The best projection screens are made of .....

[GMichael]

I have been looking at projection screens these days. There seems to be plenty to choose from.

Silver matte
Video spectra
High contrast matte white
Glass beaded
Grey
etc....

Does anyone know which are good for what? I am pretty much decided on the Sanyo Z4 projector. It will be going into a living room, not a dedicated HT room so the lighting will not be completely controlled. The room is 14' by 26' but there is only half a wall leading to the kitchen dinning room combo. The screen will go against the 14' wall on the west end of the room. The half wall is to the north and will only come out about 6'. After that there will be a counter between the living room & the kitchen for another 6'. The rest is open to the dinning room. The south wall will run the full 26' but has a bay window and will include the front door at the far end. The east wall will be a full wall with nothing there except the rear speakers. The window and door will have black out curtains. But the room will still open up into the dining room & kitchen. Maybe another blackout curtain there down the road. The projector will be mounted about 12' from the screen and seating will be about 18-20' back.

I was looking into screen but jeez, they cost as much as the projector. Thought I'd go cheap and get one fixed to the wall. Not so cheap, $1k+. Found that manual pull down screens are available in the 125" size at around $300. Not bad but they say they are for classrooms even though they are 16:9? Are these any good? Even remote controlled electric screens are cheaper than the ones fixed to the wall. What's up with that? Saw on EBay that I can buy the screen material and make my own frame for about $150 total. Not sure what material is best for me.

Who's got the scoop?

[robert393]

Glad to see you have decided to make the jump into front projection GM. Here (http://www.projectorcentral.com/home_theater_screens.htm) is a good starting point to find some of the answers to your questions. I would also suggest you find a reputable dealer in your area and work with him to "fine-tune" your selection. You are right in your assessment that a quality screen can cost more than the projector. But think of it this way, you will be upgrading your projector as technology advances, your "taste" in quality video becomes more refined, and your income rises. But, if you buy a quality screen now, you will not only get a truely good picture now, but you should not have to change the screen later! So, it is a good investment you will enjoy for years to come! Their is much more involved in achieving a quality picture than simply painting a wall with grey paint and projecting onto it. :rolleyes: Although I have seen people "frame" a white bed sheet to the wall too.....and they thought the picture was awesome.. :eek: ..lol!!

Anyway, good luck with your endevor of achieving the very best PQ you can afford. The "trip" there is as much fun as actually being there! :D

Robert

[N. Abstentia]

Don't forget...PAINT! A properly designed painted screen can destroy a mediocre screen any day, and at 1/5 the price.

But if money and space is no object, drop a few grand on a nice screen for sure.

[GMichael]

Don't forget...PAINT! A properly designed painted screen can destroy a mediocre screen any day, and at 1/5 the price.

But if money and space is no object, drop a few grand on a nice screen for sure.

I have been doing a bit of reseach on this. It seems that a lot of people have been using a special paint (not that goo crap) that give them good results. What seems popular is a base of grey paint. Then a mixure of flate white with silver as a top coat. They have also found this company that makes large sheets of plastic perfect for this paint. They are completely flat and weigh only a few pounds. I have found very detailed instructions on another site focused just on projector screens and what is best for them. I still have a lot of reading to do and a few months before I have to decide. I won't do anything until I've gathered as much info as I can first.
I look foward to it, and I already have more questions brewing for another thread or two.

[GMichael]

Glad to see you have decided to make the jump into front projection GM. Here (http://www.projectorcentral.com/home_theater_screens.htm) is a good starting point to find some of the answers to your questions. I would also suggest you find a reputable dealer in your area and work with him to "fine-tune" your selection. You are right in your assessment that a quality screen can cost more than the projector. But think of it this way, you will be upgrading your projector as technology advances, your "taste" in quality video becomes more refined, and your income rises. But, if you buy a quality screen now, you will not only get a truely good picture now, but you should not have to change the screen later! So, it is a good investment you will enjoy for years to come! Their is much more involved in achieving a quality picture than simply painting a wall with grey paint and projecting onto it. :rolleyes: Although I have seen people "frame" a white bed sheet to the wall too.....and they thought the picture was awesome.. :eek: ..lol!!

