Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 61
  1. #1
    Forum Regular Mike Anderson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    SF Bay Area, CA
    Posts
    722

    Integrated amp in $2k range for Magnepan 1.6?

    I'm awaiting delivery on a pair of 1.6qr's, and thinking about upgrading my amp (currently a Musical Fidelity A3.2). I'm looking for a 2-channel integrated amp in the $2k-and-under price range (used is great), and would appreciate some recommendations.

    Details:

    My room isn't huge (15'x20'). I listen to a wide variety of stuff, dominated by ambient/electronica for which resolution is very important, but also rock, jazz, and a small amount of classical.

    I'd highly prefer something with a remote control. XLR inputs would be nice too. I don't have a lot of vinyl, so a great phono input isn't a necessity.

    A hybrid with tube preamp would also be nice, but not crucial.

    Thoughts?

    Florian has recommended the Pathos Acoustic One mkII, which fits all of the above criteria, so I plan to audition it once my speakers are broken in.

    Links to good used deals on Audiogon and elsewhere are also appreciated. I saw a Plinuis 9200 for $2300 that's slightly out of my price range, but if i can pick it up for cheaper, is that a good match for the 1.6qr's?

    Thanks,
    Mike
    Last edited by Mike Anderson; 01-01-2006 at 02:06 PM.
    There's an audiophile born every minute. Congratulations; you're right on time.

    FREE RADICAL RADIO: Hours of free, radical MP3s!

  2. #2
    Forum Regular Florian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    2,959
    Manley Stingray, Pathos Acoustics Classic One MKI and MKII, Perfect & Pure Audio CST-80, Jadis Orchestra 6550C
    Lots of music but not enough time for it all

  3. #3
    Forum Regular Mike Anderson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    SF Bay Area, CA
    Posts
    722
    Quote Originally Posted by Florian
    Manley Stingray
    Cool-looking amp, but... no remote control (this is really important to me), no balanced inputs, and for my needs, too many tubes!

    I'd prefer SS power, if possible. I just don't want to have to deal with re-tubing all the time. But if there's a tube-powered amp that has a remote and is particularly well-matched to the 1.6qr's, I'll consider it.
    There's an audiophile born every minute. Congratulations; you're right on time.

    FREE RADICAL RADIO: Hours of free, radical MP3s!

  4. #4
    Forum Regular Mike Anderson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    SF Bay Area, CA
    Posts
    722
    Quote Originally Posted by Florian
    Perfect & Pure Audio CST-80
    Only web pages I can find on this are in German! Got any links for a 'Murican ignoramus like myself?
    There's an audiophile born every minute. Congratulations; you're right on time.

    FREE RADICAL RADIO: Hours of free, radical MP3s!

  5. #5
    Forum Regular Florian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    2,959
    Well i dont know if they have remotes or not, i just recommend on sound ;-) You will be extremely hard pressed to find a SS amp that will beat these guys. Dont worry about retubing, they hold a very long time. They held 5 years on my Pathos.

    -Flo
    Lots of music but not enough time for it all

  6. #6
    Forum Regular Mike Anderson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    SF Bay Area, CA
    Posts
    722
    Jadis Orchestra also has no remote.

    Tubes are a possibility, I'm not ruling them out altogether. But I'm not convinced of the superiority of tubes, frankly. Maybe I'm dead wrong about that I suppose...

    Lord knows I love tubes in guitar amps, and in fact I have dozens of high quality NOS tubes sitting around for that purpose. But in guitar amps you're trying to get the smooth sound of nonlinear distortion that only tubes can provide.

    If we're talking about accurate, distortion-free reproduction, do tubes really offer any advantage over SS?
    There's an audiophile born every minute. Congratulations; you're right on time.

    FREE RADICAL RADIO: Hours of free, radical MP3s!

  7. #7
    Forum Regular Florian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    2,959
    Not all tubes are created equal, you just have to meet the right ones ;-)
    Lots of music but not enough time for it all

  8. #8
    Forum Regular Mike Anderson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    SF Bay Area, CA
    Posts
    722
    Do you know anything about the Plinius 9200? I see a lot of good reviews for it, and a number of people use it with 1.6qrs.
    There's an audiophile born every minute. Congratulations; you're right on time.

