Home Theater/ Video calibration DVD's - Worth it? Suggestions?

[kexodusc]

No secret here, I'm totally new to all this HDTV nonesense...
Anyhoo, looking for input on whether I should drop some coin on a Home Theater calibration DVD, and if so, which one?
I know the settings on these HDTV's are usually cranked to the max to look good in store, etc...I just don't have a clue what the settings should be...some of these DVD's are quite pricey. Don't need anymore audio calibration software, I've got a bunch of that already, just video.
Any recommendations?

[edtyct]

No secret here, I'm totally new to all this HDTV nonesense...
Anyhoo, looking for input on whether I should drop some coin on a Home Theater (#) calibration DVD (#), and if so, which one?
I know the settings on these HDTV's are usually cranked to the max to look good in store, etc...I just don't have a clue what the settings should be...some of these DVD's are quite pricey. Don't need anymore audio calibration software, I've got a bunch of that already, just video.
Any recommendations?
kexo,

I won't go into too much detail about this issue. Just reducing the contrast, brightness, and sharpess settings out of the box about 50% will improve your picture, and, depending on your type of TV, reduce the chances of damage. I'm willing to bet, however, that you don't rely on your ears alone to set the levels of your multichannel audio; some people think that your eyes deserve the same degree of support. That said, even though a person can certainly enjoy an HDTV without fussing over its settings like some of us do, you can get a better handle on your set's ability to maintain standards and present material to its best advantage if you consult a test disk. If you buy, say, Digital Video Essential, which I hear has recently been reduced in price, you'll understand whether, how, and why your color and black level deviate from the professional benchmark. You get to understand how resolution is enhanced and damaged by what you, or the manufacturer, may do to an otherwise capable TV in the form of edge enhancement, and you can get visual evidence of how fine your display's picture can be and the extent to which its technical limitations affect real-world viewing. The images, montages, and test screens on DVE are enonormously helpful, giving you a sense of how good a well-calibrated display and well-produced video can look at 480. In some cases, you might even get a sense of how much better your grey scale and color could be if you sprung for a full-tilt ISF calibration ($200 or more). Some displays are so inept at reproducing black that shadow detail is totally missing, false contouring all but destroys gradations of darkness, or the midnight sky looks like late afternoon. Others push red and/or green so badly that you'd swear that you'd taken a hit of ecstacy. At the very least, however, many people find that the educational opportunities and functional enhancements offered by a good test disk are well worth the effort and cost (in reason).

Ed

[paul_pci]

While I don't have an HDTV, I did recently buy Digital Video Essentials, and have been meaning to post my experience/questions. For twenty bucks, it's better than guessing at the settings. Also, as my in-the-near-future post will outline, the video calibrations are far more useful out of the box than are the audio calibrations.

[Quagmire]

Kex,

I recommend that you buy one of the calibration DVD's. When you look at the cost of one of these discs (even the expensive ones) it is a very small amount compared to the purchase price of your HDTV or an ISF calibration. You may be surprised too that just as it is more difficult than most people think to set audio speaker levels by ear, it is also difficult to get picture settings anywhere close to normal without some sort of guide. In the big scheme of things, I think these calibration DVD's are well worth their cost. I know that Woochifer often times mentions the Sound & Vision (I think that's the right one) Test DVD, which is less expensive than the others and he seems to think it's pretty good. Maybe you can lure him here for some comments.

I have the AVIA disc, which I purchased several years ago for around $40 and I have been very happy with it. I don't regret for a minute having spent that much for it. Also, you might check with the rental stores or even Netflix (if you're a member) to see if they carry one of these DVD's -- then you wouldn't even have to buy the disc if you don't want to. Just a thought.