Anyway, good luck with your endevor of achieving the very best PQ you can afford. The "trip" there is as much fun as actually being there! :D

Robert

Thanks, I haven't looked at your site yet but I will.

[robert393]

GM, if you are wanting a DIY Screen, Here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumdisplay.php?s=&daysprune=&f=110) is another good place to do some research. Seems lots of people are utilizing the $25 grey paint screen as an alternative screen.

Hope that helps........
Robert

[N. Abstentia]

There was a show on Discovery or DIY or one of those channels...forget which one...anyway they were doing a big thing about home theater and they went the paint route in a very high end theater. Seems the paint route has become very popular as people discover how good it works.

[GMichael]

GM, if you are wanting a DIY Screen, Here (http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/forumdisplay.php?s=&daysprune=&f=110) is another good place to do some research. Seems lots of people are utilizing the $25 grey paint screen as an alternative screen.

Hope that helps........
Robert

Thanks, I'll add this to my reading list, which is getting very long. Good thing I have a little time left.

[GMichael]

There was a show on Discovery or DIY or one of those channels...forget which one...anyway they were doing a big thing about home theater and they went the paint route in a very high end theater. Seems the paint route has become very popular as people discover how good it works.

It's because screen manufacturers have been cashing in on the HT movement. A 70" by 70" screen can be had for under $100. But get the same screen in 16:9 and the price jumps to $1000. Somehow I don't think the expense of making a screen in 16:9 is much more. They just know they can get it.
I have found several sites in my search for the "perfect screen" and it seems a lot of people are going the DIY route. I've found more info than I've had time to read. Good thing I have a few months to take it all in.

[N. Abstentia]

Yep, DIY screens seem to be all the rage. Same performance at 1/10th the price!

[edtyct]

N. Ab,

Surely not the same performance in every environment, with every kind of projector? Can you vary screen gain with goo (that has a nice ring to it), not to mention retract or otherwise render the screen inconspicuous when desirable? Paint seems to have its place, but it has its limits, no?

Ed

[GMichael]

Any idea why the permanently fixed screens seem to cost more than even the remote controlled motorized flavor? This seems backwards to me. I was looking into the fixed screens thinking they would save me money only to see prices from 1600 to 4K. I only looked at the retractable type because a friend had shown me a catalog where these were $250 for manual 100" 16:9 HD. I was amazed. Even the electric ones were only $500.

[edtyct]

On a level playing field, fixed screens are cheaper than their retractable counterparts, as would stand to reason. Differences in the price of screens that contradict the rule could stem from their material, their gain properties, their closeout status, reseller volume discounts, or other hidden variables not privy to the likes of us. Other than that, I'm stumped. Who makes these inexpensive screens and what materials do they use?

[robert393]

Any idea why the permanently fixed screens seem to cost more than even the remote controlled motorized flavor? This seems backwards to me. I was looking into the fixed screens thinking they would save me money only to see prices from 1600 to 4K. I only looked at the retractable type because a friend had shown me a catalog where these were $250 for manual 100" 16:9 HD. I was amazed. Even the electric ones were only $500.
TMK a Permanently fixed screen provides the smoothest, most stable surface available, and therefore is the most desirable when upscale/"high-end" projection is required.. They are stretched tight, the edges are fixed, and are stable, with less tendance for hot-spots. Take a look at any up-scale Movie Theater and see what they have in place. The screen is a permanently fixed screen.
Therefore they can demand the premium dollars. It is not "cheap" to do it right.

Robert

[GMichael]

On a level playing field, fixed screens are cheaper than their retractable counterparts, as would stand to reason. Differences in the price of screens that contradict the rule could stem from their material, their gain properties, their closeout status, reseller volume discounts, or other hidden variables not privy to the likes of us. Other than that, I'm stumped. Who makes these inexpensive screens and what materials do they use?

Da-lite for one. I have seen others. I checked B&H Photo and found the same strange results.

[GMichael]

It is not "cheap" to do it right.

Robert

Very true. But I just don't have that kind of budget right now. I'll have to settle for "almost right" until I can move up to right.

