signal in native format. Certainly standard television and current DVD formats will not look much better on 1080p displays than they already do on 720p.

This is very exciting news for those wanting to enter the age of HD! Imagine an pristine HD image of 100" for less than $2k!

Robert

It was a matter of time after Mitzu put out their $3k DLP a couple of months ago. The LCD's have gotten so good that the DLP's had to come down to compete.

dean_martin
01-13-2006, 06:35 AM
It was a matter of time after Mitzu put out their $3k DLP a couple of months ago. The LCD's have gotten so good that the DLP's had to come down to compete.

I saw a demonstration of Mitsubishi's $3K DLP projector yesterday. I was impressed. Last time I was in this particular shop, they were displaying a $14K Marantz projector. The store mgr. claimed the Mitsu performed at least at 90% of the much more expensive Marantz. The Mitsu DLP sets were impressive too.

GMichael
01-13-2006, 07:01 AM
I saw a demonstration of Mitsubishi's $3K DLP projector yesterday. I was impressed. Last time I was in this particular shop, they were displaying a $14K Marantz projector. The store mgr. claimed the Mitsu performed at least at 90% of the much more expensive Marantz. The Mitsu DLP sets were impressive too.

Great. DLP's are coming down. Soon 1080p will have to come down to compete in the market. Well, maybe not soon enough for this year, but not far off.

Next, will Sanyo and Panasonic come out with huge improvements to their LCD's again this year? I'm glad that I've waited to buy my projector. I came close a couple of weeks ago when the Sanyo Z4 dropped to 1799.00.

My house should be done this summer. I wonder what will be the best deal at that time. The anticipation is killing me.

westcott
01-13-2006, 11:03 AM
Great. DLP's are coming down. Soon 1080p will have to come down to compete in the market. Well, maybe not soon enough for this year, but not far off.

Next, will Sanyo and Panasonic come out with huge improvements to their LCD's again this year? I'm glad that I've waited to buy my projector. I came close a couple of weeks ago when the Sanyo Z4 dropped to 1799.00.

My house should be done this summer. I wonder what will be the best deal at that time. The anticipation is killing me.


GMichael,

That Evan Marshall is something. He calls it as it is. It can be expensive to be an early adopter of technology. Makes me happy to know my projector will provide good service over the next few coming years.

I feel for you. Having to wait this all out until the house is finished would be brutal. Who knows, Cannons SED technology may be affordable by then.

Good Luck and post some pictures.

GMichael
01-13-2006, 12:23 PM
GMichael,

That Evan Marshall is something. He calls it as it is. It can be expensive to be an early adopter of technology. Makes me happy to know my projector will provide good service over the next few coming years.

I feel for you. Having to wait this all out until the house is finished would be brutal. Who knows, Cannons SED technology may be affordable by then.

Good Luck and post some pictures.

Thanks,

It may be tough now, but I'll get that much of a better deal when the time comes. (I hope)
I'm sure I'll be happy with whatever I get for awhile. Even the Z3 would be great. 720p is nothing to sneeze at. I have to balance my desire for the best, with my need to get one for the bedroom too, and the house budget divided by the technology of the time. Huh? What the H.ll did I just say? Hoping to get the Z3 for the bedroom. Wanted the Z4 for the living room but may upgrade before I buy it to whatever is new, best & priced right.

I've already started thinking about where I'll stand when I take the pictures. It would be nice if they cleared the lot this week.

Keith from Canada
01-23-2006, 07:09 AM
Thanks,

It may be tough now, but I'll get that much of a better deal when the time comes. (I hope)
I'm sure I'll be happy with whatever I get for awhile. Even the Z3 would be great. 720p is nothing to sneeze at. I have to balance my desire for the best, with my need to get one for the bedroom too, and the house budget divided by the technology of the time. Huh? What the H.ll did I just say? Hoping to get the Z3 for the bedroom. Wanted the Z4 for the living room but may upgrade before I buy it to whatever is new, best & priced right.

I've already started thinking about where I'll stand when I take the pictures. It would be nice if they cleared the lot this week.