Q

[kexodusc]

Kex,

I recommend that you buy one of the calibration DVD's. When you look at the cost of one of these discs (even the expensive ones) it is a very small amount compared to the purchase price of your HDTV or an ISF calibration. You may be surprised too that just as it is more difficult than most people think to set audio speaker levels by ear, it is also difficult to get picture settings anywhere close to normal without some sort of guide. In the big scheme of things, I think these calibration DVD's are well worth their cost. I know that Woochifer often times mentions the Sound & Vision (I think that's the right one) Test DVD, which is less expensive than the others and he seems to think it's pretty good. Maybe you can lure him here for some comments.

Q

Thanks, Q. This is exactly along the lines of what I was thinking. I have no idea what the pictuer is "suppose to look like". Whenever I walk into a store there's always some picture issues etc. I've read several articles in magazines that all seem to suggest turning the brightness and contrast down, using the "movie" pre-set mode if available, selecting the "hot" or "warm" setting for color detail etc, but it'd be nice to understand why I should doing all this.
$40 isn't so bad, the brochure I have has prices in the $200 area though, which might just be more than I care for at this point in time.
I've used the S&V disc for audio, shame on me for not paying more attention.
S&V and Avia seem to be the two I hear about most...guess I'll have to do pull the trigger on one.

[Woochifer]

Digital Video Essentials is only $25, and IMO a no brainer if you're getting a HDTV.

The S&V disc might be too simplistic for HDTVs because the video tests only use a single blue filter. That test is fine for my older TV, which has more limited settings available. But, for HDTVs, with their wider range of picture adjustments, you'll probably want calibration discs like DVE or Avia that use the more advanced three-color filter tests. The S&V disc though is the best beginner calibration disc because of its low price and its very easy to understand tutorials.

DVE has a horrible navigation menu and more cryptic tutorials, so I would not recommend it for an absolute beginner. But, I generally recommend it over Avia because it has a more current set of audio tests (Avia lacks both DTS and 6.1 audio tests) and it costs less. Since the audio tests aren't important to you, the Avia disc might be a good bet because I've read that it's more intuitive to use than DVE (Avia and the S&V disc are both produced by Ovation Software).

In my system, the biggest improvement that the calibration discs made was with the video quality. I used both the S&V and DVE discs, and the S&V disc was good enough for my purposes because my TV's limited user adjustments made it difficult to benefit from the three-color filter that came with the DVE disc. But, the other benefit with calibration discs is that they use narrower band test tones for the audio tests. In general, the tone generators built into receivers are wideband, which can produce erroneous readings because the tones extend into the bass range. This means that the room effects can heavily influence the readings.

[Woochifer]

Thanks, Q. This is exactly along the lines of what I was thinking. I have no idea what the pictuer is "suppose to look like". Whenever I walk into a store there's always some picture issues etc. I've read several articles in magazines that all seem to suggest turning the brightness and contrast down, using the "movie" pre-set mode if available, selecting the "hot" or "warm" setting for color detail etc, but it'd be nice to understand why I should doing all this.
$40 isn't so bad, the brochure I have has prices in the $200 area though, which might just be more than I care for at this point in time.
I've used the S&V disc for audio, shame on me for not paying more attention.
S&V and Avia seem to be the two I hear about most...guess I'll have to do pull the trigger on one.

That $200 price is likely for the professional versions of Avia and DVE. Avia Pro is an 8-DVD set that's aimed towards professional installers who know their way around the service menus (which are normally inaccessible to consumers). It's probably overkill for the mortals among us.

Believe me, the video calibration makes a huge improvement because it allows you to see your picture set to reference standards (or at least as close as possible using the accessible controls). As with audio tests, it allows you to establish a reference point from which you adjust to your preferences. On my TV, it entailed cranking the brightness and sharpness way down, bumping up the color level, and tweaking with the hue. Other TVs allow you to set the color levels individually, which is where the more advanced discs like DVE and Avia prove their worth.

[kexodusc]

Thanks Wooch, for an absolute "Video-newb" like myself, the easier Avia disc probably is the way to go...
But since I have the combined total knowledge power of AR.com at my disposal, I've ordered the DVE instead...
We'll see how goes...
Now, can someone explain to me exactly what the difference is between Tint, and Color. Oh and what in the blue hell is convergence?