    FREE RADICAL RADIO: Hours of free, radical MP3s!

  9. #9
    Forum Regular Florian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    2,959
    I have heard several Plinius in the past and always found them nice, not really my choice but a good choice nonetheless. Personally i find they lack that *extra something. Dont know what really, but something is missing. You should check them out tough, but try some of those i mentioned you might hear what i mean.
    Lots of music but not enough time for it all

  10. #10
    Forum Regular Mike Anderson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    SF Bay Area, CA
    Posts
    722
    A lot of the people at the MUG recommend Bryston w/maggies. I saw a brand new B100 SST go for about $2k on Audiogon, and it looked good. Any thoughts on those?
    There's an audiophile born every minute. Congratulations; you're right on time.

    FREE RADICAL RADIO: Hours of free, radical MP3s!

  11. #11
    Forum Regular Florian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    2,959
    I absolutly hate Bryston and McIntosh on Maggies. They are great on many speakers but a NONONONONONO on Maggies for me. But you might like them, youll never know :-)
    Lots of music but not enough time for it all

  12. #12
    Forum Regular Mike Anderson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    SF Bay Area, CA
    Posts
    722
    Quote Originally Posted by Florian
    I absolutly hate Bryston and McIntosh on Maggies. They are great on many speakers but a NONONONONONO on Maggies for me. But you might like them, youll never know :-)
    Perhaps you can be a little more specific about why you don't like these amps, versus why you like the amps above? That might help me figure out if your tastes gel with mine.

    What kind of music are you listening to? How do you like it to sound? Do you listen to music loud?
    There's an audiophile born every minute. Congratulations; you're right on time.

    FREE RADICAL RADIO: Hours of free, radical MP3s!

  13. #13
    Forum Regular Florian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    2,959
    Well its quite simple. This is what i look for

    1. Very low level resolution
    2. Decay of instruments
    3. Downward dynamic range
    4. Instrumental texture
    5. 3D Rendering and Spatial Information.
    6. Simulation of air and age of instruments
    7. Imaging and staging abilities
    8. Speed and control of drivers
    9. Impadance swings and handling abilities
    10. Matching the input impedance of electronics

    I evalute these electronics on the most neutralest speakers i know (Apogees). The Brystons sound fat and warm with a tendency to please you on Maggies. They are closed in and not as open as the ones i recommend. They portray a bad downward dynamic range just like the Rotel or most other commercial amps. A amplifier has to be fast, deliver tons of current and has to capture all of the information listed above. For me 90% of the amps simply fail at that and the Maggies will show it.

    Here goes my list of good manufactures (i know and like) and none of them should be mentioned with the commercial names most consider good or highend. But remember this is just my opinion and the general public does not agree.

    Manley, Gryphon, Sphinx, Etalon, Vacuumstate, Lamm, Pathos, Silvaweld, Audio Research (below 10), Conrad Johnson (below 8), H2O, Krell (only old /E series), Mark Levinson (old models), Audio Note, Jadis (old Stuff) and some more that i dont remember now

    As you can see i dont list big names and the reason is that they get labeld as High End and have one big deal after the next, but the really good equipment is timeless and you can only find out why if you actually try the equipment and stop reading stupid reviews and listening to the commercial guys with tiny boxes and resonating cabinets who praise the digital world and throw you one glowing review after the next infront of your nose.

    LISTEN to the rarest ones

    PS: Its not a particular TECHNOLOGY (in my opinion nothing happend in the last 20 years) but there is simple good stuff out there and the food for the masses. Dont be with the masses.
    Lots of music but not enough time for it all

  14. #14
    Forum Regular Mike Anderson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    SF Bay Area, CA
    Posts
    722
    So far my research makes the Classic One look really good -- of the amps in this price range, it has just what I want - balanced inputs, remotes, tube preamp, good sound.

    But my local dealer only has the Classic One MkI in stock; I really want to audtition the MkII, but I don't know if anybody around here has one.