My wish list is full of things that aren't on my can afford list. Let's see:

Parasound Halo proccessor & amps (settled for a Yamaha receiver)
Maggies (Infinity's)
1080p projector (720p Sanyo)
best screen ($500 budget)

[robert393]

.......But I just don't have that kind of budget right now. I'll have to settle for "almost right" until I can move up to right.

My wish list is full of things that aren't on my can afford list. Let's see:

Parasound Halo proccessor & amps (settled for a Yamaha receiver)
Maggies (Infinity's)
1080p projector (720p Sanyo)
best screen ($500 budget)You are on the right track. When I said "To do it right, is not cheap" I meant that in relative terms. I did not mean to imply their is not a point of "diminishing returns", but rather a "balance" has to be made. Like I said GM, getting there is half the fun.....and you are well on your way, and it sounds like you are having a blast getting there. This deal is suppose to be fun!!

Robert

[N. Abstentia]

N. Ab,

Surely not the same performance in every environment, with every kind of projector? Can you vary screen gain with goo (that has a nice ring to it), not to mention retract or otherwise render the screen inconspicuous when desirable? Paint seems to have its place, but it has its limits, no?

Ed

Yes you can vary the gain depending on your paint formula. If you have a painted screen I'm not sure why you'd want to hide it, what else do you want to do with that wall?

[edtyct]

Da-lite has an entry price for a motorized screen at about $500, and for fixed at about $300, at least in some places. But you won't find Stewart entry prices any lower than $1000 +. Draper also offers relatively affordable prices. What you've seen may be a function of the models that a particular catalog carries. You can certainly get high-tension motorized or manually retractable screens. You can pay a lot or you can pay a little for them, depending on your budget and situation. There are a lot of variables involved. To get the most representative range of prices, you have to see a lot of different products.

[GMichael]

You are on the right track. When I said "To do it right, is not cheap" I meant that in relative terms. I did not mean to imply their is not a point of "diminishing returns", but rather a "balance" has to be made. Like I said GM, getting there is half the fun.....and you are well on your way, and it sounds like you are having a blast getting there. This deal is suppose to be fun!!

Robert

So far, so fun. I'm sure I will like what I end up with. I'm funny that way. I may settle, but I usually settle for good instead of best. I won't settle for cheapest. I'd wait before I did that.

But I'll also wish for better and plan to get it.

Thanks for your help.

[GMichael]

Da-lite has an entry price for a motorized screen at about $500, and for fixed at about $300, at least in some places. But you won't find Stewart entry prices any lower than $1000 +. Draper also offers relatively affordable prices. What you've seen may be a function of the models that a particular catalog carries. You can certainly get high-tension motorized or manually retractable screens. You can pay a lot or you can pay a little for them, depending on your budget and situation. There are a lot of variables involved. To get the most representative range of prices, you have to see a lot of different products.

What I was hoping to find was a place I could buy the screen material and buld my own frame. But I didn't know what material would be best. I see a lot of it has to do with placement, lighting, seating and the projector I choose. The material I found for sale started at $6 a sqft and went up to over $30/sqft. It adds up fast for a 125" screen.

The other site I have been viewing is filled with DIY ideas. I just have to filter through them and decide what is worth what.

[GMichael]

Here are what Da-lite suggests as prices for their fixed screens.

http://da-lite.com/products/pricing_pdfs/96.pdf?PHPSESSID=b72dce36d925ddb7ae711eb2802983d7

[edtyct]

N. Ab.,

My point was a stupid way of saying that a retractable screen would allow someone who didn't want to paint a room for movie watching to keep an inopportune artifact out of sight when not needed (I believe that the correct term for how I put it the first time is "duh"). Do they have gain ranges--positive and negative--with paint as well? Do expert reviews appear anywhere online? I wouldn't mind reading them for my own edification.

Ed

[GMichael]

It seems that a lot of people are painting their own screens. The paint of choice is something called Behr Silverscreen from Home Depot. Some people had trouble at HD in getting them to understand what paint was needed. Here is a reply from a guy who works there.

Ok, I'm not sure if you want the formula for silverscreen Behr color or if you are trying to mix something different. For 1 gallon of Behr flat white (Ultra Pure White 1050) to become Silverscreen, the colors Lamp Black, Raw Umber, and Exterior Red are added. This is mixed automatically by the computer at Home Depot. You do not have to buy any silver paint at all. Just ask the associate to mix you a gallon or quart (quart would be more than enough) of Behr Silverscreen (770E-2). I have a sample of this paint and it looks to be the same color as most projector screens.

