Cheap Cheap Cheap Turntable?

[Shwamdoo]

I am looking to add a turntable to my stereo setup. However, I don't want to spend very much at all. In fact, I want to spend as little as possible without buying a total junker. I am willing to go with a used table and I have been searching on Ebay and Audiogon. So far I have centered my search around Rega and Music Hall turntables. Any suggestions as to what other brands make decent sounding turntables in the extremly broke price range?

Thanks in advance.

[Glen B]

You probably can't do better than the two brands you already mentioned or a Pro-Ject model when it comes to a beer-budget turntable.

Pro-Ject at Needle Doctor: http://www.needledoctor.com/s.nl/sc.2/category.46/.f

[texlle]

I got a mint 1976 B&O Beogram 3000 from ebay for $100. Works awesome.

[Jimmy C]

I am looking to add a turntable to my stereo setup. However, I don't want to spend very much at all. In fact, I want to spend as little as possible without buying a total junker. I am willing to go with a used table and I have been searching on Ebay and Audiogon. So far I have centered my search around Rega and Music Hall turntables. Any suggestions as to what other brands make decent sounding turntables in the extremly broke price range?

Thanks in advance.

...I have a Realistic LAB-440. Long story short, I have two of these in MINT condtion, both of them are clearly not used more than a few times.

I was searching for the table I was using 25 years ago, and ended up having to buy a second due to SLIGHT model difference... the location of the strobe, and the cueing lever was slightly different than the one I had. I'm keeping the exact one I had, and I'll sell the other.

It's really in beautiful condition... a couple of tiny dots on the dustcover, and a tiny ding on the aluminum part of the mat (center). I have the original box, packing materials, manual, 45 RPM adaptor, overhang guage, RCA cables, and even the receipt! From 1984 (my exact table was from 1980, hence slight model diffs). I'll throw in a Grado Green, as well as the original Shure, $100 plus shipping. If you're in NY, you're welcome to a listen.

I would go with an entry-level Pro-Ject or Rega if funds permit, but the sound quality on the LAB is pretty good! Decent weight to it and fairly forgiving. Might just be the ticket to see if you want to go further into the vinyl world. I haven't heard an old Thorens in a while, but these might be worth checking out as well.

There is a Realistic 420 on eBay right now (top pic, last time I looked... search under "Realistic turntable")... mine sort of looks like this... woodgrain plinth, clear cover, but my controls are top front mounted, and the 440 has a straight arm. It was their best table in 1980.

Once in a while, when someone wants "a really inexpensive" table, I'll mention my Realistic. I know were not sopposed to sell things here, but... she needs a good home!

[Jimmy C]

I am looking to add a turntable to my stereo setup. However, I don't want to spend very much at all. In fact, I want to spend as little as possible without buying a total junker. I am willing to go with a used table and I have been searching on Ebay and Audiogon. So far I have centered my search around Rega and Music Hall turntables. Any suggestions as to what other brands make decent sounding turntables in the extremly broke price range?

Thanks in advance.

First "duh"... you live in Dallas - I'm guessing plane tix wouldn't be worth it :*)

Second "duh"... I spelled "supposed" incorrectly... aarrgh...

[psonic]

http://www.audioadvisor.com/store/productdetail.asp?sku=MHGR1&product_name=Goldring%20GR-1%20Turntable%20with%20RB-250%20arm%20and%20Electra%20Phono%20Cartridge

[Shwamdoo]

Thanks for all the responses. I looked into Pro-ject and I'm going to audition two of their tables on thursday. Also, I am going to hear a Goldring table sometime next week. Jimmy C, thank you for the generous offer. I'm not familar with Realistic (I'm a youngin,.) but I will do my reaserch and get back to you when I feel that I'm ready to make a purchase. Granted, that may be quite a while from now, because I have $0.01 to my name and a CD player to buy. Thank you all though.

[Glen B]

I'm not familar with Realistic (I'm a youngin,.) but I will do my research and get back to you when I feel that I'm ready to make a purchase. Granted, that may be quite a while from now, because I have $0.01 to my name and a CD player to buy. Thank you all though.

Realistic was a brand sold by Rat.........er, Radio Shack. Realistic (and an old one at that) is not the best choice in a budget turntable, especially if you want vinyl to make a good impression on you.