    The salesman really seemed taken aback that I wanted to pair the Classic One with 1.6QRs, and he swore up and down it'd be a really bad combination. (Of course he wanted to sell me the Logos, or a Conrad Johnson pre-amp for $2,800 to run into my Musical Fidelity, which doesn't have direct ins...)

    I might have to take a chance and buy a used one sight-unseen. I can always sell it back, but it would be a hassle.

    Florian, are you sure about this combo? Do you like to listen to music LOUD? I want to be able to turn it up without clipping, is the Classic One really going to be able to do the job with Maggies???
    There's an audiophile born every minute. Congratulations; you're right on time.

    FREE RADICAL RADIO: Hours of free, radical MP3s!

  15. #15
    Forum Regular Florian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    2,959
    The Pathos Acoustics Classic One is definetly up for the task regardless of what the dealer says. Of course he recommends you the Logos wich is twice as much. The Classic One can even drive my DIVA to aprox 100db, and if you know what 100db really means than you know that the Maggie wont do that either. Trust me on this, its a wonderfull match and i still own the little Pathos personally.

    -Flo
    Last edited by Florian; 01-02-2006 at 01:44 PM.
    Lots of music but not enough time for it all

  16. #16
    Forum Regular Mike Anderson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    SF Bay Area, CA
    Posts
    722
    ^^ OK, I think I'm going to pull the trigger and see if I can get a good price on a used one. If it doesn't work out, I'll be able to get my money back anyway.

    If I really like it, you're my best friend in the world; but if I don't I'm never listening to you again!

    I love the idea of running a Benchmark DAC1 with balanced outputs into the Classic One.

    The salesman also claimed the MkII did NOT have balanced circuitry, but as nearly as I can tell it does. He also couldn't tell whether the demo unit they had was a MkI or MkII (I could easily tell it was a MkI).

    In retrospect I should have asked him if he'd ever actually run the amp into 1.6QRs, I'm sure he'd have been forced to say "well ummm no".

    Criminy I hate high-$$ salesmen... The last time I went car shopping it was like pulling teeth to get what I went in for...
    There's an audiophile born every minute. Congratulations; you're right on time.

    FREE RADICAL RADIO: Hours of free, radical MP3s!

  17. #17
    Forum Regular Florian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    2,959
    Well you found the path to great speakers all by yourself so i am pretty save
    Get that Pathos and use some good cables with it with a low resistance. Its a true "Flo class A" musical amp and one of the finest matches with Maggies.

    -Flo
    Lots of music but not enough time for it all

  18. #18
    It's just a hobby
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    London, UK
    Posts
    808
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Anderson
    So far my research makes the Classic One look really good -- of the amps in this price range, it has just what I want - balanced inputs, remotes, tube preamp, good sound.

    But my local dealer only has the Classic One MkI in stock; I really want to audtition the MkII, but I don't know if anybody around here has one.

    The salesman really seemed taken aback that I wanted to pair the Classic One with 1.6QRs, and he swore up and down it'd be a really bad combination. (Of course he wanted to sell me the Logos, or a Conrad Johnson pre-amp for $2,800 to run into my Musical Fidelity, which doesn't have direct ins...)

    I might have to take a chance and buy a used one sight-unseen. I can always sell it back, but it would be a hassle.

    Florian, are you sure about this combo? Do you like to listen to music LOUD? I want to be able to turn it up without clipping, is the Classic One really going to be able to do the job with Maggies???
    First only the MKII is worth getting and MKI is no longer being made and has not been for while > 2 years, so I am rather surprised that your dealer claims to have one in stock. The Classic has soft bass and in that area, the Logos may outperform it, however the Classic is lively and open sounding amplifier, whose limitations become readily apparent with bass-heavy music or speakers that demand grunt in the low-end, also will the treble and bass balance be to your taste, Florian likes it, will you? I will suggest you listen to the Pathos if you have the opportunity because as I wrote many moons ago (probably over two years ago), it sounds great but it was handily outperformed in certain areas by other amplifiers at the time.
    It's a listening test, you do not need to see it to listen to it!

