Even more basic computer audio

[jucas]

Sorry, these are gonna be really stupid questions as computers are far far beyond me and a bit like a recent thread, but I didn't want to be hijacking it.

Right now I have a soundmax integrated digital audio card which makes really irritating clicking sounds when playing MP3's (stock card that'll need an upgrade). THeir website says that there is nothing that can be done about this except for dopping the WAVE volume.

I figure that given my lack of knowledge and limited budget an external soundcard is likely the simplest upgrade and should hopefully make a decent difference for the dollar. So that iMic has me intrigued as its in the right price range. Is this something that needs to be compatable with my current soundcard, or is it an entity all its own that bypasses what I have now?

Basically, I just need something for playing mp3's on the computer through my 2 channel stereo. I'm not going to be doing any recording, so inputs aren't really necesary. Also, in doing a little reading in this forum, the M-Audio Audiophile USB sounded like close to what I wanted, and the external power supply sounded like a good idea. Is there anything similar, but without the outputs, and possibly a little cheaper? (sorry, the budget's gonna be limited for a long time) Does something external that is just for playing music even exist, or will I basically need to do more than this? I basically just want an improvement over what I have now and the clicking to be gone. The stereo's not all that spectacular, so I'm not looking for audiophile quality from my computer, but something a little better than a stock soundcard. (I'm in the process of upping the mp3's bitrate as they were converted using iTunes, so this shoulf help, but won't solve all the problems)

Sorry, I know there's threads that are quite similar, but my technical knowledge is zero, so when reading about these devices, it goes way over my head. So even a recomendation or two to do a bunch of research on would be appreciated immensly!

THanks
-Chris

[noddin0ff]

The iMic bypasses the computer's soundcard. You plug it into a USB port like you would a mouse or a printer or what have you. Then a control panel/preferences (sorry, I don't know what they are called on PC's) setting will have you select the audio to be directed out to the USB port.

Here's the help link
http://www.griffintechnology.com/products/imic/getting_started.php

[oldskoolboarder]

I have a Pioneer 45TX which has a USB port. I plug my Mac Mini into it and use iTunes. Sounds surprisingly fantastic. I even use this configuration w/ my tube amp.

In the past, I've tried this config w/ a PC and it sounded awful, very tinny. I think that the Mac has a better USB audio codec than my IBM Thinkpad T42.

[sam9]

Best under $100 soundcard is probably M-Audio 5.1.

[jucas]

Well, I grabbed an Imic to see if simply picking up an external device would help with the problem, but unfortunately, it actually made the clicking worse.

Having looked around, I haven't found anywhere carrying M-audio, but I found a creative Audigy 2 NX. I didn't see any reviews aobut this, but I was wondering if anyone had anything to say aobut it or creative generally? There reviews for most of the creative stuff seem pretty good. The most important thing is to stop the clicking. I really don't want to pay for something that supports 5.2 as I'll never use it, but if thats the only way around it then I will. SO any ideas why I have this clicking sound, and will an external sound card even help?

Thanks

[mixadude]

Since you're getting this anomaly with different sound devices, prolly otta look at your codecs, try dling some new ones, and if your playback software has a buffer control, you might try increasing it some. You haven't given any info about your computer...

[jucas]

Sorry, I know very little about computers, so I'm not sure exactly what info will be helpful. I'm using I tunes to rip and play my mp3's. It turns out they were being imported at only 128kbps. I upped that rate to 192, and increased the buffering from "medium" to "large", but this hasn't seemed to help?

I really don't know enough about computers to know what info you need. I know that its got a low quality stock soundcard in it and that the iMic should be an improvement. (it may have been in my mind, but even after i stopped liking the iMic when switched back to the internal card i thought it sounded worse) Anyway, the computer is a bottom of the line DELL laptop (inspiron 1000) from January. Probly 2.19GHz and 224 MB of RAM.

I know its never going to be audiophile quality sound, its mainly just a convenient way to have all my music in one place. I have a turntable and cd player for when I want better quality. I was in the process of turning my cd's into 192kbps files but that also doesn't seem to eliminate the problem.

I hope that I should be able to at least be able to eliminate the clicking, but I'm not really sure what else to try. I'd also wondered if a better external card would actually help as the problem remains with a lower quality one.

