Pass X1 preamp

[Mr Peabody]

From your posts Feanor I would think the ARC is a good match for you. If anything on your system at some point you might consider an upgrade in DAC.

[Feanor]

From your posts Feanor I would think the ARC is a good match for you. If anything on your system at some point you might consider an upgrade in DAC.

I agree with that my DAC would be the next thing to consider, though I'd like a nice SACD player, being a classical listener. I'm definitely envious of your Mark Levinson 512. Any DAC suggestions?

Meanwhile I feel my Schiit Bifrost Uber punches 'way above its weight, so no rush.

[blackraven]

Any DAC that you get should do DSD. Other considerations would be to get a Marantz reference SACD player that can function as a DAC. That is my plan. I would love to have an 11S2 or 11S3

[Mr Peabody]

There's the Sony JM recently bought, if nothing else Sony's SACD players seem to be respected. I also recently seen in a Music Direct flyer they had the Marantz Reference SA-15s for under $1500.00, normally $2k. You like things neutral you might even consider the Cambridge 851, it's quite a bit different from prior players being more neutral and detailed, I believe there are reviews around. Also, not sure if it does SACD but Music Direct also had the PS Audio DAC on sale for like $799.00. If you keep an eye on Audiogon or Spearitsound a Krell being balanced would match your system nicely. They also occasionally have an Esoteric within reach.

[Feanor]

There's the Sony JM recently bought, if nothing else Sony's SACD players seem to be respected. I also recently seen in a Music Direct flyer they had the Marantz Reference SA-15s for under $1500.00, normally $2k. You like things neutral you might even consider the Cambridge 851, it's quite a bit different from prior players being more neutral and detailed, I believe there are reviews around. Also, not sure if it does SACD but Music Direct also had the PS Audio DAC on sale for like $799.00. If you keep an eye on Audiogon or Spearitsound a Krell being balanced would match your system nicely. They also occasionally have an Esoteric within reach.

These are good suggestions, thanks.

The Marantz models do have the digital input so have the potential to replace my separate DAC. JM's Sony SCD-XA5400ES is looks good and reasonably priced, but has no digital inputs The Cambridge 851 accepts digital input but isn't an SACD player.

Interesting maybe is the fact that US retailers such as Music Direct, Acoustic Sounds, Audio Advisor, etc., will not sell certain brands in across the border to Canada due to agreements these brands have with Canadian distributors. This doesn't work well for Canadian consumers who usually end up paying more. BTY, the Sony SCD-XA5400ES isn't for sale in Canada at all.

[Mr Peabody]

I forgot the 851 didn't do SACD, I think because my friend uses it to do hi rez computer files. Not SACD is a major oversight of Cambridge on that unit especially considering the way they market it.

[Mr Peabody]

Blackraven what did you hook to the X250 that was balanced? Balanced is more than just using XLR's, some gear offers the connection but not truly balanced.

The X250 is a single-ended "Class-A" topology with Pass's Supersymmetry™ Balanced approach to precision component matching. His Supersymmetry™ topology was granted a United States patent in 1994. Employing a balanced gain-stage, distortion and noise are made absolutely symmetrical at the two outputs. The signal is amplified, yet noise and distortion are canceled. The amplifier uses carefully matched components in a balanced "Class A" circuit. This simple circuit contains only two gain stages. A balanced single-ended voltage stage drives a bank of high power MOSFETs, which operate as followers for a minimal amount of feedback around the output stage. The massive reference level amplifier is fully DC coupled with no capacitors in the signal path. The result is a high-frequency smoothness belying its massive solid-state power.

[blackraven]

Mr P, I have my X1 preamp hooked up to the X250 via XLR's. My DAC is not balanced.

I will not limit my choices of my next preamp to just XLR. If I end up with a CJ ET-3se, I won't lament it not having XLR's as long as it sounds better than what I currently have. I have narrowed my choices to the CJ and a BAT. I will pull the trigger in the summer.

[Feanor]

Mr P, I have my X1 preamp hooked up to the X250 via XLR's. My DAC is not balanced.

I will not limit my choices of my next preamp to just XLR. If I end up with a CJ ET-3se, I won't lament it not having XLR's as long as it sounds better than what I currently have. I have narrowed my choices to the CJ and a BAT. I will pull the trigger in the summer.

For what it's worth, I've now had three amps that were tuned particularly for balanced input: (1) Monarchy SM-70 Pro, (2) Class D Audio SDS-258, (note: the CDA series has a different front end and isn't tuned for balanced); (3) Pass X150.5.

I haven't listened to the Pass X150.5 driven single-ended because my ARC LS9 is fully balance and I assume balanced sounds at least as good as SE. However neither the Monarchy nor the SDS sounded significantly better balanced than SE.