  19. #19
    Forum Regular Mike Anderson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    SF Bay Area, CA
    Posts
    722
    Quote Originally Posted by theaudiohobby
    First only the MKII is worth getting and MKI is no longer being made and has not been for while > 2 years, so I am rather surprised that your dealer claims to have one in stock. The Classic has soft bass and in that area, the Logos may outperform it, however the Classic is lively and open sounding amplifier, whose limitations become readily apparent with bass-heavy music or speakers that demand grunt in the low-end, also will the treble and bass balance be to your taste, Florian likes it, will you? I will suggest you listen to the Pathos if you have the opportunity because as I wrote many moons ago (probably over two years ago), it sounds great but it was handily outperformed in certain areas by other amplifiers at the time.
    I know about the soft bass, but if necessary, i have a subwoofer (though I'd kind of like to sell it).

    Believe me, I'd love to spring for a Pathos, but I just don't have the money at this point.
    There's an audiophile born every minute. Congratulations; you're right on time.

    FREE RADICAL RADIO: Hours of free, radical MP3s!

  20. #20
    Forum Regular Florian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    2,959
    The Pathos definetly doesnt have soft bass on the Maggies and does have enough punch, but you should expect real musical bass and not the typical in your face boom me out of the room box bass. But i know that you will like it, we planar guys all feel alike in the major terms.
    Lots of music but not enough time for it all

  21. #21
    Forum Regular Mike Anderson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    SF Bay Area, CA
    Posts
    722
    ^^ I sort of get that sense.

    What I'm looking for is resolution, detail, realism, and musicality.

    A lot of people told me my MMGs would have crappy bass, but they sound better than I thought (flat down to about 60-55hz), so I've learned to take advice with a grain of salt. Everybody has different tastes. Also, my room may be conducive to good bass I suppose.
    There's an audiophile born every minute. Congratulations; you're right on time.

    FREE RADICAL RADIO: Hours of free, radical MP3s!

  22. #22
    Forum Regular Florian's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    2,959
    The 1.6 will do 30 to 35 on normal listening levels. But they will do it with the right balance and dipole bass is dipole bass. Enough said! You will love the Pathos, i can guarantee it. if you were close to me i would let you borrow the Pathos to try.

    -Flo
    Lots of music but not enough time for it all

  23. #23
    Forum Regular Mike Anderson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    SF Bay Area, CA
    Posts
    722
    What kind of cables should I be looking at? I need XLR cables to go between the DAC1 and the Pathos, and speaker cables obviously. I don't even know what I have now (some 14 gauge stuff they sold me at the audiophile store) -- I always figured it doesn't make much difference unless you're going > 20 ft or so (and I'm not).
    There's an audiophile born every minute. Congratulations; you're right on time.

    FREE RADICAL RADIO: Hours of free, radical MP3s!

  24. #24
    It's just a hobby
    Join Date
    Oct 2004
    Location
    London, UK
    Posts
    808
    Quote Originally Posted by Mike Anderson
    I know about the soft bass, but if necessary, i have a subwoofer (though I'd kind of like to sell it).

    Believe me, I'd love to spring for a Pathos, but I just don't have the money at this point.
    Then you better listen to the Classic first, because I listen to it on at least 3 speakers and against other amplifiers, one which I still own, so I KNOW that it has a BIG weakness in the bass, I do not mean bass depth but clarity, definition and kick, this weakness heartily spotlighted by the TT. There are other sonic features of it that are to taste, I like it, but will you? If you plumb for the Classic MKII, I suggest you keep the subwoofer around, you will probably need it after the initial excitement wears out.
    Last edited by theaudiohobby; 01-02-2006 at 04:58 PM. Reason: Further information...
    It's a listening test, you do not need to see it to listen to it!

  25. #25
    Forum Regular Mike Anderson's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    SF Bay Area, CA
    Posts
    722
    Florian,

    Did you experiment a lot with different tubes in the Classic One? If so, what did you find best?
    There's an audiophile born every minute. Congratulations; you're right on time.

    FREE RADICAL RADIO: Hours of free, radical MP3s!

Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 LastLast

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •