Integrated Amplifier or Receiver?

[brmuchim]

I currently have some relatively old Bang and Olufsen CX-100 speakers and I am looking for a good way to get the best sound quality. I do not know whether or not a receiver would be the best option or an integrated amplifier; strictly looking at costs the amplifiers cost more than the receivers so I assume the amplifiers provide better sound quality?

The amplifiers I've researched were marantz and yamaha, both of which are integrated amplifiers. Any comments are appreciated!

[02audionoob]

It would be quite common for integrated amps to be better than receivers. The most obvious indicator would be the higher prices you've seen, despite not having a tuner. Of course, some receivers are comparatively expensive. The cost of those isn't going to waste. They'll sound good. Which models have you considered? Have you set a budget?

[brmuchim]

Thanks! I've been looking around though, and I saw some sites that claimed that there would be no discernable difference between a receiver and a intergrated amplifier so that's why I came here.

My budget is flexible but I'd like to be under $600-700. I'm considering the Yamaha AX-497integrated amplifier (85w per channel) or the Yamaha A-S700 which costs more but gives 90w per channel (and also looks nicer as well). The Marantz model I am considering if the PM5003 which gives 45w per channel.

[nightflier]

Take a look at the Outlaw Audio RR2150 - it does 100w/160w and has garnered rave reviews. For $699, it's probably the best value out there. Every once in a while Outlaw has specials on it (typically $599), and it sometimes appears on eBay or Audiogon for around $500. Actually, here's one for $525obo:

http://www.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/cls....Retro-Receiver

[02audionoob]

Whether there's a discernible difference depends on various things...such as (a) whether the performance of the components really differs, (b) whether the remainder of your system is up to the challenge, (c) how closely you plan to pay attention to sound quality, (d) the acoustics of your room...you get the idea.

I really like the options you've chosen and I'd take them over the receivers at that price point any day. I also get the idea people like Cambridge Audio pretty well. See an example here:

http://www.spearitsound.com/Cambridg...dio_640av2.asp

I too have an integrated in my primary system...no need to waste a tuner on me...I rarely listen to the radio. One thing to consider...like nightflier mentioned...there's Audiogon. Used gear can get you gear that would've cost twice as much at retail prices.

[blackraven]

Also look at the Onkyo 9555 integrated amp.

http://www.onkyousa.com/model.cfm?cl...ifier&m=A-9555

http://www.google.com/products/catal...m=4#ps-sellers

[brmuchim]

Okay great recommendations! I just went to an audio store this past day and the sales representative, who was an expertise in audio know-how, and he recommended the integrated amps from Rotel and Arcam. How would these compare to the Yamaha (no longer the Marantz because he compared the Arcam to the Marantz integrated amp and the Arcam was a LOT better).

[02audionoob]

I guess the short answer in this case is - The Yamaha is in the Marantz's league, not Arcam's...but which model Arcam did you hear and what was the price?

[brmuchim]

The Arcam model I listened to was the the FMJ-A18 integrated amplifier and it is sold at $999 at Magnolia Audio. The Rotel (I'm assuming it is in the Arcam's range?) is the RX-1052 stereo receiver, not an amplifier so that makes me wonder how well it will compare.

So even the upper-range Yamaha that costs as much as the Arcam will sound not-as-good as the low-end Arcam??

[02audionoob]

I probably oversimplified. There wouldn't necessarily be a predictable and consistent order of which will sound best.

The upper-range Yamaha could very well sound as good as the Arcam. It might even sound better to some people's tastes. You won't know until you try them. Even then it can be difficult to know, unless you can replicate the conditions under which each component is auditioned.

I certainly wouldn't dismiss the Rotel . They do make a pretty good receiver.

One thing I decided I'd add about the Marantz...I would suggest listening to it with the "source direct" setting. That bypasses the tone controls and the balance control, where some sound quality can be lost.

[hifitommy]

buying used from 'gon and if you still need a tuner, go to a pawn shop and get a tuner for a rack system for about $20.

http://buy.audiogon.com/cgia/glb.pl?inta&&actg

that prima luna would be nice if the funds are there but otherwise there are plenty of others. this is a chance to get away form mass market products. check out the shipping weights. that can be a measure of quality.

[JohnMichael]

Also look at the Onkyo 9555 integrated amp.

