Buying wilson audio in the USA ?

[skinnyfla]

Hi,
i`m from Germany and thinking about buying a pair of wilson audio (sophia or an older watt/puppy) in the US. Transport to germany is not much of a problem.

I`m looking for a new or used pair, depending on the price.

As i don`t have much of an idea where to look for these speakers i thought, that maybe you could give me some advice on (online) dealers for used and new wilson audio, second hand dealers and reasonable prices for a pair of these in mint condition.

I would be very grateful for any advice or help.

Greetings,
chris

[GMichael]

I don't know who theit online dealers are. Have you tried their website to see who they suggest?
For used, I'd say that Ebay is your best bet.

[topspeed]

I don't think Wilson allows online sales from their retailers. When purchased new, WP7's are set-up for you by a certified Wilson tech, IIRC. For a retailer, check Wilson's website.

For used, your best bet is audiogon.com. There should be plenty for you to choose from. It's a safer place than e-bay as most of the members are either dealers or serious audiophiles that know how to take care of their gear. Still, as with anything purchased online, caveat emptor.

I'm assuming you've listed to Wilson's extensively, which is why you've picked them. Therefore, you should note that the WP's voicing has changed dramatically from one iteration to the next. A lot of reviews I've read considered the WP6 to be very clinical and ruthlessly revealing (to the detriment of musicality). Dave Wilson heard the complaints and addressed them with the 7. I've never heard the 6, but I can unequivocally state the 7 is the finest loudspeaker I've heard so far (a $50k+ front end probably didn't hurt either :p. Synergy, thy name is ARC + Wilson).

If you haven't spent considerable time with the Wilson's, make sure you do before you make the decision. You have a veritable cornucopia of choices available to you at this price point.

Hope this helps.

[bacchanal]

I would recommend saving up and getting the Alexandrias.

...sorry couldn't resist :rolleyes:

[skinnyfla]

I would recommend saving up and getting the Alexandrias.

...sorry couldn't resist :rolleyes:

Not a very useful post :rolleyes:

[skinnyfla]

Hi,
thanx a lot for your answers. Yes, of course i have listened to wilsons, i do not believe that such basics to hifi, as listening to a pair of speakers before you buy them, are different in Germany.
The problem is, that wilson cost about 70% more over here, retail for a pair if Sophia is 21.000 dollars !!!

When talking to my ps audio, metronome dealer, i was told that it would be a good idea to try a pair of von schweikert vr 4 sr IV as an alternative to wilson, which would come a bit cheaper.

Till now i`m feeling comfortable with my B&W Nautilus 803, but von schweikerts or wilsons are another dimension i believe.

If the speakers do not convince me 100 % (price, Quality, sound...) i might even end up going for a pair of N 801, but if there is an affordable way i might just give wilsons or von schweikert a try.

Even if i end up feeling unhappy i could still sell them over here without loosing any money (though this is not my intention).

Greetings,
Chris

[topspeed]

Hi Chris,

I've owned PS Audio products since the mid '80's and am a fan of both B&W and VSA. FWIW, I had the opportunity to spend the day at Albert Von Schweikert's shop near San Diego last year and was able to experience many of his products, including the mighty VR11 (flippin' HUGE!). Therefore, I'm familiar with most of the products you are considering.

The jr's (haven't heard the sr's yet) sound distinctly different from your Nauts. Their dynamics will floor you upon first audition, in particular the depth and slam compared to the "adequate" bass response of the 803's. This is not to say they aren't as accurate, because they are. They are also exceedingly quick. These are toe tappers, as I like to call them. Meaning they don't sacrifice musicality on the alter of the hi-fi gods. Some hi-fi speakers are so ruthlessly revealing that they take all of the fun out of the music. VSA's are admirably transparent and indeed scale upwards with the front end, yet they are more adept at forgiving poor front end choices than the Nauts. Compared to the jr's, the 803's midband is leaner. Understand that I'm not saying one way is right and the other is wrong, merely that the differences are readily apparent. One last thing, no speaker I've heard has the off-axis response of VSA's, in large part because of Albert's patented cross-over. Their sweet spot is enormous and the jr can easily blanket medium to large rooms with balanced sound, despite its diminutive proportions.

*Quick Note: I haven't heard the D series yet, but I understand the voicing is very different from the Nauts. In fact, it sounds like they are more like the VSA's!

I can't compare the Sophias to VSA's as I've never heard them. From my experience with the WP7's, I've yet to hear a speaker that presents as holographic an image and nails the microdynamics like Wilsons. That said, I also wouldn't say the WP7's are worth 5 times(!) the price of the jr's. There are differences for sure, but they are magnified more by the performance of the jr's compared to the Wilson's price point.