[blackraven]

I am contemplating buying the CJ ET-3se preamp after reading reviews and talking to the guys at spearit sound.

http://www.conradjohnson.com/It_just...tereophile.pdf


Conrad Johnson ET3SE Preamplifier ? Reviews | TONEAudio MAGAZINE

Conrad-johnson ET3SE (£4920) - Pre/power amplifiers

Here is a review of the lower priced non se version-

Conrad-Johnson ET3 preamp (Hi-Fi+ 75) | AVguide

The SE version has all the attributes that I am looking for. I think that it will be an excellent match with the X250. The guy at spearit sound said that the ET has great speed and the low end of a SS pre but the midrange and warmth of tubes. He stated the attack is crisp and the sound is detailed.

Now I have to sell my Van Alstine Ultra Plus Hybrid Tube preamp and the X1.

Any one interested in a Pass Labs X1 for $2K or the AVA Ultra Plus for $975

[Feanor]

From what I've read, (not heard, unfortunately), the CJ will be a warmer sound than the AVA. I'd certainly like to the ET3 in my system.

But from your own comments, I think I personally would be fine with the X1, but I'm unable to afford it and, anyway, I'm quite content with my ARC LS9 for now. BTW, I don't recall if your AVA has remote control and/or phono?

I'm skeptical that you will sense any loss going to a single-ended preamp -- at least I'm pretty sure that basic CJ tube sound will be a more significant change than SE vs. balance per se.

I didn't hear much difference going from balanced to SE with either my Monarchy nor Class D Audio amps despite both being optimized for balanced. I haven't gotten around to trying my X150.5 SE as yet.

[Mr Peabody]

LOL, I spaced the X1 and it's the title of the thread. Too bad I still don't have the CT-6. I still think and in my experience the all balanced path is the way to go. I can understand broadening options though. Also, when comparing your XLR to RCA I recommend disconnecting the set not being used at one end. Frenchmon and I were comparing cables and although the difference in sound level was obvious when switching from XLR to RCA we thought the differences in the cables were better detected when one set was disconnected.

Here's an article although dated, 1994, this guy is not for balanced connections but the truths cannot be ignored. Like mixing balanced and non-balanced with some degradation. The thing is Pass is balanced and you bought into that, if wanting RCA type circuits you should sell the Pass.

"All the usual mixing and matching review procedures were useless; it was out of the question to make direct comparisons. I was fought every inch of the way, precisely because these Audio Research components are of true balanced design; ie, fully balanced differential circuitry is present at their every stage, including cross-coupling between hot and cold signal paths. It didn't take me long to realize that you can't mess with true balanced components; "

The same here for Pass, see prior post for explanation of patented Balanced Symmetry.

"For example, take an Audio Research V-series power amp with its balanced input (again, I'm not singling out ARC). In my experience, it won't perform at its best unless it's driven balanced. If you want to hear this amplifier in an unbalanced system, then I strongly advise you to acquire the relevant unbalanced/balanced converter, the Audio Research BL1. Regardless of the latter's exceptional quality, you've added a second set of connectors, cabling, expense, and grounding. "

As stated the article is old so maybe the conversion is better inside the gear these days but it's an expensive bet. IMO I disagree with many of the sound quality negatives listed, both Krell and Pass in one or the other have shown them not to be true. JM thought he had improvements when going with a balanced CDP, I thought I did as well when adding a Krell CDP to my Krell amp but it's hard to say since the player itself was an upgrade. I'm not saying one approach is better or worse, just that mixing is not the optimum approach for a system. I went RCA for a while from SACD to preamp but when going XLR it made a noticeable improvement.
Balance: Benefit or Bluff? | Stereophile.com

[blackraven]

Here's an article although dated, 1994, this guy is not for balanced connections but the truths cannot be ignored. Like mixing balanced and non-balanced with some degradation. The thing is Pass is balanced and you bought into that, if wanting RCA type circuits you should sell the Pass.


A

I think I will keep the X250 unless the heat in the summer is intolerable. Its the best amp that I have heard so far all though the Nuforce model 9se come close. Even with RCA's it sounds great. Now my system is not as revealing as yours. Your speakers cost over 3 times of what I paid for the 1.6's ($1800) and your ML CD player is light years ahead of my DAC. Your X10 preamp is also a step up from mine. So I may not be hearing the full benefits of XLR.


I have heard the Pass with just the XLR's and just RCA's with the X1. I have also heard it with the new AVA FET Valve all tube preamp via RCA's. While there is a slight improvement in sound with XLR's it is not dramatic. The X250 really pairs well with a tube pre. The midrange had more texture, warmth and body with the FET Valve pre but it lost a little resolution. I think that the CJ or BAT preamps will sound better than the FET by a wide margin.

My Magnepans really like a tube preamp. I wish that there was a CJ and BAT dealer here so that I could take one home to try.

[Mr Peabody]

When you are serious Music Direct carries BAT with a return policy and I haven't looked at it but they do have some financing. BAT new is expensive stuff. Spearitsound for CJ allows a return if not satisfied but ask up front and the return is a short window. There's a CJ dealer in Indianapolis but I've not dealt with them.

It's really worth while experimenting with cables as well.