SOrry aobut my lack of knowledge, but computers are something that I'll probly never understand. THanks for any help though
-Chris

[mixadude]

Actually that computer should make very convincing sound especially with your iMic; I used to get really great results with a 600MHz PIII Sony laptop with an USB soundcard. Before that I used a 200MHz MMX P1 desktop with the original Turtle Beach Multisound ($600!), back when it was all the rage. I do this stuff on the road or at least mobile. Of course I have always had pretty good sound devices, but the new cheap stuff, especially that iMic should be OK

BTW, converting a 128 mp3 to anything else won't get the lost data due to the lossy compression back. You need to rip to waves or some lossless compression in the first place to get full detail from computer audio, but none of this explains the clicks.

I'm finkin yas got something awry either in the codecs or drivers (your problem sounds like a sampling rate mismatch, could happen in codecs or drivers), or perhaps you're computer has some kinda infection. I mention these particularly since you're having the problem with 2 different output devices.

What version of (I assume) Windows do you run? Have you installed any other sound software (that might have come with corrupt codecs) besides iTunes? Have you checked Task Manager under the processes tab to see if your computer is using a lot of cpu cycles for anything other than "System Idle Process"? Under the performance tab (in Task Manager) what is the idle CPU usage percentage ?

If you suspect like I do that the computer might be at issue, you might look into a computer optimization forum. I recommend the Sysopt Technical Support forum (http://www.sysopt.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=6) as a starting place. You probably also ought to contact Dell. There are also other computer forums that can probably help. Google is your friend. Here's another link (http://www.tweakheadz.com/troubleshooting_audio_cards.htm)

If you want to get really good audio performance from your computer, I'd suggest you make the effort to learn more about it. That or take it to someone and tell them what's up and say "fix it" ;)

[jucas]

mixadude,

Thanks for the help so far. Yeah, the clicking has me stumped, and I'm looking into the link you provided/dell/the soundcard's tech support and I know I shuold learn more about this. Also, I figured that re-ripping all my music at a higher rate would just help get rid of that compressed sound a little. I have space to spare so I figure a larger file can't hurt.

A couple answers to the questions you had I have windows XP home edition with service pack 2 installed. I doubt its an infection thing as I've had the problem since before the compter was ever connected to the internet and I've kept norton updated and it keeps claiming I'm virus free.

I didn't really use the computer for this before itunes as the windows media player ripped MP3's that sounded very compressed and clicked as well (I didn't play with the settings). The only other programs I've had on here for audio was FLAC briefly, but I decided to attempt to learn to use what I had and determine what the problem was before expanding what was there or blindly trying to fix something.

As far as system usage goes, the only other thing that appeared to be using cpu cycles was the task manager itself, and the system idle processes fluctuated from around 92-99.
So, I've been starting to think that I should have talked to DELL long ago rather than assuming that it was simply a low end system as far as audio went, so I'm thinking that that's probably the next step for me while I'm reading on the suggested forum.

Thanks again for all you help, and for tolerating my lack of knowledge,
-Chris

[mixadude]

Hi Chris,

Yeah if it's been doing this since the beginning, I'd definately contact Dell, or maybe check their site for faqs first. When and if you do contact them, you prolly otta have all your important data backed up, cause they'll prolly insist on a system restore with the disks that they supplied or that they required you to burn when you first got the computer.

Good luck, keep us informed.

Gene

[mixadude]

BTW, Windoze is actually a fairly friendly environment for hi quality audio as are the intel specs. Once you get er done, you'll be impressed. At home about 99.5% of my sound (from the system below) eminates via my analog connections from my Asus A7N8X deluxe mobo's onboard nVidea Soundfoce onboard sound. It is truly astounding for a built-in solution. I don't use any Soundblaster cards at all ever. :)

[royphil345]

Noticed you only stated having problems with mp3 files you created. Have you tried listening to mp3s ripped by other people? It's a common problem to get "clicks" while ripping a CD. Polishing your CDs, ripping at a slower speed or playing with other settings on your ripping software may help in that case. Look for the CD reading / ripping options on your software. You can usually adjust the ripping speed (4X is usually a safe bet). There may be an option for "audio resync" or something similar that may solve the problem.