What will you be driving them with? Great choices all, can't really go wrong here ;).

[skinnyfla]

Hi there,
thanx again for your post. Von schweikert really seem to be an alternative, in Germany they will be for sale from next year. Might wait and see what the German retail price will be, though, concidering transport, tax, etc it will undoubtably be higher than in the US.

I even think that the von schweikert look better than the wilsons. Can`t believe that they are so unknown on the european market.

Whats a good place in the US to check out von schweikert sales prices or maybe even used models (i believe that the vr 4 sr has been developed for a while and that there are different, older models that might good to).

Otherwise i will probably end up going for the N 801 (love the 380mm (15 in) bass).

I`m not sure what i`ll be driving them with.

I`m concidering going for a Musical Fidelity a 308 pre (have the Poweramp and it`s wonderful) with a Nelson Pass x 150.5. CDP at the time audiomeca obsession II but i just might swap that for a metronome cd2-v.

PS audio are a good choice too. I`ll have to try things out a bit... :)

Greetings,
Chris

[bacchanal]

Sorry I forgot this was an internet message board...back to academic discussion! But isn't that how this board usually works? Everyone's always trying to talk someone into spending several times there original budget.

No, but seriously, you need to check out the VSAs! I do a fair amount of listening to speakers that I can't afford. Okay, so I haven't listened to Wilsons or Florian's beloved Apogees. Anyway, the VR4jrs are probably my favorite speakers in the world at this moment. They aren't enormous, they don't cost a fortune, and they don't sound like speakers. You're looking for a speaker that goes beyond transparency, you want to recreate the recording environment in your listening room. The VR4jrs get about as close to doing this as any speaker I've listened to. It's pretty much impossible to compare different speakers on this level in different rooms and with a fair amount of time between listens, but the VR4jrs (and other VSAs for that matter) left me with a lasting impression. I don't know if they're Wilson Audio good, but they are darn good, and worth a listen! If I had a space worth putting them in, i'd be getting a pair myself.

[skinnyfla]

Hi,
well i checked on prices at audiogon and it seems that 8.000 $ for Wilson Sophia and 6.000 $ von schweikert vr4sr are reasonable prices for a demo pair (or used in good condition). That`s about 5 - 7.000 $ less than over here.
That would make it well worth a try. The problem now is that von schweikerts are not for sale in germany till next year (and then only 2 dealers will have them which are abou 600 km from my place).

As far as i know the wilson sophia has not got the "harshness" mentioend before and goes more in the neutral or even smooth direction, though they use the focal inverse tweeter which is not really known for smooth sound (JmLabs can get very harsh sounding).

I need to find out more about von schweikert !!!

Thanx,

Chris

[topspeed]

Whats a good place in the US to check out von schweikert sales prices or maybe even used models (i believe that the vr 4 sr has been developed for a while and that there are different, older models that might good to).

Check vonschweikert.com for their dealer list. I'd say give Kevin a call but you're on the other side of the planet from their SoCal shop.

The VR4sr is a brand new design. There are actually 3 VR4's: 4jr, 4se Series III, and 4sr. The sr represents the top of the "retail" line. The "custom" line is made up of the 5, 7, 9, and 11se. The entire custom line was redesigned after the 11se and are basically smaller versions of the big daddy. If you can find a pair to audition, the VR4se SIII's are very well regarded. The best part is if you find an used pair, you can send them to VSA and they will upgrade them for a modest cost. I'm considering this option as well. Look under "upgrades" on the website and it will detail the options.


I`m concidering going for a Musical Fidelity a 308 pre (have the Poweramp and it`s wonderful) with a Nelson Pass x 150.5. CDP at the time audiomeca obsession II but i just might swap that for a metronome cd2-v.

PS audio are a good choice too. I`ll have to try things out a bit... :) MF makes really nice stuff and I've always been a big fan of Pass designs (Threshold anyone?).

When you have a chance, audition PS Audio's GCA or, if they have any, HCA2 amplifiers. These are switching amps based on the ICE Power topology, but tweaked by Paul and include built in PSA line conditioners. Both are load invariant, which could come in handy if you go for the 801. VSA's are very easy to drive and won't be as intolerant of amps without enough current and grip like the B&W's. Personally, I love the sound of my HCA2 as it combines the sweetness and body of ARC amps with the depth and slam of Krells. Of course, ymmv.

I'm jealous! That'll be a killer rig when you're through with it!

[Florian]

Where are you located? I am near Augsburg (PLZ 86830)

-Flo