I've personally got my heart set on the Panny AE900. I've seen the more expensive DLP's and compared them to the older Panny AE700 and the differences in a light controlled environment were minimal IMO. Now that the 900 (and the Z4) have improved their auto-iris to improve black-levels that much more, I cannot imagine spending a penny more to get a DLP. The biggest strength of LCD is the color reproduction and it's only real weakness was black-level (and screen door effect but that too is minimized). Now that the black-level is improved, I think LCD has made the 'gap' between the two technologies a thing of the past.

FYI -- I'm in the process of finishing my basement for my HT room and I plan on buying a projector in the fall. I figure the Panny 900 and the Z4 should be at an even better price point by then!

westcott
01-24-2006, 10:02 AM
I've personally got my heart set on the Panny AE900. I've seen the more expensive DLP's and compared them to the older Panny AE700 and the differences in a light controlled environment were minimal IMO. Now that the 900 (and the Z4) have improved their auto-iris to improve black-levels that much more, I cannot imagine spending a penny more to get a DLP. The biggest strength of LCD is the color reproduction and it's only real weakness was black-level (and screen door effect but that too is minimized). Now that the black-level is improved, I think LCD has made the 'gap' between the two technologies a thing of the past.

FYI -- I'm in the process of finishing my basement for my HT room and I plan on buying a projector in the fall. I figure the Panny 900 and the Z4 should be at an even better price point by then!

I think that the Panny is a great buy. I have the older 700u and the picture quality and image size makes all of my friends with rear projection systems or flat panels drool. Then, when you tell them the price, they nearly cry! Compared to what they paid for a smaller screen with less than ideal viewing angles, they spend a lot of weekends at my house during football season.

Keith from Canada
01-24-2006, 10:19 AM
I think that the Panny is a great buy. I have the older 700u and the picture quality and image size makes all of my friends with rear projection systems or flat panels drool. Then, when you tell them the price, they nearly cry! Compared to what they paid for a smaller screen with less than ideal viewing angles, they spend a lot of weekends at my house during football season.

Hey Westcott.

Just wondering what type of screen you're running the Panny on? I'm initially planning to just do a painted wall in either ultra pure white or perhaps a DIY color like Behr Silverscreen. Once that's up and running, I plan on getting swatches from Da-Lite and Carada and checking out their High Contrast Cinema Vision and white screens. I'll then get the screen material and build my own frame.

Let me know if you have a different screen that you'd recommend.

westcott
01-24-2006, 02:53 PM
Hey Westcott.

Just wondering what type of screen you're running the Panny on? I'm initially planning to just do a painted wall in either ultra pure white or perhaps a DIY color like Behr Silverscreen. Once that's up and running, I plan on getting swatches from Da-Lite and Carada and checking out their High Contrast Cinema Vision and white screens. I'll then get the screen material and build my own frame.

Let me know if you have a different screen that you'd recommend.

Dear Keith,

I started out with a painted rectangle on my wall before the remodeling of the family room.

I considered some electric, tensioned screens but after some serious salesmanship, I convinced my wife that a fixed screen would provide the best long term solution. I looked at several screens and picked the Carada Criterion Brilliant White screen with 100" diagonal. It was the best price\quality ratio I could find. This material was thicker and also helped improve the brightness (1.4 gain) of the screen long term.

You will be tempted to go with a larger screen like 120"+ and these projectors will provide a great picture at these sizes but I urge you to resist the temptation.

Any lamp is going to drop in brightness over time and reduce picture quality. Keeping the screen a little smaller will provide a better picture for a longer period of time and extend the usefullness of these relatively expensive lamps.

Good Luck and post links to pictures when you have it all set up.

Keith from Canada
01-25-2006, 05:48 AM
Dear Keith,

I started out with a painted rectangle on my wall before the remodeling of the family room.

I considered some electric, tensioned screens but after some serious salesmanship, I convinced my wife that a fixed screen would provide the best long term solution. I looked at several screens and picked the Carada Criterion Brilliant White screen with 100" diagonal. It was the best price\quality ratio I could find. This material was thicker and also helped improve the brightness (1.4 gain) of the screen long term.