[westcott]

The projector you have chosen is one of the best in its price range and native resolution.

I would suggest using paint until you can afford a fixed screen.

If you have ambient light, I would suggest a screen gain closer to 1.0.

I did not see the Carada name but they are a little less expensive than Da Lite and Stewart but make some comparable products.

Motorized screens are great but are very expensive for a proper one. That would be one that is tensioned. Even so, it will eventually start to wrinkle and wear. A fixed screen really is the way to go when you have the funds. I am confident that once you are up and running, somehow you will find the money to get a screen to replace a painted rectangle on your wall.

Light control can be one of the most expensive hurdles in front projection, especially for those of us who do not have a dedicated HT but share it with a family room or such.

I hope this helps and good luck! It sounds like you are on the right track.

[GMichael]

Thanks Wescott,

I will look into them.

The house is still not built yet. The snow and freezing weather has slowed them down a bit. But I have time to make changes. My first concern was to make sure the sound system had a good place to settle in. HT is the next step. I think it will come out well. We're looking into dark colors for this one room and blackout cloth, so lighting should not be a problem.

Thanks again.

[GMichael]

Found a fair deal on a screen. $738.00 for a 106" (92"x52") Fixed Frame Cinema Screen (16x9).
Contrast Screen
Black Velvet Frame
HDTV (16x9) Format
Easy and quick assembly
2 (two) year manufactures warranty

http://www.projectionscreensforless.com/cartgenie/prodInfo.asp?pid=72&cid=2

Deasn't break the bank.

[AVMASTER]

in your first post you mentioned that the projector will be 12' from the screen with seating starting at 18', is that right?
If that's right you'll end up with a 60" diagonal screen and a viewing distance thats way too far back. I suspect you got these numbers backwards. May i suggest the Draper Clarion
tensioned 92" 16:9 screen. With HiDef grey material and black velvet frame, I could put you in it for an even grand, I'll take care of shipping

[GMichael]

in your first post you mentioned that the projector will be 12' from the screen with seating starting at 18', is that right?
If that's right you'll end up with a 60" diagonal screen and a viewing distance thats way too far back. I suspect you got these numbers backwards. May i suggest the Draper Clarion
tensioned 92" 16:9 screen. With HiDef grey material and black velvet frame, I could put you in it for an even grand, I'll take care of shipping

Are you sure of those distanaces? This website says that the Z4 can yield a picture from 60" to 119" from 12 feet away.

http://www.projectorcentral.com/Sanyo-PLV-Z4-projection-calculator-pro.htm

[AVMASTER]

Are you sure of those distanaces? This website says that the Z4 can yield a picture from 60" to 119" from 12 feet away.

http://www.projectorcentral.com/Sanyo-PLV-Z4-projection-calculator-pro.htm
i rechecked my math then went to projector central website and came up with pretty much the same size screen; maybe the Sanyo has a special optic or lens feature that's
not metioned anywhere, i'll try to get a hold of the manual

[N. Abstentia]

At 12' It's actually 60" with no zoom, and 119" with the zoom opened up..which will of course cost you lots of picture quality and you'll have lots of screen door effect.

[JeffreyDurbin]

Peanut butter.

Trust me. :rolleyes:

[GMichael]

At 12' It's actually 60" with no zoom, and 119" with the zoom opened up..which will of course cost you lots of picture quality and you'll have lots of screen door effect.

Won't I get the same effect by moving it farther away?

[N. Abstentia]

I think of it in terms of a zoom lens on a camera (only backwards). The more you open up the lens, the more detail you lose. With a camera it's better to move closer to the subject if possible rather than open up the lens. With a projector you'd want to move it farther back rather than open up the lens.

That's just from my experience, if you hook up the projector and crank up the zoom you can see the grey squares get bigger and bigger but if you move the projector back they do not open up as much. I'm sure somebody else knows the technical reasons here....

[GMichael]

OK, I'll take another look at my plans to see how far back I can move it and still have room for the overhead fan.

Thanks