HDCD information

[blairphillips7@yahoo.com]

I am shopping for a new cd player and I have decided on NAD. I cannot decide, however, between the C521 or the more expensive C542 with HDCD capability. I am wondering if HDCD is worth the $200 difference between the two. I have never heard an HDCD disc on a player that decodes it and hope someone can tell me about the difference in sound quality. I have quite a few discs that are HDCD. Should I maybe consider SACD? I have heard that this format is best suited for multi-channel applications however. Will SACD make HDCD technology obsolete?

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

I am shopping for a new cd player and I have decided on NAD. I cannot decide, however, between the C521 or the more expensive C542 with HDCD capability. I am wondering if HDCD is worth the $200 difference between the two. I have never heard an HDCD disc on a player that decodes it and hope someone can tell me about the difference in sound quality. I have quite a few discs that are HDCD. Should I maybe consider SACD? I have heard that this format is best suited for multi-channel applications however. Will SACD make HDCD technology obsolete?

I am going to give you a very simple answer. It is NOT worth the cost. While HDCD has the potential for better audio quality, it is not a $200 improvement unless very subtle improvement is what you are looking for. If better fidelity is what you are looking for, then I would recommend SACD or DVD-A. Since neither of these formats are on their way out I would not advise investing in these either.

Audio formats are at a crossroad right now. SACD will be around again but attached to the Bluray format. DVD-A is a dead format. CD is not a format of high fidelity because of current mastering techniques which push volume over sound quality. HDCD encoding sometimes yields audible improvement, and sometimes not, depending on how well the source was mixed in the first place. It's improvement is no where as profound as SACD or hi rez DVD-A over standard CD. I personally wouldn't pay alot of money for a CD player with the knowledge that most recordings destined for this format are not the best there is. HDCD will not make them sound better if they are compromised in the first place. I would get a all around basic decent quality CD player and wait for the next high end(which will probably be SACD) multichannel format to come out.

[noddin0ff]

Ditto, what TT said.

[Wezinator]

the folks at amsound.com, whom I know nothing about, have the NAD542 for $399. Maybe worth $100 more?

[Wezinator]

I personally wouldn't pay alot of money for a CD player with the knowledge that most recordings destined for this format are not the best there is. HDCD will not make them sound better if they are compromised in the first place. I would get a all around basic decent quality CD player and wait for the next high end(which will probably be SACD) multichannel format to come out.

What would you recommend on cost and brand for a decent quality CD player? Would the NAD521BEE be overkill @ $299? Any guess how long we'll be waiting for the next multichannel format - in time for next Christmas? Would appreciate your feedback.

[MikeyBC]

I used to own a Classe CDP.3 with HDCD and in my experience HDCD will never compensate for somthing that was poorly recorded or mixed. I have a few HDCD discs and never really cared for their sound except for the one Reference Recordings CD I own. I suppose properly done CD's would warrant the extra cost for HDCD, but what percentage of CD's with or without HDCD out there are "properly done" ?...sadly not too many.

[Geoffcin]

Audio formats are at a crossroad right now. SACD will be around again but attached to the Bluray format. DVD-A is a dead format. CD is not a format of high fidelity because of current mastering techniques which push volume over sound quality.

SACD is still with us, although it's owner, SONY, has dropped the ball on promoting it. DVD-Audio is NOT dead either. I've just picked up a dual-disk that had DVD-Audio on it, and they are still pressing DVD-Audio disks, albiet not in great numbers. DVD-Audio is also written into the HD-DVD standard, and will be included on HD-DVD's. CD's are most certainly a high fidelity format, and the HDCD disks that I have are of an even HIGHER fidelity. The real question is if the purchaser is going to have a selection of HDCD encoded disks to choose from. This will be mostly based on his listening preferences, as some or much better represented than others.

Some info on HDCD can be found here;

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowsmedia/forpros/hdcd/hdcdfaq.aspx

A more in-debth look at HDCD;

http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cache:kQGv4ATgwAMJ:www.audiomn.org/Newsletters/1996/asmSep96.pdf+list+of+available+HDCD+recordings+&hl=en&ie=UTF-8

I have NOT regretted owning an HDCD capable CD player, and if you find music you like that is encoded this way I would recommend it.

[RJW1138]

The C542 isn't just more expensive because it does HDCD! It's a BETTER Redbook player than the C521BEE too. If you want a good source, you'd be well advised to demo the C542 along with the C521BEE. Of course, you'd also benefit from trying the Cambridge Audio 540C and 640C, the Rotel RCD-1072, and as many other players in the price range as you can...