You will be tempted to go with a larger screen like 120"+ and these projectors will provide a great picture at these sizes but I urge you to resist the temptation.

Any lamp is going to drop in brightness over time and reduce picture quality. Keeping the screen a little smaller will provide a better picture for a longer period of time and extend the usefullness of these relatively expensive lamps.

Good Luck and post links to pictures when you have it all set up.

No worries...the wall that I have to work with will allow for a 110" screen max and I'm leaning towards a 106". I was originally planning to go with a grey screen due to some ambient light during the day but I keep running into awesome screen shots from people using a white screen with some moderate gain. How do you find the black levels on the white screen?

I figure it will be trial and error and swatch ordering from the various companies that determines what screen I'll end up with. First things first though...gotta get cracking on that basement!

westcott
01-25-2006, 06:53 AM
[QUOTE=Keith from Canada]No worries...the wall that I have to work with will allow for a 110" screen max and I'm leaning towards a 106". I was originally planning to go with a grey screen due to some ambient light during the day but I keep running into awesome screen shots from people using a white screen with some moderate gain. How do you find the black levels on the white screen?
=QUOTE]

If you have never owned a front projector, you will be more than happy with the picture quality and black levels. The 900u is supposed to have an even better black level so all I would worry about is where you are going to get your jaw wired shut. :D

Light control can be an issue but quality curtains will make the biggest difference.

You can see photos of my home theater in the gallery under "His and Her Room". My whole left wall was almost all windows up to the 18' ceilings. It did consume a great deal of my budget but it made my wife happy and I hope it will reduce my cooling costs during the summer.

Keep us posted!!!

Keith from Canada
01-26-2006, 08:15 AM
[QUOTE=Keith from Canada]No worries...the wall that I have to work with will allow for a 110" screen max and I'm leaning towards a 106". I was originally planning to go with a grey screen due to some ambient light during the day but I keep running into awesome screen shots from people using a white screen with some moderate gain. How do you find the black levels on the white screen?
=QUOTE]

If you have never owned a front projector, you will be more than happy with the picture quality and black levels. The 900u is supposed to have an even better black level so all I would worry about is where you are going to get your jaw wired shut. :D

Light control can be an issue but quality curtains will make the biggest difference.

You can see photos of my home theater in the gallery under "His and Her Room". My whole left wall was almost all windows up to the 18' ceilings. It did consume a great deal of my budget but it made my wife happy and I hope it will reduce my cooling costs during the summer.

Keep us posted!!!

Thanks Westcott...or should I call you Brad and Ellen? Funny, I had seen your HT set-up on ProjectorCentral's site months ago. I see what you mean about ambient light and the need for curtains...wow!

BTW -- My HT basement will be similar to Jawahar Konduru's (also on the ProjectorCentral site). It will be a little bigger and certainly won't be pained the same colour (!) but the layout will be similar.

westcott
01-26-2006, 08:25 AM
Thanks Westcott...or should I call you Brad and Ellen? Funny, I had seen your HT set-up on ProjectorCentral's site months ago. I see what you mean about ambient light and the need for curtains...wow!

BTW -- My HT basement will be similar to Jawahar Konduru's (also on the ProjectorCentral site). It will be a little bigger and certainly won't be pained the same colour (!) but the layout will be similar.

It pleases me that our HT struck your attention and thanks for the kind words.

My wife and I struggled with colors too but flourescent yellow was not one of our considerations either :D We tried several but did not finalize until the fabrics for the furniture were selected (the first fabric we chose was discontinued and if you have been through this process, several hours were wasted only to have to go through it again. Originally we were leaning towards a Sage\Dark Green theme)

Bose does have one thing right, you only get half the experience without good sound!

What sound system are you using\considering for this remodel?

Your link is busted.

Keith from Canada
01-26-2006, 09:29 AM
It pleases me that our HT struck your attention and thanks for the kind words.

My wife and I struggled with colors too but flourescent yellow was not one of our considerations either :D We tried several but did not finalize until the fabrics for the furniture were selected (the first fabric we chose was discontinued and if you have been through this process, several hours were wasted only to have to go through it again. Originally we were leaning towards a Sage\Dark Green theme)

Bose does have one thing right, you only get half the experience without good sound!