I agree and the built-in phono stage is good if you want to add a turntable at a later date. The sound is smooth and detailed. The amp is reliable since mine has been used every day for more than a year. I recently moved and the amp is sounding better in the new space. Best $500 audio dollars I have ever spent.

[frahengeo]

I currently have some relatively old Bang and Olufsen CX-100 speakers and I am looking for a good way to get the best sound quality. I do not know whether or not a receiver would be the best option or an integrated amplifier; strictly looking at costs the amplifiers cost more than the receivers so I assume the amplifiers provide better sound quality?

The amplifiers I've researched were marantz and yamaha, both of which are integrated amplifiers. Any comments are appreciated!

If this has already been mentioned, please ignore.

Given a particular brand, you probably will hear a performance difference when comparing different price points. To a certain point, you get what you pay for. In your example, there is a good chance that you may hear a difference. Of course everything else needs to be equal when comparing (e.g. same speakers, same source, etc.)

My opinion: Cheaper Receivers are available for those that do not want to spend a lot on AV gear. Int. Amps are more of a niche market and companies do not carry various models in various prices.

[RGA]

I currently have some relatively old Bang and Olufsen CX-100 speakers and I am looking for a good way to get the best sound quality. I do not know whether or not a receiver would be the best option or an integrated amplifier; strictly looking at costs the amplifiers cost more than the receivers so I assume the amplifiers provide better sound quality?

The amplifiers I've researched were marantz and yamaha, both of which are integrated amplifiers. Any comments are appreciated!

The advice for now is to pay less attention to the products being thrown around - is this better than that - when most people have not directly compared the amps in question and I seriously doubt with your loudspeakers.

Generally speaking an integrated amp will sound better than a receiver at a given price - the reasons should be fairly obvious - there is less parts in an integrated and more money can be spent on those parts - better parts better sound - assuming good design.

Don't get caught up with watts - a quality amplifier may in fact be low in power output and some of the best - contrary to the myths - will not be high current. One of the absolute best integrated amps on the market at $2500 is 25 watts and halves to just 12 watts at 4 ohms. But it has a robust power supply and does not frequency limit - it has far far better bass than the Bryston B100 at 100Watts and 180 watts into 4ohm. The Sugden sounds more powerful - smoother - more organic - real and has beefier deeper bass. The Bryston has a 20 year warranty and watts to sell you but that's about it IMO.

In your budget you'd be far better off going used - for $350-$450 you could get a Sugden A48b which I owned for a while. It is about 65 watts - it's nothing to look at but I can't think of a current $1k integrated amp that sounds better. There are many amps not just Sugden - Creek Audio, Audio Refinement Complete (a little lean in the bass but quite nice) could also likely be had under your budget.

Amps last decades - they're a safe buy used.

And the other poster was correct - that some of these differences may not be appreciated with the speakers and rest of your system - but everyone starts somewhere and if your intention is to build a really nice audiophile caliber system then starting with a used Sugden A48b or the others I mentioned would be a really really fine start on the journey that will let you upgrade around the amplifier.

Most of the current sub $1k amps are quite unremarkable. Consider that the A48b was a $2,000.00 amp back in the late 1980's!

If you are dead set on buying new then this is what I preferred to the Cambridge Audio and NAD, and Arcam amps for similar prices was the Rotel 1062 and the RA 05 which apparently is discontinued. http://www.rotel.com/NA/products/Pro...ails.htm?Id=12

The rotel has a nice advantage that it has a moving magnet phono stage on board should you decide to dive back into vinyl.

Still I would strongly suggest going used because the A48B mops the floor with any of these.

If you really want to get serious about audio - I would give a good look at tube amplifiers.

I reviewed Grant Fidelity's Rita amp which is well out of your budget but the sound on top is up with the big boys and their build quality is far above what you normally see at the price.

Their A-348 I have not listened to enough to comment but the build quality is first rate - a 55lb amplifier for $1kUS - Tube require a bit of a learning curve - but it's not hard - they're a lot more FUN than SS and IMO they sound better. Ian - the owner sometimes posts here and on other forums so if you need advice there's a person - not a switchboard.

It's tough to buy stuff like the Grant Fidelity because they don't have the big names you're used to but to be honest - the better stuff that I have heard over the years tends to be off the beaten track a little bit. It's usually a lot lot better - and for less. $1,000US is their special price right now - and some have said they liked the sound better than the Rita - if true then it's a no brainer - and it looks bloody cool too!

http://grantfidelity.com/site/Grant_...rated_Tube_amp