[Jimmy C]

Realistic was a brand sold by Rat.........er, Radio Shack. Realistic (and an old one at that) is not the best choice in a budget turntable, especially if you want vinyl to make a good impression on you.

...this table can sound pretty good. Granted, the original Shure was a $20 piece, and lacking. With the Grado, everything moves up a few pegs - smoothness, as well as weight and scale.

For $100, there aren't too many choices. "Sought after" vintage rigs will run more money, or be in poor condition. This one is basically brand new. With a $50 Grado, not too shabby.

Where in N.Y. are you? Maybe one day we'll get together and you can listen... I bet the sound will be better than you're thinking. A friend has a plastic fantistic from Pioneer (about $150, 15 yrs. ago) and the Rat Shack sounds w-a-y better, the Pioneer sounds like a toy.

No, no "audiophile" cache, and spending $300 on an "entry-level" table (which I recommended) will bring the sound up another notch or two.

If I thought this sounded like a P.O.S., I wouldn't have said anything. It can indeed make a good impression. Sort of like a chef making crap food... someone into audio wouldn't do that to someone...lol.

Hey - he DID say "cheap"...

[Glen B]

...this table can sound pretty good. Granted, the original Shure was a $20 piece, and lacking. With the Grado, everything moves up a few pegs - smoothness, as well as weight and scale.

For $100, there aren't too many choices. "Sought after" vintage rigs will run more money, or be in poor condition. This one is basically brand new. With a $50 Grado, not too shabby.

Where in N.Y. are you? Maybe one day we'll get together and you can listen... I bet the sound will be better than you're thinking. A friend has a plastic fantistic from Pioneer (about $150, 15 yrs. ago) and the Rat Shack sounds w-a-y better, the Pioneer sounds like a toy.

No, no "audiophile" cache, and spending $300 on an "entry-level" table (which I recommended) will bring the sound up another notch or two.

If I thought this sounded like a P.O.S., I wouldn't have said anything. It can indeed make a good impression. Sort of like a chef making crap food... someone into audio wouldn't do that to someone...lol.

Hey - he DID say "cheap"...

Fair enough. :)

[oldskoolboarder]

Any place I might find that?

I saw Glen B's and I have to say, those rosewood tables are stunning. Any particular ones to stay away from?

[Glen B]

Any place I might find that?

I saw Glen B's and I have to say, those rosewood tables are stunning. Any particular ones to stay away from?

I don't recall ever seeing any reviews and I've had mine since 1988. I am only aware of the DP59L and DP60L coming in the rosewood finish, which is actually laminate over MDF.

Here's a DP60L on Ebay:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=5765255926

[Woochifer]

Realistic was a brand sold by Rat.........er, Radio Shack. Realistic (and an old one at that) is not the best choice in a budget turntable, especially if you want vinyl to make a good impression on you.

Keep in mind that those Realistic turntables were made by a variety of outsource partners, so the quality could be surprisingly good depending on who produced a particular model. Even some of the speakers sold at Radio Shack were actually decent. I remember in their 1979 catalog, the turntables shown were identical to the BIC 900 series, which was a very good turntable series that delivered decent performance for the money.

http://www.theturntablefactory.com/bic.html
http://forums.audioreview.com/showthread.php?t=8337

[natlus]

I just picked up a very pretty NAD 5120 w/Grado cartridge for 60.00, in need of a replacement belt(18.00)--I got it from craigslist, which I don't know if they have in Tx. NAD makes very solid equipment, and much of it is in the "budget" range.

I also used to play all my vinyl on a range of Dual turntables; there seems to be plenty of those out there on the various internet auctions. I can't remember the number, but I used to have the top of the line Dual, manual, with a beautiful rosewood(?) or teak(?) veneer finish, if aesthetics is your thing, although the arm came under some criticism for not being up to par to other Dual arms.
Good luck.

[Woochifer]

I just picked up a very pretty NAD 5120 w/Grado cartridge for 60.00, in need of a replacement belt(18.00)--I got it from craigslist, which I don't know if they have in Tx. NAD makes very solid equipment, and much of it is in the "budget" range.