[Woochifer]

Thanks Wooch, for an absolute "Video-newb" like myself, the easier Avia disc probably is the way to go...
But since I have the combined total knowledge power of AR.com at my disposal, I've ordered the DVE instead...
We'll see how goes...
Now, can someone explain to me exactly what the difference is between Tint, and Color. Oh and what in the blue hell is convergence?

Actually the S&V disc is the newbie-friendly disc. The Avia and DVE discs are equally advanced, though Avia is supposedly easier to navigate. The DVE menu system is its primary weakness.

Man, you are a video newbie! The color is simply the level adjustment for the colors (sort of like a volume control), while the tint changes the color balance between the primary colors (sort of like an equalizer). Convergence has to do with the geometry of the picture.

[Quagmire]

"But, the other benefit with calibration discs is that they use narrower band test tones for the audio tests. In general, the tone generators built into receivers are wideband, which can produce erroneous readings because the tones extend into the bass range. This means that the room effects can heavily influence the readings."

I thought about mentioning that too, Wooch, but after the wrestling match Kex and I had over the whole "Quality"..."Value" thing in the other thread, I wasn't sure he was ready to hear anything I had to say ;-) Hehehe

For what it's worth, Kex, I agree completely with Wooch about the audio calibrations too. I know when I got around to calibrating speaker levels with the AVIA disc (as compared to the tone generator) I found my center channel speaker needed to be boosted by 3 db and the surrounds by nearly as much. This made a huge difference in overall balance and sound quality; particularly for dialog intelligibilty.

I find the navigation menu's on the AVIA disc aggrevating enough to deal with, so if DVE is generally considered to be worse in that regard, I'd probably be thoroughly pissed by the time I was done with a calibration. Just something to think about, but you could be better with that stuff than I am so it might not be a deal breaker for you.

Q

[kexodusc]

I've got narrow and wide band test-tones galore, 3 SPL meters, and a fairly accurate auto-setup feature built into my receiver...I'm not naive enough to think it can't get any better, I'm just doubtful I'm going to get that for $20 with all the video stuff that goes with it.

While we're at it fellas, I've been googling rather unsuccessfully trying to find a good "everyting you ever wanted to know about HDTV and video calibration" site...anyone have any good sources?

Thus far my complete knowledge of HDTV and video setup has come from the last 12 issues of Sound & Vision, my owner's manual (which I believe was written by the good folks at Denon) and a few posts over the last week or so.
I'd like to bring myself at least into the 1990's if not the new millenium.

[ruadmaa]

No secret here, I'm totally new to all this HDTV nonesense...
Anyhoo, looking for input on whether I should drop some coin on a Home Theater calibration DVD, and if so, which one?
I know the settings on these HDTV's are usually cranked to the max to look good in store, etc...I just don't have a clue what the settings should be...some of these DVD's are quite pricey. Don't need anymore audio calibration software, I've got a bunch of that already, just video.
Any recommendations?

Just be sure to turn the contrast anywhere below 50%. That will be fine to prevent burn in problems. The rest of the controls usually don't require much readjusting other than the brightness control and simply adjust that one to your preference.

[Quagmire]

Just be sure to turn the contrast anywhere below 50%. That will be fine to prevent burn in problems. The rest of the controls usually don't require much readjusting other than the brightness control and simply adjust that one to your preference.
And you know this is accurate because....?

Q

[edtyct]

I've got narrow and wide band test-tones galore, 3 SPL meters, and a fairly accurate auto-setup feature built into my receiver...I'm not naive enough to think it can't get any better, I'm just doubtful I'm going to get that for $20 with all the video stuff that goes with it.

While we're at it fellas, I've been googling rather unsuccessfully trying to find a good "everyting you ever wanted to know about HDTV and video calibration" site...anyone have any good sources?