Built-in sound is sometimes worse sound-quality wise (especially in older systems) and may have some background noise at higher volumes, but you shouldn't be having major problems like that. Something's wrong somewhere. I've heard of similar problems with sound cards and mainboards that just didn't get along, but it shouldn't happen on a stock system with built-in sound. Simply playing an mp3 shouldn't be a problem for all but the most ancient systems / soundcards.

Here's a short mp3 test file you can download. No clicks means the problem is with your CD ripping and not playback. http://www.savefile.com/files/3466880 You have to click "download" and "download the file now" on the next page that comes up. If you select "open" the mp3 should play when it's done downloading. Or you can select "save" and save the file to a directory in your computer where you can find it. This is all assuming that this free file host is up and running for once. If the download doesn't work, try again later. Try here also http://home.ripway.com/2005-7/359879/test.mp3


If the problem isn't with the ripping process, uninstalling your sound driver + software and reinstalling it may help. If you don't have the drivers separately on a disk, you can usually find them on your computer manufacturer's web support site. Reinstalling the Windows Media Player and codecs may help (search the Microsoft web site for "Windows Media Player Install" and "Windows Media Player Codecs"). Some other media players also depend on Windows Media Player files to work properly.

If all else fails, you'll have to resort to the ol' factory restore disk. 99% chance that would fix the problem.

[sam9]

If it is only the MP3's you made yourself, that "clicking" sound may be digital clipping. I know of a new internet radio station that sounded that way when they first started up until a listener (me) mentioned it and they reduced the appropriate volume control.

Try making an MP3 with the volume slider down a couple of notches.

Basicly, PC audio can be very good once you work out the quirks.

[jucas]

Thanks for the suggestion. Right now I'm trying to get a hold of DELL's customer support, and looking through my stuff to see if the drivers came with the computer on disk.

First off, it just seems to be with MP3's generally. (I'm a horrible person and download a song or two too see if i'll like an album before I buy it) Also, it is seemingly random, but if it were clipping, it should be in the same part of the song every time I play it should it not? Right now there appears to be no pattern to this. Sometimes I'll get a night of great click free music, then the next day it will click non-stop. Also, it appears to happen with equall frequency during slow soft passages and in faster more complex and loud passages. I might be wrong, but I would have expected clipping to occur when there was a stronger signal more than when there was a softer one.

Please correct me if I'm wrong, I'd absolutely love a simple fix, but I would have expected clipping to behave that way.

A thought I had, is it possible that the interference cable from my computer to my reciever is the cause of the problem. It's pretty budget, simply being a 1/8 connector plugged into the headphone out with an adaptor to an RCA to finish the connection to my reciever. I wasn't really sure how else to connect this, but I'm open to suggestions if this sounds possible. I thought I'd had this problem before on the internal speakers, but that was in a cheap building where I was having worse problems with hum due to the power supply. It shouldn't be the reciever or speakers as I've had the same problem on a different reciever and speakers. The only problem I can see with this is that it's not happening through this setup with CD's or DVD's.

And on an irritating side note, as I'm figuring out how I can isolate the problem in an attempt to figure out the cause, of course I can't make the clicking occur.

-Chris

[royphil345]

If the sound's OK from other sources, it's starting to sound alot more like a problem with your player or codecs. Could also be some other software that's malfunctioning or even a virus that's slowing your system way down. Actually, this would probably best explain why the problem is intermittent. The full system restore may be the best way to go.

[mixadude]

If the sound's OK from other sources, it's starting to sound alot more like a problem with your player or codecs. Could also be some other software that's malfunctioning or even a virus that's slowing your system way down. Actually, this would probably best explain why the problem is intermittent. The full system restore may be the best way to go.
I concur :cool:

[jucas]

Well, Thanks for all the help everyone, I'll try re-doing the codecs and the drivers. If that doesn't work, I guess I'll go for a system restore and see if that'll help.

-Chris

[mixadude]

Well, Thanks for all the help everyone, I'll try re-doing the codecs and the drivers. If that doesn't work, I guess I'll go for a system restore and see if that'll help.

-Chris

:cool: OK then, just make sure you got all yer impotent(sic) info backed-up. Be sure to include yer Outllook info and any other relevant databased info. ;)