I also used to play all my vinyl on a range of Dual turntables; there seems to be plenty of those out there on the various internet auctions. I can't remember the number, but I used to have the top of the line Dual, manual, with a beautiful rosewood(?) or teak(?) veneer finish, if aesthetics is your thing, although the arm came under some criticism for not being up to par to other Dual arms.
Good luck.

Out of sight, out of mind. Rega, Project, Music Hall, etc. are the budget decks that the audiophile press has written the most about the past few years, so they're obviously the most well known ones out there. With NAD, I believe that they outsource with Rega to make their turntables. I don't know why NAD doesn't get more run for their turntables either because even the new ones sold in stores that I seen look affordably priced.

Dual is a pretty convoluted situation right now. At one time, Dual was one of the highest volume turntable manufacturers in the world. They stayed in the U.S. market until the U.S. distributor just decided to close its doors one day. Dual has maintained its German manufacturing operations and still has a distributor up in Canada, but product in the U.S. has been limited to a couple of mail order houses.

In the meantime, Dual has reentered the U.S. market, but only in name. Last year, a Korean company bought the rights to the Dual brand in the U.S., so products with the Dual name have started reappearing, but they have no connection whatsoever to the German company that still makes the Dual turntables.

Right now, if you're buying on Ebay or Audiogon, the Duals, especially the 505s, are some of the best turntable bargains out there because they are not the turntables that people think of first. But, they are very good quality, and easy to find on the auction sites. I use a Dual CS5000 (this might be the one that you're thinking of), and it's a very nice midlevel semi-automatic turntable with a quartz locked speed control (Dual was the only company that had this feature on belt drives), suspended subchassis (a feature not found on most entry level turntables nowadays), and a 78 speed option. I bought mine back in 1990 for $500, but I've seen these models on Ebay for less than $200.

[natlus]

[QUOTE=Woochifer]Out of sight, out of mind. Rega, Project, Music Hall, etc. are the budget decks that the audiophile press has written the most about the past few years, so they're obviously the most well known ones out there. I use a Dual CS5000 (this might be the one that you're thinking of), and it's a very nice midlevel semi-automatic turntable with a quartz locked speed control (Dual was the only company that had this feature on belt drives), suspended subchassis (a feature not found on most entry level turntables nowadays), and a 78 speed option.

Yup, that's the baby(CS5000), a very beautiful and functional table to my tastes. I seem to remember adjustable feet-now I'm really getting nostalgic...

It's interesting some of the issues you raise--since I've been out of the audiophile mode for some time and am just re-entering, it makes me wonder if "out of sight, out of mind" is also a manifestation of generational issues. As a closing-onto-forty-yro, Dual was the high end of mid fi (or the low end of hi fi, I suppose)for tables of my time, while Thorens belonged more to the upper echelon.

As for the B&O that a previous writer mentioned, I always felt that they were alot like Audi cars of the time--expensive, ran very beautifully (when they did run), and a damn pain in the ------ to repair and find parts, overall overrated when cost was weighed with performance. But they are museum pieces, literally, so not to be dismissed for modernist tastes.

A very long winded way of saying to the initial question: go for a Dual or NAD or Thorens-the build quality always seems to be of very high standards and middle age geezers like me say so...

[Woochifer]

Yup, that's the baby(CS5000), a very beautiful and functional table to my tastes. I seem to remember adjustable feet-now I'm really getting nostalgic...

And you traded it in for an NAD that you bought on Ebay? Seems like you've gone through quite a few turntables in your time. That CS5000 was the first turntable I bought, and 15 years later I still have it! I guess I don't know when to let go of things. Those adjustable feet are pretty functional -- you lower them for maximum stability, and raise them for maximum isolation.


It's interesting some of the issues you raise--since I've been out of the audiophile mode for some time and am just re-entering, it makes me wonder if "out of sight, out of mind" is also a manifestation of generational issues. As a closing-onto-forty-yro, Dual was the high end of mid fi (or the low end of hi fi, I suppose)for tables of my time, while Thorens belonged more to the upper echelon.

You're right in that it might be a generational thing, but it could also simply be companies coming and going, and the market evolving. 20 or so years ago, you had a very healthy middle market for turntables. Dual was one of the lower priced players in that market. Other turntables in that middle market included Thorens, NAD, Rega, and AR. For a long time, the middle market for turntables disappeared. Newer companies Project and Music Hall have emerged in recent years because they offered a full lineup of turntables starting in the $250 range.