What sound system are you using\considering for this remodel?

Your link is busted.

The audio portion of my HT consists of:

Denon AVR-3300 (5.1 is good enough...for now at least)
PSB 800i Century mains (I've heard very few speakers that I liked better at any price-point)
PSB 200C center channel
PSB Alpha rears
Adire Rava 12" DIY sealed sub (great for music but needs more punch for HT...I will be porting it soon)
Panasonic RP-56 DVD player

FUTURE -- My mains are getting up there in age and I'll likely be replacing them in the next few years :(. Right now, I'm partial to the Paradigm line mainly because a) they're Canadian -- which simply means they can be had for very good prices in Canada and b) PSB's (my old favorite) have switched over to a titanium tweeter which I cannot stand! Perhaps I'll be swayed into the PSB Stratus line which keeps the higher build quality that I am enjoying with my 800's.

That being said, I figure I'll do some serious auditioning with others before I jump into the deep sea of speakers again. I've always found that nothing is more personal a choice as speaker selection...everyone has a different ear.

I see that you have opted for the Klipsch line. I've always liked Klipsch for HT and I'll definitely be giving them a listen when I start auditioning again. I figure I'll MUCH prefer the horn to the titanium tweeter design! The RF-7 package is a little much for my needs although I can certainly see how it would fill a room with 18 foot ceilings! I'll probably opt for the bookshelf or small floorstanding version in the Reference line.

Just a point -- I personally find it very upsetting that speaker companies (including Klipsch and PSB) have taken away their good quality middle-ground products and replaced them with inferior products. Klipsch used to have a great line-up all the way through...the new 'Synergy' line-up simply looks and sound cheap in comparison to what they used to have at that price-point. Gone are the aesthetically pleasing wood cabinets...now consumers get a cheap looking industrial black box.

Gotta love the Bose quote! You only get half the experience without good sound but you only get half the good sound from Bose!!! All the joys of great music minus any discernable midrange!

westcott
01-26-2006, 09:39 AM
The audio portion of my HT consists of:

Denon AVR-3300 (5.1 is good enough...for now at least)
PSB 800i Century mains (I've heard very few speakers that I liked better at any price-point)
PSB 200C center channel
PSB Alpha rears
Adire Rava 12" DIY sealed sub (great for music but needs more punch for HT...I will be porting it soon)
Panasonic RP-56 DVD player

FUTURE -- My mains are getting up there in age and I'll likely be replacing them in the next few years :(. Right now, I'm partial to the Paradigm line mainly because a) they're Canadian -- which simply means they can be had for very good prices in Canada and b) PSB's (my old favorite) have switched over to a titanium tweeter which I cannot stand! Perhaps I'll be swayed into the PSB Stratus line which keeps the higher build quality that I am enjoying with my 800's.

That being said, I figure I'll do some serious auditioning with others before I jump into the deep sea of speakers again. I've always found that nothing is more personal a choice as speaker selection...everyone has a different ear.

I see that you have opted for the Klipsch line. I've always liked Klipsch for HT and I'll definitely be giving them a listen when I start auditioning again. I figure I'll MUCH prefer the horn to the titanium tweeter design! The RF-7 package is a little much for my needs although I can certainly see how it would fill a room with 18 foot ceilings! I'll probably opt for the bookshelf or small floorstanding version in the Reference line.

Just a point -- I personally find it very upsetting that speaker companies (including Klipsch and PSB) have taken away their good quality middle-ground products and replaced them with inferior products. Klipsch used to have a great line-up all the way through...the new 'Synergy' line-up simply looks and sound cheap in comparison to what they used to have at that price-point. Gone are the aesthetically pleasing wood cabinets...now consumers get a cheap looking industrial black box.

Gotta love the Bose quote! You only get half the experience without good sound but you only get half the good sound from Bose!!! All the joys of great music minus any discernable midrange!

Have you considered Bryston?
My friend is from Canada and I have heard his. Very Impressive and a design I am very partial to. Not sure what they go for but I am sure they are cheaper for you than us. Can you give us an update?