Thus far my complete knowledge of HDTV and video setup has come from the last 12 issues of Sound & Vision, my owner's manual (which I believe was written by the good folks at Denon) and a few posts over the last week or so.
I'd like to bring myself at least into the 1990's if not the new millenium.
Kexo,

Peter Putnam's HDTV Expert site has some very good tutorials: http://www.hdtvexpert.com/. Also, I don't think that anyone answered your question about why incline toward the warm temperature setting. The reason is that it is usually the closest option to the 6500K standard for the color of grey. However, even the warm setting can deviate severely from 6500 throughout the light spectrum; many hover from 8000 to 10000, and even higher at the extremes of light and dark. If the color temperature is out of whack, no amount of twiddling with the TV's controls on the basis of DVE, AVIA, or S&V will bring it into line. Only someone with the proper expensive equipment, like an ISF technician, can "correct" a grey scale (although some sets are harder to adjust than otherhs). Many sets tend toward blue or red intentionally, to make their own statement, thereby screwing up the temperature. The blue bias has been popular with manufacturers because white with a tint of blue can look brighter than bright. Personally, I hate it; it sends the color temperature into the stratosphere. I prefer errors in the direction of red, though not so much that skin tone is impaired. Contrary to ruadmaa's suggestion, all of the set's controls need a certain amount of adjustment. The calibration disks will reveal why. Hope that helps.

Ed

[ruadmaa]

And you know this is accurate because....?

Q

Go to www.hdtvoice.com There you will find a group of people dedicated to HDTV. The moderators are quite knowledgeable and have much experience with HDTV. I am sure you can verify my suggestion at that site. Setting your contrast below 50% will help greatly in avoiding burn in issues and that is just simply a fact. Of course you can disregard my suggestion, it's your TV. Don't say you were't properly advised. Incidentally I have set up my own tv with the Sound and Vision set up disk.

[edtyct]

ruadmaa,

I'm not trying to speak for Q, but I don't think that anybody would dispute your suggestion to bring down the contrast and brightness (they're interactive)--first, because high settings will contribute heavily to the burn-in risk on CRTs and plasmas and, second, because it generally makes for better picture on any type of display. The other point worth making is that complete calibration also involves sharpness, tint, and color. Sharpness on an HDTV can usually be cut back considerably, often to the bare bones, to deter the kind of edge enhancement that destroys a set's resolution, especially on microdispays. Color and tint, well Woochifer said it best up a ways. Your point about contrast is plain good advice.

Ed

[Quagmire]

Go to www.hdtvoice.com There you will find a group of people dedicated to HDTV. The moderators are quite knowledgeable and have much experience with HDTV. I am sure you can verify my suggestion at that site. Setting your contrast below 50% will help greatly in avoiding burn in issues and that is just simply a fact. Of course you can disregard my suggestion, it's your TV. Don't say you were't properly advised. Incidentally I have set up my own tv with the Sound and Vision set up disk.
Your earlier post made it sound as though the only thing he really needs to do is bring contrast down without regard to the rest of his settings, and then just adjust brightness to his preference. Bringing contrast down to avoid burn in is sensible advice, but this hardly seems an endorsement for using a test disc, in fact just the opposite could easily be inferred -- bring contrast down and set brightness to taste... DONE! I just wondered how you knew this would get his set anywhere close to a reference when you had no way of comparing the settings to an external reference source. That is what the test DVD's are all about. Implicit in your recommendation is the assumption that all HDTV settings are about the same since a quick and easy adjustment to contrast is really all that is needed. You said... "The rest of the controls usually don't require much readjusting...". I disagree, they can vary widely. If that is your advice to others I would assume that this is how you made the video adjustment on your own set, but apparently it is not as you reveal here that you have taken the time to setup your own TV with the Sound and Vision disc. I'm sorry but this just seems contradictory to me. Care to explain?

Q

[LEAFS264]

I've just ordered my copy of Digital Video Essentials,for my new T.V we'll see how it goes.

Jay.