At the upper end when I was going to a lot of high end audio shows, the high end turntables of that era included Linn, Well Tempered, Oracle, and a few others whose names escape me now. Those companies are still around, but newer players like Clearaudio and VPI get more of the buzz nowadays.


As for the B&O that a previous writer mentioned, I always felt that they were alot like Audi cars of the time--expensive, ran very beautifully (when they did run), and a damn pain in the ------ to repair and find parts, overall overrated when cost was weighed with performance. But they are museum pieces, literally, so not to be dismissed for modernist tastes.

The B&O Beograms were actually one of the few pieces B&O made that performed almost as well as it looked. Unfortunately, they also chose to go with a proprietary cartridge/headshell design. This means that you have to go with a B&O cartridge and can't opt for other standard 1/2" mount cartridges. And like other B&O components, their cartridges are very expensive for what you get (replacements range from $300 to $600).

You have to be similarly careful with certain Dual turntables as well because a lot of them also use a proprietary cartridge/headshell combo. You can buy adaptor headshells that allow one of those Dual turntables to accept a standard mount cartridge, so maybe B&O offered something similar for the Beograms.

[acronym]

So I'm guessing that a B&O 1900 "needs new needle" for $80 doesn't qualify for a budget TT?

[natlus]

And you traded it in for an NAD that you bought on Ebay?

You have to be similarly careful with certain Dual turntables as well because a lot of them also use a proprietary cartridge/headshell combo. You can buy adaptor headshells that allow one of those Dual turntables to accept a standard mount cartridge, so maybe B&O offered something similar for the Beograms.

MyCS5000 fell victim to a basement flood, hence the NAD(and my nostalgia...) The proprietary cartridge-didn't Dual have a thing with Ortofon? As long as we're talking about cartridges, any recommendations for one with the NAD 5120--right now it's a Grado NZ+(I think).

And as an aside, does vinyl deteriorate more or less in a cold climate, ie, basement--I'm taking bets on my old records.

[Woochifer]

MyCS5000 fell victim to a basement flood, hence the NAD(and my nostalgia...) The proprietary cartridge-didn't Dual have a thing with Ortofon? As long as we're talking about cartridges, any recommendations for one with the NAD 5120--right now it's a Grado NZ+(I think).

And as an aside, does vinyl deteriorate more or less in a cold climate, ie, basement--I'm taking bets on my old records.

Ah! Sorry to hear about your loss! My parents had a garage flood that knocked out about 1/3 of my record collection which I stored there while I was moving, so I feel your pain!

Those proprietary Dual cartridges I believe were made by Ortofon, and accepted Ortofon replacment stylii. But, cartridges can and do wear down over time, and if you wanted to replace that cartridge, you couldn't without an adaptor headshell. Fortunately, there are so many Duals out there that there's a pretty healthy aftermarket for those adaptors.

If you're not having any hum issues with that Grado, then you could look into one of the newer Grado carts. I wanted to try out one of the Grados on my setup, but everybody I asked mentioned that Grados did not work well with Duals because of the hum. Or you could go for the Ortofon OM series if you liked it before with the CS5000.

With vinyl deterioration, I think so long as the temperature is constant with minimal humidity, you're fine. I would be more concerned about heat than cold.

[Woochifer]

So I'm guessing that a B&O 1900 "needs new needle" for $80 doesn't qualify for a budget TT?

That would depend on if just the stylus or the entire cartridge needs replacement. I looked up B&O on LP Gear's website, and it looks like they offer a generic replacement stylus for $40. Apparently genuine B&O stylii aren't made anymore, and no telling if the generic replacements perform as well as the factory originals. LP Gear also sells original B&O cartridges, and those START at $300.

[nobody]

Yeah, I got rid of a B&O Beogram 3000 that I actually liked quite a bit when replacement cartridges started being priced out of sight. It was a nice, easy-to-use table with the tangential tracking arm...more than decent sound, incredibly easy to use, very easy on records. I especially liked the way you could set it on autoplay and repeat a side up to 7 times, made it great for listening while going to sleep at night. But, having to fork over several hundred for cartridges that were nothing particularly special just loooked like a bad idea to me, so I sold it.