[20to20K]

....but do "Universal" players play HDCD. That is, play them in such a way that takes
advantage of their superior quality. I have a Denon 2200 Universal and the owners manual makes no mention of HDCD capability...on the other hand that manual is the worst, most incomplete owners manual I've ever had for any product. I've learned more about my 2200's capabities on these forums than I've seen mentioned in the manual. My Denon 3805 manual is almost as bad.

But back to my question...do most (or any) Universal players have HDCD decoding capabilites or do you have to buy a specific HDCD player to properly listen to the HDCD enhancements (assuming they exist).

[noddin0ff]

You've gotta look for the HDCD logo. What's included in 'universal' is not universally agreed on.

[Sir Terrence the Terrible]

SACD is still with us, although it's owner, SONY, has dropped the ball on promoting it. DVD-Audio is NOT dead either. I've just picked up a dual-disk that had DVD-Audio on it, and they are still pressing DVD-Audio disks, albiet not in great numbers. DVD-Audio is also written into the HD-DVD standard, and will be included on HD-DVD's. CD's are most certainly a high fidelity format, and the HDCD disks that I have are of an even HIGHER fidelity. The real question is if the purchaser is going to have a selection of HDCD encoded disks to choose from. This will be mostly based on his listening preferences, as some or much better represented than others.

Some info on HDCD can be found here;

http://www.microsoft.com/windows/windowsmedia/forpros/hdcd/hdcdfaq.aspx

A more in-debth look at HDCD;

http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cache:kQGv4ATgwAMJ:www.audiomn.org/Newsletters/1996/asmSep96.pdf+list+of+available+HDCD+recordings+&hl=en&ie=UTF-8

I have NOT regretted owning an HDCD capable CD player, and if you find music you like that is encoded this way I would recommend it.

Geoff,
Lets face the facts on releases. DVD-A releases when compared to even a year ago is probably 1/10 of what it was then. 90% of the DVD-A projects I have worked on will never be released to this format at all. What is being released on dual disc from what I have seen is 24/48khz product, not 24/96khz that is normally used for DVD-A. SACD is doing a little better than DVD-a for releases, but not by that much.

Looking from a consumer point of view, I go to my best buy which used to have three huge racks dedicated to nothing but DVD-A and SACD. We used to have a store on 4th street in berkeley that was nothing but DVD-A and SACD. The store on 4th is now dedicated to CD's and various other musical stuff, and the three racks at BB has turned into half a rack, with many racks replaced with Latin music which happens to be my favorite music.

There is evidence everywhere of the decline in releases of both formats, so I will just wait until the new formats appear and see what roles SACD has in BluRay, and what DVD-A will have in HD-DVD.

[cam]

I am shopping for a new cd player and I have decided on NAD. I cannot decide, however, between the C521 or the more expensive C542 with HDCD capability. I am wondering if HDCD is worth the $200 difference between the two. I have never heard an HDCD disc on a player that decodes it and hope someone can tell me about the difference in sound quality. I have quite a few discs that are HDCD. Should I maybe consider SACD? I have heard that this format is best suited for multi-channel applications however. Will SACD make HDCD technology obsolete?Forget about the $200 difference. Pick up a Panasonic F87, it's a 5 disc carousel, dvd player, and HDCD capable all for $180 Canadian.

[hermanv]

I am lucky enough to own a Levinson D to A decoder, on that device, HDCD sounds considerably better than non-encoded disks. My experience with NAD is that while it sounds good for the cost, it hides many digital ills by being just a bit muffled (IMHO a better tradeoff than bright and over etched) so I would be surprised if the extra HDCD cost would be really audible. HDCD is no breakthrough, it just adds a little more dynamics and clarity and in my case it took a device that sells for thousands to bring out the difference.

At the price range you are discussing many players are available. Try and find a way to listen to several in a decent set-up before you decide. Try to avoid buying the spec sheet, buy a player that sounds good. Maybe you can talk the seller into a home trial.

One other possibility, if your old player isn't actualy broken, used outboard DACs in that price range are plentiful and will probably beat the pants off any new player at the same price.

[westcott]

Here are a couple of links further explaining the failure and dangers of SACD and DVD Audio players.

http://www.audioholics.com/techtips/specsformats/DVD-AudioSACD12.php

http://www.audioholics.com/techtips/specsformats/DVD-AudioSACD2.php

Have you listened to your subwoofer lately????